26

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

Celebro wrote:
Arga wrote:

To be exact here, Perp is a 2D ground based combat system and TF is 3D. Unless or until we get 3D combat, devs are going to have to limit TF to work with the 2D mechanics.

You should have said that 2 Years ago. big_smile

What, and miss out on 1000's of gamma related posts!?!?

My subscription runs out this week, trying to drop a few gems on the way out.

27

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

Delcimus wrote:

Please tell me where in this game, and in life, where landscape is not used for LOS defense?
The problem is with wide opened terraforming, of course its the de facto defense.

With limits, like the -50 to +50, you are limited to what you can terraform. And you then have a reason to place wall structures on top of a terraced base for additional LOS defense. This SEVERLY limits how radically you can change the landscape, invalidates most of the common teleport walls we have today, and still allows siege cover terraforming. With pretty much using the same mechanics currently in game. A minimal fix with a huge impact on how things go forward.

There is a difference between using TF to create LOS defense and using TF to create walls and barriers; and not just 'barriers' but impassable barriers.

The +/- 50 doesn't stop using TF to create impassable barriers. I don't care if the US army uses bulldozers in real life, this is a game and the mechanics need to be balanced within the confines of the other existing mechanics.

To be exact here, Perp is a 2D ground based combat system and TF is 3D. Unless or until we get 3D combat, devs are going to have to limit TF to work with the 2D mechanics.

Cassius wrote:

Just not sure SpT is needed since you guys kinda blew out the whole "SpT enabled power projection" forum argument since you took back all the Betas and a few Gammas, when your numbers returned, DESPITE the change not being implemented.

This is exactly why it's still needed. It wasn't about STC having too much power, simply the fact that any corp/alliance with 'numbers' would be too powerful to stop.

29

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

Cassius wrote:

Ronon suggested this, allow terraforming from original island shape in a range of -50m  to + 50m
(and none near teleports)

This would allow some sheer walls no higher at any point than 100 m, would make players have to find suitable places on the landscape to actually build a decent base, would make higher areas terraced type of landscaping and more preferable for defense, and allow vastly different types of bases on each of the 3 races island types.

Kinda like how things work in the real world.

I dont think the beacon terraformers were the main problem, just how we were allowed to use them.

This doesn't solve the the issue as it has evolved, which is players shouldn't be using TF as a mainline defense. Hence the slope limited to always allow light/assaults.

30

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

If a slope exceeds the limit, naturally, but you are using beacons to change flatten it, the system needs to allow a TF operation on the tile even though it's outside of the limits.

Inda wrote:

I started to thinking make a new corporation,
try to help alfa players and try to make a 3rd faction ingame
any advice to me? (seriously)

Those two goals, while not mutually exclusive, are counter-productive.

PIE was an alpha gathering/production corp, of which I was CEO, and CIR is a PVP faction corp where I am (now on standy) an officer. So I have experience with both of the goals you are trying to acheive.

The culture of a corporation is significant in determining how it's players impact Perp and the game flow of Nia. If you start a corp with a focus on Alpha, then you're putting less priority on PVP, beta, and building gamma bases. And the reverse is true.

So, my advice is to choose one of those two goals and focus on that, if you try to do both you're focus will be too spread out and you won't acheive either.

Edit: Oops, this is Lemons AMA : )  So rephrase this as a question to Lemon if he agrees or not, for form.

32

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

Burial wrote:

I don't like the idea either if anyone cares. There's tens of good locations on every single gamma for a base.


I did ALOT of single tile TF on the test server. It's going to be expensive and labor intensive to setup bases, having a couple of 'free' sites doesn't hurt corps that want to expend the effort.

Although, it may make more sense to have these flat areas in more 'open' locations and save the more defensable areas for manual TF.

33

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

DEV Zoom wrote:
Arga wrote:

Any thoughts on just having 'fixed' flat locations preTF'd on each Island?

Problems that come to my mind with that:

1. You would still need terraforming to get there. Otherwise we would have to redesign every gamma island because there are some where you can't even go very far from the teleport even.
2. There is no way to predict the size of the networks people would build even with the new building limits.
3. We don't want to abandon terraforming completely if there is a way.

I was more thinking that they would be away to limit the impact of single tile. Corps could flatten elsewhere, but there would be these 2 or 3 'ideal' spots.

DEV Zoom wrote:

Anyway, this topic can be concluded that we won't do the instant terrain locking. Yet. I still have a feeling that you will want it sooner or later. Testing will decide I guess.

All the miners just cried a single tear.

Not being able to instant lock isn't going to have any immediate effect either way, so this seems like the right decision to make now.

Thanks for bringing it up first, and now that we know it's an option, after gamma is changed we can see if there's a reason to make an arguement for the change.

Burial wrote:

Correct, and I have a feeling missile turrets would still be a problem.

On the flip-side, the turrets are also going to have a range/angle component too, because to get them high enough to shoot over walls they are going to need to be further back.

36

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

Any thoughts on just having 'fixed' flat locations preTF'd on each Island?

DEV Zoom wrote:

Arga: it could create a "LOS bunker", but obviously only over a much larger area (because of the slope limitations), which wouldn't be practical as a "blitz" strategy.

Yep, that's what I meant by effectiveness not worth the time.

Someone mentioned turrets have a higher aim point, which would mean the bunker would have to be bigger then if just LOS'ing bots too I believe.

Taking into account TF can no longer create impassable terrain for light/assult, I see only 1 need for offensive TF.

Make a few cycles per tile to create mech/Hmech passable terrain.

TF can be used to create a small LOS bunker, but because it can't go beyond light/assault, it's effectiveness is probably not going to be worth the time.

So, a defensive force isn't going to need to sit behind the wall of mordor and delay an offensive force's push to open a door.

All the attacker will need to do is bring a few assaults, which will be able to make direct contact with the Ewar: and/or counter EW.

39

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

It's a nerf, nerfs aren't meant to be comparable.

The difference between walls and TF is walls degrade, so getting those charges would only provide a temporary boost.

I'm trying to compromise, since it's unlikely that the devs have any desire to do reimurbsement of the consumable charges at all.

40

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

Since Terraforming is being removed as the first line of defense, it doesn't make sense to reimburse TF consumables since their use will be limited. This is doubly true if beacon TF is removed until a better system can be developed.

The purpose of the change is to encourage use of walls instead of TF, so look at encouraging their use by providing something like 1 wall complier charge for every 4 TF charges used in the last 6 months.

41

(235 replies, posted in Balancing)

I think Merkle is on the right track.

With a looming time deadline of Steam release, the most effective thing to do at this point is:

* Reset Gamma
* Remove beacon TF
* Devs Create (3) flat 'base' areas on each gamma island with 2 'natural' impassable sides per base.
     Note: 3 is better than 2, it may not mean that 3 sides will settle there, but it leaves it as a possiblity.

- Details follow

Inda wrote:

Oh good to you Arga, what was that can you tell us?

This was before kickstarter, it never made it out of the design process, but think Second-life with dynamic content, fixed resource engine and a market AI.

Is the author of that blog a professional MMO designer or is he just a guy that's played alot of eve?

I worked full time for 8 months on an MMO design as a 'novice' and barely scratched the surface of the complexity of the interaction of game mechanics. Publishing an article doesn't mean this guy knows anything about how to actually make Eve on the ground work.

44

(163 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

I understand wanting this game to succeed Aaron, you're not alone in this, but if the Perp truely had nothing to lose it would benefit more from a full reset than an EP change; but while Perp is certainly on the rocks it's not currently at the place where it has nothing to lose. Check back after Steam launch.

45

(163 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Your taking it too personally. An emotional plea simply means that you're not using logic to form your arguement.

Please feel free to clarify what 'Nothing to lose' means in your own words than.

46

(163 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Mongolia Jones wrote:

Aaron,

Regardless of the amount of GAP (whether it is 5x, 2x, 1.5x), newbies will ALWAYS complain.

Giving new players 50k or 150k bonus EP isn't going to make them b1tch any less.

There are vets that still can't kill other vets for so many reasons other than EP.  It's just that a newbie will blame the EP (regardless of the size of the GAP), because it is convenient to do so.

Your using logic, Aaron is making an emotional plea, besides apparently Perp is so f*cked up it has "Nothing to lose" by trying it.

47

(163 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Celebro wrote:
Arga wrote:

Then replace "you" with "them", "them" being new players. It's the same thing. New players either like time based or not, if they don't, no amount of tweaking is going to get them to stay. Your not making the arguement any more valid by depersonalizing it.

The problem is not the time based skill system, the problem is for the last 3 years there has not been a steady stream of new players staying long term. Only the die hards with +1.5million EP have stayed mostly.


So now, are we expecting a whole wave of new players to come, carebear in alpha for 5 months and die repeatedly when they attempt to take the Vets. ?

Don't expect players to come just to be cannon fodder.

And that's the GRAND misconception, that new players should be able to come in and compete directly against vets.

Why can't the new players come in and join EXISTING corporations, and then it's MIXED battles of new and vets.

This theme-park idea that me, as a single player, can step into Perp and have some kind of HEROIC impact on the game is the disconnect. That's not even a gap issue, because not even Lemon was able to take on the whole server alone.

I don't really blame new players for coming in with this kind of attitude, because games like Dota, WOW, LOL, are all designed to make each player feel like a hero.

Maybe changing how Perp functions will make it less of a niche game, but then it WOULDN'T BE Perpetuum.

There's nothing wrong with a game being what it is, Perp's problem has always been a lack of content. The ONLY thing that's going to save Perp is more content. At some point, with enough players, Perp may become self-suffcient with player generated content. Until then though AC is going to have to kick start Perp with enough 'stuff' to keep players in the game for a couple months until they get involved in the small amount of existing Player content.

Also, they need to make all the game mechanic changes NOW, because everytime they make a change they lose people; the series of changes to mining and kernels caused most of the intial exodus (and the Gamma changes for me).

48

(163 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Then replace "you" with "them", "them" being new players. It's the same thing. New players either like time based or not, if they don't, no amount of tweaking is going to get them to stay. Your not making the arguement any more valid by depersonalizing it.

49

(3 replies, posted in Open discussion)

I've been looking forward to this game for awhile.

Here is the link to the english site for those interested.

https://www.archeagegame.com/en/

50

(163 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

I don't know, seems like it would require a lot of restirctions, or people would just start new accounts and sell themselves all the EP for 1 NIC; or some other 'sneaky' workaround that results in the same thing as directly selling EP.