Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Burial wrote:
Dazamin wrote:
Burial wrote:

Running multiple beacons is probably 1) the only PVE thing people can do on gamma 2) the only group PVE thing people in hmechs can do outside alpha(why not allowing it on alpha?). I don't understand why balancing assignments (and syndicate store!) isn't enough to close the issue, the only reason people are running beacons so much in recent times is because it's so easy to get both tokens and beacons.

Devs, if you add this restriction then you are going to remove a fun gameplay element from the game. What do you gain?

Because (I assume) they don't want to impact the earnings made by guys who currently run a few beacons one at a time (which any global change would affect) However they do want to reduce the earnings of those farming multiple beacons on Gamma.

These guys are vast minority. They need to think if they want to help these guys(who actually have other content too) or if they want to help older players, who have nothing else decent on gamma.

You may be disappointed with the likely answer to this question.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Ville wrote:
All Knowing Eye wrote:

So just beacause u failed u dont think its possible, when Zoom said it is?

And my question isnt about if its doable, but if its ok.

Your looking at this from a "Beacon -> zomg pwnage (make lots of Nic perspective)"

When we are looking at this from "Get Tokens -> make tokens safe -> buy beacons -> Get beacons to gamma station -> pop beacons."

Some of the best fun I've had in game was chaining 4 to 5 beacons at once and watching the pretty pixels explode.  Hell let's start making it even tougher for players to have to farm more endless hours for things, let's revamp production randomly and had *** 19 commodities to make a *** YAGEL!  There is not a problem with players finding an efficient way to make a decent PVE living on Gamma.  Because what stops you from being attacked while your doing it?  Nothing.  What stops you from mass DCing and you losing a *** ton of beacons?  Nothing..  Honestly in Merkles video I seen a mass disconnect and probably lost 20 to 30 beacons in there + the *** quality of the fraps make me sad face.

Definitely dropped

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Azyre and everyone who suggested that the problem lies in beta missions: yes that's a problem too, but it's a different one.

Regarding this particular change it does not matter whether you acquire those tokens/beacons during 3 months or 3 hours. What matters for us is that you can kill hundreds of NPCs in a matter of minutes. That's something we don't want you to do with any mechanic, simple as that. If we would fix the beta missions and leave the beacon rule as it is, it would still be a problem that you can do it, even if it would be more rare then.

79 (edited by Dazamin 2013-03-11 14:08:29)

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Azyre wrote:

Time to have my input. 

The many times beacons have been nerfed:
1) Lower drop rate implemented with the removal of 5th tier NPCs from alpha.
2) Distance restriction on alpha to reduce griefing
3) Slightly smaller NPC group size and loot drops
4) Lower drop rate in artifacts

Now, How many times have missions on beta been nerfed?
...

What Syndic said about making sure to remember how we got our beacons to gamma to pop multiple ones off in the first place is VERY important.  Look at the papertrail, not the paycheck.

Yes, we make a lot of nic off these, but think of it this way: What if all of the people running missions, hauling tokens, cashing them in, hauling beacons, waiting till we have enough warm bodies to pop them off were farming plasma on alpha?  I believe we would be making the same amount of money, just in a more gradual time frame. 

Don't nerf our beacons, nerf the missions it takes to get the tokens to buy those beacons. Please, Devs.

My CEO <3 smile

It's not as if only a small section of the playerbase understand where beacons come from, the majority do, and as the devs created the system, I'm pretty sure they know too. My understanding from dev blogs, etc, is that missions are being worked on separately and changes are coming to those, but these changes are not about missions, they're not even about beacons, they're about the way some groups run multiple beacons, and it's not purely a NIC/hr issue, running beacons simultaneously, by reducing time spent running each beacon, reduces the risk involved, any change to missions would not change that. You could make each beacon take longer to compensate, but that would affect people running single beacons.

On the issue of NIC, I feel fairly confident in saying that if Alpha farming was as profitable as running beacons then that is exactly what players would be doing, players tend to be very effective at finding the most profitable methods of generating money.

EDIT: Dev Zoom beat me to it and also said it better. Damn you Zoom!!!!! fuuu

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Dazamin: damn you, now everyone is gonna think you're my alt big_smile

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

DEV Zoom wrote:

Dazamin: damn you, now everyone is gonna think you're my alt big_smile

Maybe you're my alt?????

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

All Knowing Eye wrote:

So just beacause u failed u dont think its possible, when Zoom said it is?

And my question isnt about if its doable, but if its ok.

Doable matters. and its not doable. The absolute most you can run at the same time is 8-10 but that is pushing the boundaries of lag and the ability to get the loot. More likely 4-6 are run at one time. Why Zoom said 50 in a minute is beyond me, because it cant be done and definitely not done in a minute.

That little experiment we did, we did not recover more than 10 beacons or so worth of loot, so we lost 90 beacons and 8 bots.  But give it a try and see for yourself.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Cassius wrote:
All Knowing Eye wrote:

So just beacause u failed u dont think its possible, when Zoom said it is?

And my question isnt about if its doable, but if its ok.

Doable matters. and its not doable. The absolute most you can run at the same time is 8-10 but that is pushing the boundaries of lag and the ability to get the loot. More likely 4-6 are run at one time. Why Zoom said 50 in a minute is beyond me, because it cant be done and definitely not done in a minute.

That little experiment we did, we did not recover more than 10 beacons or so worth of loot, so we lost 90 beacons and 8 bots.  But give it a try and see for yourself.

Well then u are doing something wrong for i know for a fact thats its possible to to 50 beacons in 60sec

84 (edited by Zortarg Calltar 2013-03-11 14:47:57)

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

my experience is that 6 is a "good" number for this. you should have 3 ppl with guns and a scarab as looter. also a support with nexus mods will help.
you should have 3 ppl with guns because if you dont you might have issues keeping the beacons from despawning. if 4 or more waves explode and you are not able to tag them fast enough again then they will despawn. thats why 3 ppl is good for that.

so you should have a minimum of 3 ppl if you fit the other roles to alts. if you dont do that then more like 4-5.

of cource solo is a option too. 3 beacons are doable. but is a pain and can result in partial despawns from time to time. also is a lot of target swaping all the time. also explotions are not so nice until you reach at least 4 beacons at a time.

if you go higher on beacons you risk despawns and a lot of lag. and is no fun getting the loot. fps drop to a amount thats no fun even on a decent pc. even worse if you have multible accounts running.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

lets see

players did something, put efforts to earn tokens, beacons (we are at 100 active people NOW! to play the game). We are oN tiny ice now.

I just say you should understand why people tell dont nerf. They dont really want this beaconing, just would like to generate NIC and play on gamma (why you did Gamma if yu dont want players to be able to PVE farming there?), you should replace the beacon popping to something ELSE, if you delete that.

I understand you all Zoom but pls keep in mind we are far far less than before any time. Why lost people if dont needed?

P.S I didnt do the beaconin goldrush so I dont care, I care for Perpetuum and other people.

Energy to Earth!

18.01.2014. [12:57:58] <BeastmodeGuNs> after that i remembered all those warning about 1v1 you lol, and i found out why xD

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Inda: actually the thin ice you mention would be balancing the game by keeping all the "fun" but bad game mechanics in there just so players don't leave. If we would want to do that we would simply place a NIC dispenser button on every gamma.


But ok, I listen to reason and I understand beacon popping is a fun thing to do. We still need a cap, but since we only have a problem with extremities, we'll modify the rule so that you can place up to 3 beacons in a 500m radius. After that it's a balancing matter, but don't expect it to change a lot.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

DEV Zoom wrote:

But ok, I listen to reason and I understand beacon popping is a fun thing to do. We still need a cap, but since we only have a problem with extremities, we'll modify the rule so that you can place up to 3 beacons in a 500m radius. After that it's a balancing matter, but don't expect it to change a lot.

+1

Energy to Earth!

18.01.2014. [12:57:58] <BeastmodeGuNs> after that i remembered all those warning about 1v1 you lol, and i found out why xD

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

If the problem is people running 50 beacons in 1 minute then being able to run only 3 simultaneously is laughable. Why not raise it to somewhere a lot of people have suggested(5-6)? That seems to be the amount most of the people with semi-big groups are doing too.

Why exactly was multi-beaconing removed from alpha? Is the restriction still relevant..?

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

+1 great job Zoom this is extremely fair.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Zoom, you da man, despite what my corpys say about you.

An excellent compromise. Thanks.
You could reach God-like status by banning Ville permanently.  fuuu
Just sayin'

91 (edited by Mouse Slayer 2013-03-11 21:39:56)

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

$

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

DEV Zoom wrote:

Inda: actually the thin ice you mention would be balancing the game by keeping all the "fun" but bad game mechanics in there just so players don't leave. If we would want to do that we would simply place a NIC dispenser button on every gamma.


But ok, I listen to reason and I understand beacon popping is a fun thing to do. We still need a cap, but since we only have a problem with extremities, we'll modify the rule so that you can place up to 3 beacons in a 500m radius. After that it's a balancing matter, but don't expect it to change a lot.

Do the same with bombs

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

93 (edited by Mouse Slayer 2013-03-11 21:39:35)

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

..

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

I'm smart because I'm selling my overcharged tokens to you. wink

95 (edited by Mouse Slayer 2013-03-11 21:40:16)

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

^^

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Cassius wrote:

Zoom, you da man, despite what my corpys say about you.

An excellent compromise. Thanks.
You could reach God-like status by banning Ville permanently.  fuuu
Just sayin'

Immaturity at its finest.  I'm so glad I'm an adult.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

way too early to be hitting the bottle, bro

Ville wrote:
Cassius wrote:

Zoom, you da man, despite what my corpys say about you.

An excellent compromise. Thanks.
You could reach God-like status by banning Ville permanently.  fuuu
Just sayin'

Immaturity at its finest.  I'm so glad I'm an adult.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

I'm just going to say this once but if you can't take responsibility of your comments from your main character because your a coward then that's on you.  But I'm not going to talk to a forum alt by a player who can't man up and take responsibility for their actions.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Round 1 FIGHT!!!

Re: Beacon Pit Exploit

Yo Mouse, I know how to run 50 beacons. Thats not the point. You could also say everyone should multibox 9 accounts for the $$$$$$$$$$ also ... But not everyone has the hardware to do this.  I got the 50 beacons, arhkes, bombs, I get it.  But hey, in the end Zoom is doing something that is needed. When mechanics work and people chug along everything is fine and theres no need to nerf ..but when someone pushes it, and then everyone pushes things to an extreme, and then economics are out of balance, thats when the nerf is required. This is that time.

And lol Ville, 95% of your posts are trolls, when someone trolls you you automatically take the high road?  You da adult!