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The horse, its still twitching. Beat it, beat it dead!
We've forgotten why we are beating the dead horse.
It's now the Cult of Sparking, we login a few minutes in the morning, afternoon, evening and beat the horse, then go about our day as if it was perfectly normal.
1 hr cooldown is fair on spark teleport.
Perp is so much easier with instant sparks, been playing increasingly more since it was introduced, still I know it's broken and needs a fix. Half of you posting on thread don't even play anymore, just stating facts, and it does not mean you don't understand the game, but if you played with the sparks you will get a better idea.
Let's not do any knee jerk changes just yet. I would prepare first with better highways, autopilot that works and maybe a revision on the teleport network then add a cool down or whatever to fix.
We've forgotten why we are beating the dead horse.
It's now the Cult of Sparking, we login a few minutes in the morning, afternoon, evening and beat the horse, then go about our day as if it was perfectly normal.
Made me laugh. 
Two saps same time Kentagura And Novastrov. I was able to hit both and had time to swing by FD on alsbale. Then make it to Hokko to help in a fight. ONE PERSON with access only to just NPC terminals and alpha terms. Now imagine 100 people doing the same. Imagine strategically placed 'neutral' outposts on gamma the next island over. It's a huge problem.
Lol, just lol.
You have spent the entire thread claiming what a huge advantage SpT has given our single corp an advantage in holding the entire world.
And then, with this one single post, you explain why we wouldn't be able to if more people played.
Ville you killed your entire argument better than any of could. Congrats.
Gunner, I want to play in your magic world of instant SpT to anywhere ...
I envision it like being 6000 m from an outpost and word comes that there's an attack at random Location. Since I'm in my mission running Argano, or mining Riv, I simply press the SpT button, while on terrain, select from the menu of every single Outpost in Game, be it Alpha, Beta, Gamma, Pleyer built or NPC, hell, even enemy terminal, and poof I end up in the new location, instantly.
I know you're a reasonable dude sometimes. Quit exaggerating.
And I'd like to take this time to point out only players who own ouposts should be allowed to post on the forums, and Limitied by the number of outpost owned = number of daily allowed posts. I really should start a thread on this exact subject because clearly its as important and as unpolitically motivated as the SpT thread has been.
Ville wrote:Two saps same time Kentagura And Novastrov. I was able to hit both and had time to swing by FD on alsbale. Then make it to Hokko to help in a fight. ONE PERSON with access only to just NPC terminals and alpha terms. Now imagine 100 people doing the same. Imagine strategically placed 'neutral' outposts on gamma the next island over. It's a huge problem.
Lol, just lol.
You have spent the entire thread claiming what a huge advantage SpT has given our single corp an advantage in holding the entire world.
And then, with this one single post, you explain why we wouldn't be able to if more people played.
Ville you killed your entire argument better than any of could. Congrats.
I'm not following your arguement, hows does Ville's post 'kill' the need for a timer?
MY arguement has never been about 'our single corp' or even the current player base being at issue.
Seems like Hyperbole horse beating continues unabated.
Starting to think Arga just isn't playing dumb anymore.
Re-read his post. Thoughts will come to you.
I changed my mind, I think we should go to 30 pages. 20 Was too easy.
20 pages since july 30
we can probably make it to 40 by the end of the month if we really put our minds into it 
Ville wrote:Two saps same time Kentagura And Novastrov. I was able to hit both and had time to swing by FD on alsbale. Then make it to Hokko to help in a fight. ONE PERSON with access only to just NPC terminals and alpha terms. Now imagine 100 people doing the same. Imagine strategically placed 'neutral' outposts on gamma the next island over. It's a huge problem.
Lol, just lol.
You have spent the entire thread claiming what a huge advantage SpT has given our single corp an advantage in holding the entire world.
And then, with this one single post, you explain why we wouldn't be able to if more people played.
Ville you killed your entire argument better than any of could. Congrats.
Mechanic is OP no matter who uses it.
Arga wrote:I changed my mind, I think we should go to 30 pages. 20 Was too easy.
20 pages since july 30
we can probably make it to 40 by the end of the month if we really put our minds into it
We definitely should, I feel we still haven't covered all the bases.
I'm not following your arguement, hows does Ville's post 'kill' the need for a timer?
Considering Ville started this topic, with the purpose of 50% trolling (this is a mandatory minimum on all Ville forum posts/threads) and 50% change the advantage an enemy has through any means possible except actual gameplay, I will simplify it.
Ville's argument:
Our small, 10 player active corp controls all Beta and some Gammas because we can spark anywhere and project power if needed, with no penalty. Therefore SpT needs a cooldown because this allows the simple few to control the vast majority. Its OP.
Ville's post states how one single player, himself, is able to hit 3 different areas without access to lockable stations, and muses how with more players, there would be no way possible our corp would hold anything.
Result: SpT is not allowing us to control the world. Population is.
Ville shoots himself in the foot, again.
@merkle, I see what you did there
@Cassius - Well, Population and the spark is allowing you to control the world. Which is where the real problem comes in. Any corp that has the greatest firepower (People and EP) will be the ones that control the world. That's what is broken.
Even if the tables turn, it won't even be 'fun' pvp to try and fight, because you'll always be faced with a huge number of opponents.
The M2S alliance was able to take over all the outposts because they had unlimited resources.
STC is holding all the outposts because you have unlimited mobility and the largest force.
The 'largest force' is only important because of the unlimited mobility. STC can apply everyone anywhere, that's what is broken.
I understand you don't want to give up your advantage. All 1000 of my posts aren't going to get STC to agree with me, contray to Merkle's post, I'm not done playing-dumb yet.
The only thing that really matters, is that the devs do see the problem, what they didn't see was a solution.
If they want to make it a 15 min PVP timer, that's fine by me. But it won't solve the problem, and time will prove that out.
I can't speak for Ville, but I would hazard that he doesn't care about holding a station, he just wants good PVP. Having 4 or 5 times your number defend every SAP on is not fun PVP, for either side.
The only thing that really matters, is that the devs do see the problem.
You're now the second person to assert this. Please show me a post where a Dev acknowledges that there is a problem with spark teleport.
@Cassius my post reaffirmed the fact one person is fully able to be everywhere, without ownership of any terminals. My post points out if one person can do it. 500 people is going to be a nightmare.
@Cassius if you can't keep up with the conversation please stop posting. Your just looking like a beastard.
@merkle, I see what you did there
@Cassius - Well, Population and the spark is allowing you to control the world. Which is where the real problem comes in. Any corp that has the greatest firepower (People and EP) will be the ones that control the world. That's what is broken.
Even if the tables turn, it won't even be 'fun' pvp to try and fight, because you'll always be faced with a huge number of opponents.
The M2S alliance was able to take over all the outposts because they had unlimited resources.
STC is holding all the outposts because you have unlimited mobility and the largest force.
The 'largest force' is only important because of the unlimited mobility. STC can apply everyone anywhere, that's what is broken.
I understand you don't want to give up your advantage. All 1000 of my posts aren't going to get STC to agree with me, contray to Merkle's post, I'm not done playing-dumb yet.
The only thing that really matters, is that the devs do see the problem, what they didn't see was a solution.
If they want to make it a 15 min PVP timer, that's fine by me. But it won't solve the problem, and time will prove that out.
I can't speak for Ville, but I would hazard that he doesn't care about holding a station, he just wants good PVP. Having 4 or 5 times your number defend every SAP on is not fun PVP, for either side.
Bingo. Dear Everyone. Read. The truth.
Arga wrote:The only thing that really matters, is that the devs do see the problem.
You're now the second person to assert this. Please show me a post where a Dev acknowledges that there is a problem with spark teleport.
I'm not convinced either way. The current world is too small for this feature? Maybe. But you still can't bring anything along with you when you teleport. A cooldown would effectively kill anyone's game for x hours if they teleport to a base where they don't have anything. Maybe, just maybe we'll reconsider this, once we have solved the problem of not being able to modify market orders remotely.
I quoted the whole thing, where Zoom starts by saying he's not convinced, because of the issue of sparking to a base without a bot and remote orders.
The cooldown timer on bot selection addresses both of those concerns.
Arga: that actually sounds like a good idea but I'm not sure whether we can distinguish that the lack of an active robot is due to a spark jump, or death. And if it's the latter, is it bad or not if you receive a cooldown there as well.
My suggestion isn't perfect, but it does allow the Devs to pursue a cool-down without the (2) major concerns Zoom presented.
I'm not really sure not being able to dock in for an hour would be such a good idea.
The longer PVP flag creates more problems, but doesn't solve all the issues with the spark like the timer does. However;
I quickly checked whether the PvP flag can be cheated by closing the client and letting the server remove your robot from the terrain but no, as long as the flag lasts, your robot remains there. So I have nothing against a 10 or 15 min PvP timer.
Devs haven't dismissed it.
Because they are seriously looking at possible solutions, means they see something that needs to be addressed.
So, yes I do believe the Devs are actively looking at sparking in its current iteration as being an issue they need to address.
How and when they are going to make a change is still undetermined.
Edit: F*ck 20 pages to find quotes
Yep, I've read all those posts carefully too and at no point does Zoom acknowledge that spark teleport is in any way imbalanced.
You may infer from what he says that, as you put it, the DEVs are "seriously looking at possible solutions" but I don't think that is implied at all. To me it sounds more like Devs feel pressure to respond to a hot topic and have been deliberately non-committal in their response.
So Zoom, without any appeasement or attempts at diplomacy between the two or more sides of the spark teleport question tell us what you think. Its your game, you set the direction tell us what you think.
Do you consider spark teleport to be imbalanced?
Gunner wrote:==== Tactic A
I lure your blob to location A and trick you all to flag up.
You are stuck there for 30 minutes.
I hit location B.
just won EVE
You are so afraid of this simple tactic and this is the tactic that Zoom cant even wrap his head around that he tells us that he just doesnt understand.
Yes, that tactic might work for the first time. After that it will just cripple the gameplay without any advantage to it.
Gunner wrote:This game is crippled and the quantity of people remaining is an insignificant number. There are zero people playing right now, imo.
At what amount of subs does the game hit rock bottom?
The remaining players are in denial. The game isnt dead, but all the decisions that were made in the last two years has lead us to this point, therefore I conclude that some of them are very wrong ones.
You just attributed the demise of the game to a mechanic which 95% of our players don't even reach in the first place.
See, I can quote DEV's too....
Tactic A has work 7 times now....
It isnt about STC and us.
It is simply about the ability to skip time and distance.
To remove rules in a game.
Spark is a concession to the few players at the time.
Now that we are on the verge of many players it needs to be back to traveling and making choices about going to one place or another because it may take an hour to do so.
now it doesnt matter, you just click and poof
its time for us to move on from this bad easy mode ridiculous mechanic
If you think this thread was a troll your gravely mistaken.
Dev Zoom,
We understand (most of us) that you have limited choices for a "quick fix". That would be a fix that requires a minimum amount of coding or no coding.
Once Missions are changed, just remove the spark system.
We dont need it.
If:
Remote item and storage manipulation were possible, or a contract system.
..and remote mission accept was added
Just turn off sparks.
Let the players use the interzone teles; that is what they are there for.
Let other players have the chance to engage other players that are moving from point A to point B, just like we used to do.
Players are getting used to this now and its almost like you left gifties from December in the game for two years.
Players are going to kick and scream when you threaten to remove it.
Dont worry about what the 10 people still playing want.
Think about what the 50,000 people from Steam would think. (lol funny thing is im sure theyd love it). 50,000 people arent going to need to spark because they will just live in certain island and move around 50x less than we are now.
Just remove sparks. Thanks for reading this.
I can go on forever on the subject.
Every tactical or strategic situation that comes up, I can use as an example of how bad this meta-mechanic is for the game or any game for that matter.
I changed my mind, I think we should go to 30 pages. 20 Was too easy.
Dev Zoom,
We understand (most of us) that you have limited choices for a "quick fix". That would be a fix that requires a minimum amount of coding or no coding.
Once Missions are changed, just remove the spark system.
We dont need it.
If:
Remote item and storage manipulation were possible, or a contract system.
..and remote mission accept was added
Just turn off sparks.
Let the players use the interzone teles; that is what they are there for.
Let other players have the chance to engage other players that are moving from point A to point B, just like we used to do.
Players are getting used to this now and its almost like you left gifties from December in the game for two years.
Players are going to kick and scream when you threaten to remove it.
Dont worry about what the 10 people still playing want.
Think about what the 50,000 people from Steam would think. (lol funny thing is im sure theyd love it). 50,000 people arent going to need to spark because they will just live in certain island and move around 50x less than we are now.
Just remove sparks. Thanks for reading this.
+1
but if it doesn't get removed i bet when steam release happens STC will stop fighting under beta terms since they cannot lock those to mass spark hotdropping and will hide at their OPs
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