176

(268 replies, posted in General discussion)

Arga wrote:

I do think it would not have become an issue if there was SOMETHING else in the game to use bots on. Most corps understand that NIC itself is useless, so would rather have used the resources to build bots to attack/defend with than to build'n-bash.

I take it you mean more PvE options, and a more diverse range of PvP options?

Also, I wouldn't underestimate the lure of virtual currencies. One of the major goals in the game for many people is to accumulate wealth...even if there isn't anything "real" to spend it on.

177

(268 replies, posted in General discussion)

This thread reminds me of this clip

Edit: @Dont do a weed, thanks, I didn't realise you could do that smile

178

(268 replies, posted in General discussion)

Dromsex wrote:

No, of course not LA. You used the insurance in an unintended way. There doesnt need to be a law against this ;D These ingame/eula rules are not there for legal reasons but to ease up the process - but of course they are not needed in a game...

They should have banned you all right away - hopefully this will still come.

Don't be silly. I read somewhere that field containers for mining were considered a "soft exploit" i.e. a game mechanic used in a way not originally intended by the devs (source). Does this mean people who use field containers should be banned?

179

(268 replies, posted in General discussion)

So basically the devs were warned, extensively, before they even implemented insurance, that this would happen. They ignored that. It happened for months. They ignored that.

Then suddenly they retroactively declared it an exploit, acted as if use of insurance to make NIC was a surprise to them, and removed NIC from the game in an attempt to compensate.

They did not do a sufficiently in-depth investigation to understand which characters and accounts benefited from this and removed NIC from players who had not been involved. Then they posted an incomplete list of corps involved.

Very unprofessional, and very badly handled.

I hope they get better at community management in future.

When you deploy from a station you have two conditions - protection and a molecular insability timer.

If you move or activate any modules you will lose your protection, but not your molecular instability.

This will allow players to kill you, even though you cannot dock. Also, your protection runs out a few seconds before your molecular instability, so there is a small window when players with enough fire power can alpha strike you before you dock again.

Container wrote:

Not sure you are getting the point.

Of course I get the point.

But this sentiment I disagree with:

Container wrote:

The problem is that mech/heavy mech users, which is 50% of the bot types in the game are useless for roaming, which is a lively, casual-friendly and fun part of the game.

The solution is that more different types of pvp get added, not that mechs get re-balanced.

And this bit I seriously disagree with:

Container wrote:

Mechs/Heavy mechs should be better at some activities and worse at other activities, but it should be VIABLE at all activities.

We're going round in circles now, just repeating arguments already made, so I'm going to stop posting in this thread until something new comes up.

Edit: I remember a discussion on TS before Christmas I think it was, where some of the guys who've been in the beta a long time (Alex? Dread? someone like that) discussed how the whole server were racing for mechs, and they predicted that some people would be disappinted in them not being an instant I-WIN button, that those people wouldn't appreciate what roles they were useful in, and that complaints would be made about the EP/material cost of mechs rendering them not worthwhile. Well. You called it.

/signed to all

Edit: also being able to place waypoints anywhere on the map instead of just your current location

Container wrote:

Except this is an MMO, the type of game, people play to feel sustained progress.
They mined and trained EP for a better bot than those who did not.

I dislike games where the mechanics are stacked so that your time playing virtually guarantees you a victory, irrespective of how you play and what choices you make along the way.

In Perpetuum, you've already got vets having an advantage over newbs with time-based EP. But you want to make it worse?

If the devs suddenly gave us more mechanics for pvp that included mechs, instead of rebalancing mechs, would you be satisfied that your complaints had been addressed?

DEV Zoom wrote:

noted (#3197 #3198)

Glad to see.

/signed, for the record

Container wrote:

I am sure DEVs are aware that Norhoop players tend to be the mass of average MMO gamers with average MMO player concerns.  Your cheerful working adult/family person who wants a good MMO to play in his/her spare time.  What drives us is fun.

On this point...do you think that roams should be the "end game" pvp for casual players? Aren't these players choosing to play Perpetuum rather than, for example, e-sports like Counterstrike, or theme parks like Wow precisely because the pvp here has a deeper meaning to it? The rivalries that spring up between guilds, the opportunities for conquest and control...all these provide a framework that casual players can appreciate just as much as hardcore min/maxers.

And surely the point of alliances like Norhoop is to provide a vehicle for the casual player to engage in this kind of activity, without having to adopt the "srs bsnss" attitude demonstrated by Infestation?

Edit: not trying to drag this thread off-topic to a discussion about alliances, just trying to make the point that territory control is, and should be, a large part of the pvp for all players, and currently the game mechanics around this are limited.

Container wrote:

In the mech game genre, it is the mech that should be central.
Say Mech to anyone and that is the image they will have is a large, two legged anthromorphic robot with big guns.
That is the attraction that originally brought people in to play.
NOT metal spiders, not assault bots, those are the sideshows, the french fries.
Mechs are the main course and you must make them central or lose the appeal of the genre.

I feel you have this the wrong way round.

You're saying "99% of the pvp in this game are roams. Therefore roams should use mechs."

It ought to be "99% of the pvp in this game are roams. More different kinds of pvp should be introduced that favour mechs."

I also think a strong focus of pvp should be player owned structures, which heavies and mechs would be more suited for, namely attacking or defending your home. Right now we are treating outposts and intrusions as a substitute for POSes and territory control respectively.

Light/ewar bot roams are fine for small, fast, daily pvp.

The problem is not the balance of different bot types, but the lack of things to fight over in game. And the reason we're still subbed is because we believe all that is still to come.

187

(26 replies, posted in General discussion)

It's because half the server was sitting under an Infestation outpost earlier this evening.

188

(55 replies, posted in General discussion)

Neoxx wrote:
Annihilator wrote:

please remember, those codes have a date of expiry

Thanks for the reminder!  I'll get this underway asap.

Get the hell out of minecraft already.

PERPETUUM > MINECRAFT

Ben Musso wrote:

*edit* Please refrain from offensive comments. - DEV Client

I read that he agrees, it's very hard to make money on newbie characters. Possible, but difficult.

Ben Musso wrote:

Sure, your main supplies your alt with NIC etc to buy T4 equipment. Sure all new and potential accounts have the luxury of that.

From his post, it's not an alt he's feeding NIC, but a new character played as it if is solo.

That is the crucial point of it all. I love NIC like the next guy but I also want the game to grow. Having a decrease in payout ( Reward + kernel ) and an increase in what I need to pay to actually get the missions done ... not balanced. Just a gap opening and widening.

Before we were complaining that beta islands didn't offer enough reward for the effort required to hold them. Corps went to beta islands mainly for the e-peen...that's been readdressed now. Possibly a little to far the other way.

190

(17 replies, posted in General discussion)

Alexadar wrote:

Noralgis incubators must have more armor.

This has kind of already been said...but once your plants are found, you've already lost them. The only way to protect plants is to hide them and hope no-one else comes across them. Therefore an armour bonus wouldn't help.

I don't feel qualified to comment on the rarity of T4 items because I'm not directly involved in production, but my grind to pvp ratio is acceptable.

Purgatory wrote:

It was 10 mill a day to mine or npc. I did try to get the offer again but was refused, not for that price anyway, decided it wasn't worth paying more for what I wanted it for.

Yeah sorry that didn't work out for you. That's the kind of sandboxy thing I think solo players ought to be able to do.

Annihilator wrote:

you know, thats one of the reasons why everything is done in blobs?
Its kinda contradicting that you want to have small group engagements for your so loved PvP roaming,
but on the other hand, you dont want small group/solo PvE Content.

Read his OP - he's asking for solo content, not small group pve. Big difference.

Now if he'd said "this change makes it impossible for a group of alpha island PvEers to go over to beta islands and farm mobs" I might be a bit more sympathetic.

I don't support ideas that encourage completely self-dependent solo play.

If the average player wants to go on beta islands, they should be able to hire people to protect them, or pay the controlling corp for a license to farm NPCs there. Aren't you the guy who was paying 10m NIC/day to mine on beta? Why can't you make a similar arrangement?

I think that's how it should work, although not sure if the game is set up well enough for that behaviour to emerge on a regular basis.

194

(21 replies, posted in General discussion)

Some of these posts seem to think that an industrial character has too limited a role in PvP.

...??

It's a matter of choices.

You can't choose an industry spec and expect to be optimised for combat. If that were the case, the whole idea of specialisation would be useless. I actually think the balance is right. As other people have already suggested, you can take an industrial character and give it a support role in pvp.

But if you really care that much about having a pvp character...get a second account? For the majority of people the subscription cost is negligible.

Seamus OKeefe wrote:

I like the idea of the npc factions making a 'push' to retake strategic points what are being contested by players to add a wild card element to battles.

I personally dislike PvPvE. I didn't like it in WAR, it was one of the things that made me quit the game. It was one of the reasons I never bothered with Aion. If you pvp against other players, you want it to be them vs you. You don't want it suddenly to turn into a pve outing, or have random mobs running in and affecting the outcome...that would be RNG at it's worst.

As far as the OP is concerned, I like to have something to fight over, whether it be portions of territory, resources, structures, anything.

196

(7 replies, posted in Open discussion)

Edgar Magnus wrote:

Part 2. I would like to see once, perhaps as an experiment, a release of a game with two different systems on different world instances, a truly separate PVP and PVE skill system, from planning to release. No change to one system affects the other, Ever.

Guild Wars did this...after years of balancing they eventually gave up on having the same skills in PvE and PvP and introduced 2 different versions of some of the skills. In a pvp area the skill did one thing, in a PvE area it had a slightly different effect. That way, none of the nerfs that were PvP related affected the PvE and vice versa.

But...why do you need this on separate world instances/servers? That seems completely unecessary if you want a one-world game.

I can think of several mechanics where this could happen. For instance, you could introduce mob-specific resistances and damage types. In order to PvE players need to use skill chains and equipment that maximise the damage type the mob is least resistant against. Those damage types don't affect players. Instead, you introduce a completely different sub-set of damage type for PvP, all of which use different skills. It could be a very different set up, with more kinds of skills that work against human intellence instead of AI.

The main issue with pvp vs pve is in the healing...you want 1 or 2 healers to be able to heal through multiple mob damage for 6 people. But in pvp you don't want 1 healer so powerful that 1 other player has no chance of killing him. I think one way to do this would to make PvE damag/healing largely dot/hot based, and stacking, whereas PvP could be based more around burst damage and burst healing.

You could also write up some lore to accomodate this...for instance mobs could be aliens, or demons, or spirits that are vulnerable to specific biological, radioactive or spiritual types of damage whereas default weapon damage is vs humans/player races used for pvp.


Edgar Magnus wrote:

The PVE system, of course, has its standard tank, healer, dps dynamic with the option of the usual hybrids with the chance to develop on its own as time goes on.

It doesn't have to. I want to write more about this but I gots work to do.

Also, shouldn't this be in off-topic?

197

(55 replies, posted in General discussion)

Check your PMs on the infestation forums. I sent them on Sunday but sent them again today.

198

(55 replies, posted in General discussion)

Jasdemi wrote:

I won't give you my code, if you let MMORPG.com do the job. This tainted community is filled with *** 12 years old american kids. 50% fanboys, 50% trolls.

Massively.com is the way to go.

mmorpg.com forums have...issues. But a lot of people visit the site and rarely bother with the forums at all. They just check out the news sections and the features. And browse despondently up and down the games list wishing there were more pvp and sandbox filter options.

Neoxx, I don't know if this is possible, but it would be great to get this in their Monday newsletter. Would the promotion be advertised on their front page?

I am happy for my name to be given as a beneficiary, and any grateful recipients may express their gratitude by performing services such as housework, serving drinks and peeling grapes. Must provide own grapes.

199

(9 replies, posted in Q & A)

I think they're trying to set up a wild west frontier. Agree that the lore could do with a bit of tweaking.

Yeah. This pro gamer pulled the windows key right off.