Topic: A Dead Parrot's Lament

FOOM is full of people like me - we do enough industry to supply us with things to make and go boom. Then we go looking for people to shoot. Being primarily North American and ranging across the continent, our ops tend to begin around 02-03:00, give/take. We've done this on three occasions, now, and discovered exactly the same problem all three times:


No targets. These islands are a tomb at this time of day. You have to - quite literally - arrange a fight in order to get any targets at all, and arranging a fight when you're the new guys has a bad habit of getting you impressively dead. (Not that this stops us... it's just frustrating.)

This isn't a "Oh god we got spanked" nor a "We think you cheated" or even a "Game is unbalancedzor!"

It's a "No one else is here to play the game with us."

...and that's a pretty damn serious problem, folks. We do NOT want to quit, because we really like the game, but we didn't come here to build pretty bots and throw them them at NPCs all day.

Discuss. sad

2 (edited by Mara Kaid 2011-06-02 03:24:06)

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Split the zerg, and people be more independent instead of worrying about one big force.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Madame, if 12 people are considered a zerg, this game is in a sad, sad way indeed.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Evening. Historically, pst time zone is just one of the least populated. Its like a self fulfilling prophecy, in that pst players come on and the population is low, so they leave, and we never exceed terminal mass.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Friedrich Psitalon wrote:

Madame, if 12 people are considered a zerg, this game is in a sad, sad way indeed.

What i think my pet Mara was getting at is that once the Novablob breaks up there will be more independent fights.


This doesn't bother me too much even though I am a US player. Perpetuum isn't a game you can play all the time...Nor was EvE for me. It's my persistent MMO that i keep on the shelf and play when theres something going on... i fill the rest of my time rolling around in my chi-mo van in APB.

6 (edited by AgY 2011-06-02 04:17:39)

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Friedrich Psitalon wrote:

Madame, if 12 people are considered a zerg, this game is in a sad, sad way indeed.

lol, Mara is talking about something else.
As you can see there are already a lot of people suggesting you what to do.

Form your own opinion. I think your corp is on a good way and im looking forward to have some friendly PvP with you guys.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

CIR has quite a few NA players so come over to Novastrov for a roam.

8 (edited by Dadar 2011-06-02 10:09:21)

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

there is no problem there are hundreds and thousands of new players starting game everyday this is a nitch market the new player experience is not broken there is no inbalance in bots 9 out of 10 players stay in game. that that 100+ people you see in general is not accurate they didt code it right to show everyone to see real amount of players multiply the number by 10 thats the real number of people online at any one time you just dont see thos extra players cause they jumped off the content just before you jumped in.

training times are right online 1490 is perfect amount of ep per day

on the up side you have over 4 years worth of extensions you can work on to kill the time while you wait for the problems that dont exist to be fixed its a win win hmm now that i think about it 3.7 year just to train combat extensions to 10 another year or more for support skills lets not even think of ew that amount of content is mind blowing wonder when the actual game content will equal the required 4 years of time.

but on a true note these issues will be fixed the day the hardcores get there heads out of there butts and instead of trying to tell all the new players there wrong and nothing is wrong and help to figure out way to get new players to stick around you wont have anyone to shoot at simple fact

the noisy wheel gets the greese and the people that make the most noise are thos who dont want there advantange changed so nothing gets changed. strangely enough most of thos noisy people are all in the same corp will let you figure out which one lol.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

somehow i cant find the relation between the later and the initial post.

The Topic starter complains that he can't find any targets with his copr while roaming around on their primetime.

Most PvP atm is either intrusion battles which usually field the big groups, and dunno how many player consider shooting defensless mining Mechs more intresting then doing real combat.

on the other side - you don't find many mining bots on beta as its anyoning to lose your expensive mining rig and hours of mined material to a group of cheap light bots.

what else could the devs provide to have roaming groups/players actually hunting each others?

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Make everywhere beta. Problem solved.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Everyone sees you coming so 2 things happen:

1) Juicy Targets dock up, log off, jump out

2) If enough ppl online you meet resistance, if not your targets dock up, log off, jump out.

Now if only there was some way to figure out if you are being watched and then use that to set a proper ambush. sad

Also, conflict at the moment is currently concentrated on only one or two main locations. Maybe people are there?

This is my blob. There are many like it, but this one is mine.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Unfortunately all the sheep have gathered into one big blob led by CIR at the moment so you wont find small groups going solo.

Once Novablob, to steal Dadars phrase (thought you'd left btw?) gets its head out of its arse and breaks up its giant nap train we might see some more action out there

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Jelan wrote:

Once Novablob, to steal Dadars phrase (thought you'd left btw?)

did leave but made mistake paying for time so stuck hearing from me till the 11th only loged in once in last week to say hi to friends might come back when they finish the game

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Jelan wrote:

Unfortunately all the sheep have gathered into one big blob led by CIR at the moment so you wont find small groups going solo.

Once Novablob, to steal Dadars phrase (thought you'd left btw?) gets its head out of its arse and breaks up its giant nap train we might see some more action out there

hmm, i wonder - why does the Topic starter not meet m2s's small roaming groups? they are so against the blobs, but cannot be found?

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

The only people we've met with consistancy within our corp ops timeframes is 62nd. They seem to be around a bit. We've bumped in to a few other roamers, but they're typically not forces with enough pilots to compete with our numbers we bring. I almost feel bad we have to gank them, but they're targets ( and pretty much the only ones at that ) of opportunity and we don't go roaming to shake hands. Granted 62nd did have enough last night, but what happened with them is another story.

We're having fun. We'd be having more fun if there were sizeable groups to match our pilots gear and skill. Which is not to say we're awesome with a billion EP and T4 heavies, but rather medium-ranged EP pilots with assaults/lights. We'll keep expanding and doing our thing. Hopefully others will as well and the game will grow up to be a bit healthier and more attractive to long term players.

Take the long way around back to square one
Today we're just outlaws out on the run

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Xini Nemesis wrote:

CIR has quite a few NA players so come over to Novastrov for a roam.

We were outside the outpost yesterday...

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

The roam itself was textbook but nothing like covering 3 (actually 4 if you count tellesis) and only getting an unlucky 62nd.  nWar gave us a good fight, as always.  However, FOOM is very concerned about the game being heavily biased.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Gut Punch wrote:

However, FOOM is very concerned about the game being heavily biased.

Against who and in what way?

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Annihilator wrote:

hmm, i wonder - why does the Topic starter not meet m2s's small roaming groups? they are so against the blobs, but cannot be found?

Because they're not happening as much anymore for exactly the same reasons.

Norhoop has pretty much fallen apart. It's not that place anymore where you could sneak in and hope to find someone to kill and then see if you can deal with the defending forces. Only F-Navy and SK moved to Brightstone to begin with, the rest just sort of petered out.

Novastrov tends to be well scouted and even when it's not there doesn't seem to be anything happening there. They also never engage unless they are sure they can win which translates out to us standing around like *** waiting for them to hit critical mass and once they undock there isn't much we can do except leave.

After countless hours of roaming and not finding anything I'm personally rather tired of it.

The other islands are just uninhabited and empty. I've heard reports about TOG living out of Darmahol but certainly not a whole lot of them, nWar lived in South Iseitsu at some point and 62nd wanted to move into KKO but I'm not sure they ever did that.

If you think about it, there isn't even any reason for anyone to actually live on beta. There's still no benefit to it. You might aswell sit in some alpha outpost and occasionally start expeditions into beta if you need something there, haul it back and be done with it. All the beta islands are just way too close to alpha islands for it to be beneficial to actually set up a camp in the wilderness.

EvE has this vast expanse of 0.0 (Or is it negative sec space now?) where a corp could basically just decide to move into some remote corner of it, make some deal with the local power block and feel relatively safe actually living there, especially since organizing the logistics back to high sec isn't something you'd want to do every day if you don't have access to a jump bride network or JFs. Or you could just move into some w-space system and hang around there while occasionally fending of unwelcome visitors.
Here everything is the equivalent to a short trip to the shops right outside the door.
This also means that a single corp can prevent you from feeling safe on any beta island in the game because it just doesn't take them that long to check the entire pvp area for targets.

There is no mechanic to hold territory either. It doesn't matter who owns an outpost, everyone can just move in there and prevent you from feeling or being even remotely safe in the area.

Obviously the average player doesn't feel overly compelled to live on beta if he can avoid it.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

You won't find any europeans roaming around at 5-6 in the morning. People have work & other obligations.

Soviet Novastrov prefers not to stoop so low and call other players sheep or cows, we are in a temporary Non-Agression Pact with the Norhoop alliance with clearly defined goals and ideals. When our goals are achieved - and not a day sooner, as far as SovNov is concerned - we will reset our standings and return to shooting at each other in friendly, open PVP that we all enjoy, with enough room for everyone in the game to grow and prosper at their own pace.

Until that happens, we can all rejoice in the continued propaganda about the best interest of Perpetuum, from our favorite corporation whose ultimate goal is the destruction, manipulation and domination of everything that is not 'them'; regarding the big bad zerg threatening this and that.

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

20

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Syndic +1

thats all were working for atm:

Syndic wrote:

.. open PVP that we all enjoy, with enough room for everyone in the game to grow and prosper at their own pace.

Unfortunately is that this is the exact opposite of m2s goals.

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Friedrich Psitalon wrote:

Being primarily North American and ranging across the continent, our ops tend to begin around 02-03:00, give/take. We've done this on three occasions, now, and discovered exactly the same problem all three times:

No targets. These islands are a tomb at this time of day. You have to - quite literally - arrange a fight in order to get any targets at all, and arranging a fight when you're the new guys has a bad habit of getting you impressively dead.

This is partly why M2S has been so aggressive with intrusions.

I have also stopped going on roams recently because it feels like such a waste of time.

It's a combination of islands being really easy to scout, teleports and outposts (i.e. safe gettaways) being in easy reach when on beta, low population during US timezones, and not enough attractions on beta.

"...playing a game is the voluntary attempt to overcome unnecessary obstacles."
Bernard Suits, 1978

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Styx wrote:
Gut Punch wrote:

However, FOOM is very concerned about the game being heavily biased.

Against who and in what way?

Towards more euro time zones.  Apparently I went into Yoda mode and forgot to finish my train of thought. big_smile  Stupid, am I?

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

AgY wrote:

Syndic +1

thats all were working for atm:

Syndic wrote:

.. open PVP that we all enjoy, with enough room for everyone in the game to grow and prosper at their own pace.

Unfortunately is that this is the exact opposite of m2s goals.

Our stated goals were to own every outpost in the game, how is that the exact opposite of open pvp, whats wrong with that goal?  I seriously hope that we dont hang on to every outpost in the game once we have them, it'd be pretty damn boring

The only way to get a fight from anyone is to take an outpost of theirs, if we own every outpost, we can then see when someone signs up for it  and voila we get a fight.

If there were other pvpers in the novablob then we wouldnt need to own every outpost.

Is it novablobs stated aim to grief people out of the game they dont like or that they feel threatened by.  You must be proud of yourselves, huddling up like wildebeast lol

24 (edited by Syndic 2011-06-02 18:07:49)

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Jelan wrote:

Our stated goals were to own every outpost in the game, how is that the exact opposite of open pvp, whats wrong with that goal?  I seriously hope that we dont hang on to every outpost in the game once we have them, it'd be pretty damn boring

The only way to get a fight from anyone is to take an outpost of theirs, if we own every outpost, we can then see when someone signs up for it  and voila we get a fight.

If there were other pvpers in the novablob then we wouldnt need to own every outpost.

Is it novablobs stated aim to grief people out of the game they dont like or that they feel threatened by.  You must be proud of yourselves, huddling up like wildebeast lol

Our stated goals are to own 1 outpost of our choosing - which we are doing quite fine. The new corps and the neutral forces of the server, will only get our full help in claiming and carving out their own piece of land, if that is what they want.

For someone whose goals are to own everything in game, you're doing a pretty piss-poor job at showing up lately, nevermind contesting an intrusion. Yesterday at Danarchov and today at Brightstone was what, the 3rd no-show in a row? In every game except Perpetuum, the elite PVPers do PVP in-game, not on the forums. Its a bit different here unfortunately.

Thankfully for you, we are more interested in helping new corps like FOOM and AET get set-up then attacking the outposts you have hoarded. By all means, tax 62nd and nWar and the others, the NIC to buy the ore to rebuild those 40-50 heavies that went nuclear has to come from somewhere. Those of us with truly infinite supplies don't bother with such frivolities.

How are the ore prices lately btw? lol

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

Re: A Dead Parrot's Lament

Syndic wrote:

You won't find any europeans roaming around at 5-6 in the morning. People have work & other obligations.

Soviet Novastrov prefers not to stoop so low and call other players sheep or cows, we are in a temporary Non-Agression Pact with the Norhoop alliance with clearly defined goals and ideals. When our goals are achieved - and not a day sooner, as far as SovNov is concerned - we will reset our standings and return to shooting at each other in friendly, open PVP that we all enjoy, with enough room for everyone in the game to grow and prosper at their own pace.

Until that happens, we can all rejoice in the continued propaganda about the best interest of Perpetuum, from our favorite corporation whose ultimate goal is the destruction, manipulation and domination of everything that is not 'them'; regarding the big bad zerg threatening this and that.

Well said syndic. Remember the name menace. But switch society to Perpetuum.

The game didnt always used to be this way. Less came back after the expansion then i had hoped for. I remember leading large successful and fun roams to various places. I remember leading large sucessful defenses of our then home at karapyth. Player retention is low, or so it seems. Thats not entirely m2s's fault, but i would contend that a significant portion of it is. I can only think of one person in  in m2s the game and community wouldnt be beter off without.