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You have to sit there as long as the person who terraformed it the first time. If it's empty, then why bother trying to get through it in the first place.
MMO = massively multiplayer online game
If it's empty, and walled off. Then there is no point trying to get in. Given that it will take you - as long as the first person can be bothered - to get in, by the time you get in, it will be empty or there will be an overwhelming force sitting on the other side. Again this is all perfectly fine if you never want to see any pvp on your island. As a side effect it would create a very exciting earth shooting mechanic in addition to the current wall shooting mechanic.
When the game mechanics prevent it from doing so, because someone posts in the forums that terraforming shouldn't be able to build fortresses.
Which "game mechanics" exactly are you talking about here?
Then they live in peace, and the rest of the server does its thing without them. By your definition, they're islotated and irrelevant anyway.
No, they are isolated from pvp competition, they are not isolated from the market as you can transfer resources through a solid wall using a can. You know that very well so don't play dumb.
Edit: I am amazed you can't see that what you are suggesting would, if not kill the game, make it so there is so little competition between players (in pvp or on the maket) that it would esentially become a single player game.
+1 for being able to shoot cans open (on beta).
Arga wrote:@Kal
Because anyone can terraform, it's impossible to create any landscape that can't 'evenutally' be made passable again.
If the fortress has no players defending it, a lone symbiot can lower the drawbridge.
So how long would you have to sit there, in a symbiont, locking up a pile of dirt just so you could get to an empty labyrinth on the other side? Also, how many people would you expect to play a game like that?
Arga wrote:Conceptually, a smaller fortified force should be able to repell a larger attacking force, which is exactly what defenses are supposed to provide. If TF, walls, and any other deployables don't provide any defensive benefit, then they have failed in that purpose.
How could terraforming possibly not provide an advantage for the defender?
Arga wrote:The only way to live in isolation, is if the rest of the server allows them to.
Why would they not? What would they possibly have to gain from having their drawbridging symbiont move piles of dirt which would be put back in place while they sleep?
Hmm I am a programming noob but isn't sharing the whole point of having an API?
We are still in the dark with regards to how the whole impenetrable fortress issue is gonna be delt with on gamma. Are just gonna be able to build impassible cliffs/plateaus and live in isolation?
But yes, much more space is needed imo.
Hokk alliance shows up to a Darnachov intrusion 21/2/12.
The defenders are outgunned but hold their ground. Battle ensues.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhujdycDPgI
Sounds like a cool video Ville, can we see it?
Im not trolling btw, this game needs all the promotion it can get.
In my opinion the only way to really discourage multiboxing is to make players do tasks that a simple macro would have trouble with. That would however require substantial gameplay changes. You would have to replace processes such as mining and harvesting with some sort of minigame. Support bots would have to be made non-capstable or the mechanic would need to be changed altogether (yeah i know we are not gonna see any of this ever).
Alternatively you could make deployable modules to carry out all the borring repetative tasks but again it would be a very different looking game.
Getting rid of 100% safe gate scouting would be helpful imo (although in these days of walls a fortress only needs one detector).
I have a better idea. How about we come up with game mechanics that provide financial incentive for pvp and forget about the tettris like scoreboards. That way there will be a point to pvp other than getting on the killboard. The pve rewards are already there in the forms of rare items and your wallet_and_wall "size".
Last Initia outpost intrusion was 11:28 on the 17th.
It is now 13:10 on the 18th.
Please let people know if theres an intensional SAP time reset incoming.
Ewar on killmails anyday? I know you said its hard but so's terraforming (and yes I would rather have ewar on KMs 1st).
I want a button that replaces Jasdemi with white noise (preferably the whole eve alliance).
Join 62nd, come live with us on our island 
Because I have better things to do with my time. Like post on these forums!
+1
Watching the unintended consequences may be fun 
Annihilator wrote:Kaldenines wrote:This isn't about Kentagura. Its about removing walls from the game because the mechanic makes for a lot of dull gameplay.
so you say the game should never introduce base building and terraforming? only static prebuilt terrain, more or less carefully shaped by the hand of a DEV or helper - or else its getting dull because player would use those features to prevent you from your currently fav. way to play the game?
Spot on! Base building or terraforming should not be introduced on the current beta islands except in a very limited capacity. The current beta islands don't have enough actual space. Large portions are either near an outpost, near a teleport or near a spawn. Most of the rest of it is hand crafted terrain with choke points. Its too easy to block off huge sections of the island making it so that anyone approaching will be detected before they can break through enough walls to get the juicy middle bit. Forget the mess that is Kentagura for a second and take a look at Brightstone where walls were used sensibly to make for a huge safe mining area. Similar things are going on near Uria and other outposts. PvP seems consigned to intrusions, station/teleport games and pre-arranged fights (consensual pvp). Im not saying that it was great before walls but walls are sure as hell not making it better.
This isn't about Kentagura. Its about removing walls from the game because the mechanic makes for a lot of dull gameplay.
DEV Zoom wrote:Walls don't have an owner, so we can't simply reimburse those who ask for it. It would be only possible if we removed ALL deployed walls from every island, but I very much doubt everyone would agree with that.
Maintenance is now a massive time sink as well as a small NIC sink.
This is true, and we are currently working on an idea to reverse that ratio, making it more of a NIC sink and less of a time sink. The idea is a new deployable wall maintenance device, which will repair walls in a fixed radius. However the device can only repair a fixed amount of overall HP, so if there are many damaged walls in its effect radius, it will deplete its reserves faster and you will possibly need to deploy more of it to fully repair all the walls. The device will have a relatively short lifetime during which it performs its work, so it will only provide a lockable target for enemies for that time.
We will also make two other changes in the next patch affecting walls:
1. Interference emitter modules will have a LOS check for deployment.
2. Walls will only start to decay in their last few growth phases.
+1 to removing walls and reimbursing the NIC cost. I suggest this simply on the basis of what I think is good for the game in the longer run. Perhaps you can rethink what restrictions walls should have on beta and then reintroduce the feature or perhaps do it later on gamma only?
"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." -- Bill Cosby
It seems you pleased a guy in TOG who only now discovered that you can have fun on beta (welcome to the game, why did you think so many were playing it and living on beta before?) and pissed off just about everybody else. Perhaps its time to stop throwing good development time after bad and reconsider how this wall feature should work (I know you guys have limited resources but you are turning your live server into a beta test).
Imo before implementing anything as significant as PBS the devs should let players try it out on a test server. A lot of people are getting tiered of paying (both in and out of game) for the privilege of being beta testers.
+1 to harvesting walls for some kind of material.
Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:DEV Zoom wrote:Unfortunately the idea could be very well turned against you as well.
1. Scan for logged off robot.
2. Build walls around that tile.
3. Victim logs back, drama ensues.
i fail to see a problem with this??? 
Don't give away my master plan. Besides this is possible already and can also be easily countered by carrying a mobile TP which any competent logoffskier should do.
Seriously though, what is the dev's policy with regard to log on traps? Cause I see no other way of killing a miner on beta unless they fail considerably or get disconnected or something.
I remember this being an EULA related issue at some point in another game.
Tux wrote:Why not just go mine on alpha .. ideas like this are what is turning this game into a kiddy fun park. .
Death is a natural part of any life cycle deal with it and stop trying to make the DEV's make this game unplayable..
-100
Don't be so upset. Its a reason to build more walls! Thats what the game is about isn't it? None of that kiddy running around in robots shooting people crap.
Could you elaborate as to what the best thing about walls was? I didn't understand that part.
nm i think i fell for a troll.
Someone explained to me today that its probably to do with rounding errors.
Thats actually pretty cool. lol at them including the minecraft universe, i wonder where the eve universe would be on that scale.
Idea:
1) When bots log off on the terrain they should leave a mark similar (but distinct from) the one left by activating a scanning charge.
2) You should be able to use artifact scanning charges to identify a site where a bot is logged off.
Now that walls prevent roaming gangs from catching miners, login traps are gonna become much more common. While I hate what walls have done to pvp in the game, I dont want logging in and out of the game to become the new roaming. I dont think that going offline should become an integral part of playing the game.
(edit fixed typos)
Well thats why the original idea is to have a single facility that needs occasional refuling (not daily, unless you cant afford the fuel).
The problem with the way things are now is that after a few days we have one island which is effectively a corridor. Whats beta gonna look like in two-three months time?
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