1

(23 replies, posted in Balancing)

Annihilator wrote:

Petteri Petraaja

don't take me on the wrong side. Im do not belong to those PvP addicts. During the BETA i always representated the PvE side of the game.

But as it is now, i dont have any hopes for the PvE side of the game, unless they introduce mission-instances and a RTS based AI with a kind of route-finding algorithm.

What you will probably see in the near future, is a nother kind of mission, that connects the story with the Energy-transfer station on New virgina.

I still and really hope they decide to add instances with scripted content. Or maybe they will surprise us with something else that is actually entertaining.

If however the next thing they add is another farming style assignment (related to energy transfer and shuttling repeatedly between station and points a and b clicking button) I will quite likely lose all hope on pve too and admit this is a full pvp game with some silly pve as a side show.

2

(23 replies, posted in Balancing)

Siddy wrote:

What if my goals conflicts with your goals?

You deal with them the way game and content permits..

On pvp-islands you can killfragdestroy.

Attaining your competitive pvp related goals should of course not be made null by safety of alpha islands. This is a balance issue no? Someone enjoying and focusing on pve part of the game should not bother anyones goals. But if a corp can fund and for large part attain their pvp island related-goals just by pve in complete safety then there is an issue.

Majority of things needed to attain pvp-related goals should require activities in pvp areas. Since I don't think you can just take away the ability to gather resources for building stuff in alpha the bot-building and nic-earning part will remain something everyone can do in peace. Which could of course be changed somewhat by some form of balanced war dec-system.

Anyways, balanced and plentiful content should give enough goals for everyone. And also enough tools and opportunities for competitive play when the goals conflict.

3

(23 replies, posted in Balancing)

Annihilator wrote:

So what good things should we expect? If it(Perpetuum) become only PvP game, it will die soon, due to luck of population.

the game is meant as PvP + economy...
was there somewhere an add that tells you that this is a PvE game?

The Alpha islands are not meant as PvE playground to stay there forever - the way they are set up, is to give every player a chance to build up a backbone to expand into the open pvp zones.

You brave warriors of Beta islands seem to know of an add that tells this is a pvp-only game (+economy). How about linking it here so we can all stop asking for pve content?

From the Perpetuum FAQ:

Players may take part in various areas of the project. They may fight against various enemy robots, complete assignments on behalf of the Perpetuum project, do various industrial activities, trade goods or services, or even set their own goals and set up their own coprorations.

I bolded the part for you which to me seems to refer to the pvp-part of the game. Somehow the wording doesn't seem to make pvp the main focus of Perpetuum.

Maybe the confusion comes from the fact that the pve content is lacking and for some reason you beta islanders with gigantic balls of titanium have drawn the conclusion that this is how it is supposed to be and will continue to be.

One question to you o most brave of all gamers (=all of you who have been brave enough to make pvp islands home for their pixel robots.. I salute you).. Why do you feel that good pve content and pve focused players take something away from your beloved pvp part of the game?

I'm not denying that in general in mmorpgs pvp can be and is much more fun and exciting than pve and I actually do feel that it is (especially when the pve content is something like we have now). But not everyone feels so. Imho Pvp-only players are a small but very loud minority and takes a veryvery good pvp-only system to attract enough of them to make a game profitable. I will quite likely keep playing no matter which direction the devs will actually take the game.

Just voicing my opinion because it seems clear to me that giving some coding content love to both pvp and pve would benefit everyone.

4

(9 replies, posted in Q & A)

Blaster wrote:

Huh. Cant you just play a pew pew game and kill others? Its pvp loot game with player based economy. I dont even know a thing about storyline. All I care is my heart going boom boom when I blow up someone.

Half of the game area  is non-pvp where vast majority of players currently roam around in Sequers. So I would not call it just pvp loot game with player based economy.

You are not alone in not knowing a thing about storyline. I would guess majority of players don't know and don't care about lore. However there are also players who do care and pay attention to it.

Imho the issue here is that a decent lore basically just requires writing a text that should be mostly if not fully coherent with the content of the game. Having a decent or better still, well written lore, will not in any way lessen the booming of your heart when you blow up someone and I doubt the lines of Sequers will be affected either. Only if you happen to be allergic to roleplayers you can make a decent case against well written lore.

Well written lore -> Roleplayers get the lore they desire/require. DEVs won't mind the few extra subs that the good lore attracts (make it excellent with evolving storyline and it won't be just few extra subs that would be attracted). PvPers will get easy kills. (rpers are easy and even desirable kills right?). And I believe you don't even have to be a roleplayer to be able to enjoy a well written lore.

And all this by relatively little effort. Of course the better you want the lore to be the more effort it requires and at some point it begins to require professional level talent/skill, but a decent base would be a good start.  Nothing to lose but plenty to gain.

5

(9 replies, posted in Q & A)

I just read the 2nd part from this guy.

Devs, maybe you can muster some nic to hire him to do some official writing for the game!

6

(9 replies, posted in Q & A)

Few questions to DEVs regarding lore and backstory.

Quoted parts taken from the PO website.

However, the training of Agents is a very long and costly process. Those who fit the strict criteria and genuinely wish to work for the Project Perpetuum have to join the infrastructure of the organization. Their job is to control the colonies that lie 87,000 light-years away.

Both neurointegration and the remote controlled colonization are strictly supervised processes by the Megacorporations for a reason: they have no intentions of sharing financial and technological gains.

Why would the Syndicate train Agents (long and costly process) and let them fight against each other instead of concentrating on the conquest of Nia? Why would they let agents create corporations whose ideals have nothing to do with the Syndicate and Project Perpetuum?

The expansion is further facilitated by the long-standing war between certain groups within the alien species. By applying the principle “divide and rule”, the earthly forces have so far been successful in playing off the war parties against each other.

Could you elaborate on the ”divide and rule” and how it is actually done? What kind of trolling is applied to them so that they fight each other instead of uniting to fight the invaders from another world. Apparently we are able to communicate with them?

The Syndicate denies the information that the Earth-Nia connection can be cracked and some Agents are connecting to the Perpetuum Project this way to avoid local authorities and to gain independence from the Syndicate.

Local authorities? Would these hackers (if they exist) be connecting from outside the space station? Are there plans to implement in-game content regarding these outsiders?

Just that if you want to play a pirate or do anything against the rules (I guess "rules" being something lile: ”do stuff to help project perpetuum and do not do stuff that harms it”) of project perpetuum couldn't and wouldn't they just shut off your access to bases and at the very least remove the syndicate protection so you can be blown to bits.

7

(32 replies, posted in General discussion)

Very nice! smile

SAXON wrote:

1 word - "sandbox"

Ok, there are quite many definitions for what a "sandbox"-game is but very few of them dictate that there should be no background or storyline in the game.

Even if you add storyline and even in-game content relating to that story, it doesn't necessarily follow that your playing would be restricted in any way.

Paly Thoa wrote:
Petteri Petraaja wrote:

Thumbs up to Devs if they are so hardcore that they give the give the finger to 90% of the mmo customer base.

More like 5%.  Most of us don't read full quest descriptions and imagine ourselves in a mysterious land, embarking on a magical adventure every time we're told to go kill 10 deer.  We just click accept and make the ugly window go away so we can get back to killing stuff.

Go strap on some elf ears and a cape and play some lotro.  Most of us wanna write our own stories as we hunt ppl down and blow them to bits!

I was referring to Coyote saying that this is not a PvE supported game and 90% was an rough estimate about percentage of those who prefer PvE over PvP. Good background and evolving storyline doesn't require one to strap on elf ears. It is added content and imho adds to the game even without "lol RP" aspects.

Am slightly curious about what kind of stories you write as you hunt ppl down and blow them to bits?

10

(23 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Some people like it.
Some hate it.
Some tolerate it. 
Some ignore it.

I think most of us at least agree that it could/should be better.

Maybe the most productive approach would be to start thinking about features and ideas that would make it so. Devs are the ones making the game and we can hope that they listen to us who are playing their game. Maybe we can come up with something that they like enough to implement.

Also it's good that we keep voicing our concerns over the game content. Some may say QQ and to each his own, but nothing will be fixed if it's not known to be broken.

Who knows what they have cooking right now. I do feel that they should actually reveal at least some outlines of their plans and open them for discussion before they go ahead and just implement them.

Even the pvp-side would improve hand in hand with actually interesting pve.

Good pve brings in and keeps players.
More players = More money to develop the game and more pvp action as certain percentage of players is always and surely going to venture into pvp islands and corps. (as slaves to statistics we are)

CoyoteTheClever wrote:

This isn't a PvE supported game. That's an illusion. PvE stops in what might be the equivalent of level 10 in another MMO. All the higher level mobs are going to be on the beta islands. If you are on a beta island, it doesn't matter what you are doing, you are PvPing in some way, shape or form.

Thumbs up to Devs if they are so hardcore that they give the give the finger to 90% of the mmo customer base.



And also, about purely player made content/storyline..

Prologue: Min-maxing the zerg 101

Chapter 1: How to best (ab)use the game mechanics
Chapter 2: My E-peen is bigger than yours
Chapter 3: No it's not!
Chapter 4: My e-honor
Chapter 5: LoL!
Chapter 6: Forum Warriors and too small log out button
Chapter 7: Zerg!
Chapter 8: lol RP
Chapter 9: Still abusing the game mechanics
Chapter 10: Newbs cry "Grief!"
Chapter 11: Vets cry "game mechanics!"
Chapter 12: How to abuse new content
Chapter 13: Learn 2 Play!
Chapter 14: BashsmackQQlolboastkillfragdestroy
Chapter 15: There's a story in this game? lololO!l!1

Epilogue: Internet Robots are important and everyone keeps stroking their e-peens

The End

=

+1 to OP

There is great potential for an actual storyline in this game. No matter if we the players are "only sparks" in a world far away.

Let's not dumb down the story to "who controls what base in what pvp island".
Not very epic.

-edited for clarity

12

(23 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

My issue is not nic/h.

This thread is (was) not about risk vs. reward.

The extra danger that comes with farming in beta has some value I guess, but it doesn't remove the fact that all pve is boring repetitive farming.

I just feel that this system could be utilized into actually interesting and engaging pve.

Easy way would be to bring in instances, but some people for some reason fanatically support open world pve and won't even consider anything that is instanced. So sorry in advance to those of you whose pulse just rose and veins on their forehead began to pulsate. But still.. instancing could give us assignments like:

"Hello Agent. We have discovered activity in a Pelistal Empires base that we thought abandoned. We need you to go there and hack into their satellite link system directly using the hacking interface module that will be provided to you. Department of Federated Industry loves you."

You are transported (I guess airlifting would not brake the lore?) to an instance similar to bases. You would need to sneak past patrolling and working Pelistalites towards your objective. Lots of options how you could tweak the mission.. maybe every time you are discovered and had to rely on blowing stuff up counter would tick and after certain limit your mission would be a failure.

Hacking open entrances to make the job easier. Hacking some defense systems to cause turrets to start shooting their own. Gaaah.. got stuck with hacking stuff, but you get the idea?

Other types of (instanced) assignments could be something like:

Convoy Escort: Sequer will be following you and you have to lead it through several ambushes. You have an option to command the sequer to stop so you can scout ahead and take care of the ambushing bots, disarm traps/mines. Find shortcuts.

Blow stuff up: Attack bases/Convoys/Patrols/Camps/Buildings .. Several maps with varied enemy placements. You would often need to choose between direct assault and fast escape or sneaky approach and surgical strike or just overwhelming firepower (for you farmers).

Defend the (supersecret) outpost: You, with help of some static defense turrets need to fend of waves of enemy attacks. Shootshootshoot, I hope you packed enough ammunition.

Etc.etc. And of course all could be done in teams. Some of this sorta stuff could be even done in open world pve, if we had some sorta Adventure Island (tm). Large enough so you could discover and do stuff/these sort of assignments there in relative peace. Might even make it pvp (low-sec style?) island, but finding pve.rs to blow up should require enough effort to not make it a happy gankland.

Several maps, several/or even random enemy placements, several difficulties for solo & team -> not so repetitive pve anymore..

13

(23 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

In my most humble and personal opinion this games system has so much potential for interesting, challenging and even meaningful pve, yet all we have is meaningless repetitive boring sh.. farming.

You farm npc spawns.. yay! They keep spawning and I keep shooting and looting and they keep spawning and I keep shooting and looting and they keep spawning and I keep shooting and … finger cramp.

You do assignments.. yay! I took an assignment to A and went there to press button and since I was cunning I took another assignment to B since it was close by A and went there and pressed button again. Now to receive my reward and see what they want me to do next.. hmm.. They want me to go to A and B again to press the same button.. brain melt.

What is this line of Sequers!? Maybe transportation is fun since half of the population seem to be mechatruckers.. lets give it a try! I put on my Geysier-Kronwerk cap and these four whatever things to my cargo hold and off to the teleport I go. And at my destination I deliver and get my rewards and take a new hauling adventure, so off to teleport I go and to my destination to deliver and pickup and deliver and.. why am I looking for a self-destruct button?

Thank god we have mining! I get to earn nic (to fund my pvp losses) without my brain screaming mercy since I can do it mostly AFK!

Am guessing that trading and manufacturing are quite ok means to get your nic if such activities happen to be your thing.. but I guess those are not really pve to begin with.

I can understand how some ppl enjoy finding the most effective way to do X and optimizing their nic/h or finding a way to deal with very difficult spawns.. but how long can that keep you entertained?

Does anyone even agree with me?

If so, how about we try to come up with ideas to put this games amazing potential to good use? All this farming is making baby arkhes cry rusty tears.

Am worried that lots of potential players are lost because of fail pve. On other hand if pve was challenging, interesting and even meaningful, it would make people want to stay and bring good reviews. I do realize that this game has just launched so there is an excuse for lack of content, but imho when mining is the most entertaining (pve) thing to do.. something is seriously wrong.

I will be posting my own suggestions how to make pve better later, if am not booed out of my own thread before I get around to do that.

14

(14 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

They would need to be veryvery ineffective and/or veryvery expensive and most importantly their use should be veryvery restricted.

And if not, we would soon be playing minefield online..

15

(31 replies, posted in Balancing)

First impressions are quite important, no?

When a new player goes on bounty hunting/recon assignment after completing the tutorial and is all happy and excited. And then, instead of an exciting battle and smell of burning metal he finds an assault bot and its alt on steroids circling around the spawn spewing missiles like there is no tomorrow stealing all the kills.

It is a problem and I find it quite strange that it has not been fixed yet. Sure there are plenty of exciting ways to to earn your nic around here. You can find a spawn that is not camped. You can click on the ground and activate your mining modules. You can transport items from a to b and be a robomechatrucker. You can take your calculator and optimize your production lines and search for cheap deals and gullible customers.

Of course I don't know for certain, but am guessing that quite a large percentage of players find pve pewpewing more to their liking than mining/production/trading/hauling.

On a related topic.. combat assignments and pve combat in general in this game is in very sad state. Borrring repetitive and all that unfortunately common mmorpg jazz. I really hope that the devs are bringing in more pew pew related toys and soon.

But new player experience should be top priority especially when you can remove lots of frustration from them by quite simple fixes.

And after some band aid fixes I hope the whole combat assignment and pve-pewpew system gets some love. Until then.. time to hop into my Sequer and enjoy the exciting ride.

Also, and imho most importantly, insulting others is bad m'kay..

I haven't even been to pvp islands yet but..

Wouldn't LOS blocking with mechs end up in some tanking silliness. You will get several walls of dedicated heavy armored mechs with several remote reps on them switching places and less armored mechs could just take a breather behind them when needed. And when things get really close up and personal.. two blobs colliding and everyones shooting everyone, for sure would take skill to manage that situation but maybe already bit too much skill...

What about if the los/friendly fire was only checked on relatively short distance and after that it doesnt matter what kind of metal wall is between you and your target. Blobs would still have to stay well organized to focus fire and avoid friendly fire.

And if it brings better pvp, why not missiles also check if someone is just in front of them. Maybe the "friendly fire range" of missiles could be much shorter than other weapons to bring in some realism.. .. or lets just change them into rockets with some guiding capabilities. Or something. I like something.