26 (edited by Ludlow Bursar 2013-01-16 18:27:32)

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

A number of replies in this thread imply or explicitly state the opinion that people are being "forced" into multi accounting by one game mechanic or another or even server population.

I have two accounts because I enjoy two different aspects of the game. I like to PvP and I like the Indy side of things too. I have only once in nearly two years used Stephanie (my indy toon) as a follow bot in PvP - although I have used Ludlow many more times to haul for Steph while she mines.

The point I'm making is that I'm not being "forced" into anything. I don't have two characters because it's necessary or so that one could support the other. I chose to do it so I could play two different games withing the same arena.

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Ludlow Bursar wrote:

A number of replies in this thread imply or explicitly state the opinion that people are being "forced" into multi accounting by one game mechanic or another or even server population.

I have two accounts because I enjoy two different aspects of the game. I like to PvP and I like the Indy side of things too. I have only once in nearly two years used Stephanie (my indy toon) as a follow bot in PvP - although I have used Ludlow many more times to haul for Steph while she mines.

The point I'm making is that I'm not being "forced" into anything. I don't have two characters because it's necessary or so that one could support the other. I chose to do it so I could play two different games withing the same arena.

I agree 100% with this post. Also the reason why I have 2 accounts.

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Don't force me to only use one account.   smile

The Gifter
Top  Killer 2013  - 01: 334 -- 17 -- 317  : Merkle
Top  Killer 2012  - 01: 027 -- 472 -- 445 : Merkle

Scarab Kill Count - 13

29 (edited by Alexander 2013-01-16 22:56:01)

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

All MMOs that allow you to multi-box (Pretty much every MMO) will be multi-boxed by players.

It's just like a machine, if you can increase your input then you can increase your output. It's often hard work and I find managing two Perpetuum accounts to be boring. To be fair I can now solo a group where others can't due to items and extensions but the point still stands that if people are comfortable paying more and playing more then let them.

No part of Perpetuum forces you to have multiple accounts, honestly multiple accounts are for those people who don't trust someone else to do the work they want them to do. You're meant to have multiple robots on the field and it's FAR better to have 10 robots piloted by 10 skilled players than 5 people playing 2 each.

Anyone that complains they need more than one accounts is a sad lonely person that can't make any friends or trust anyone. They have my pity. By all means feel free to play multiple accounts but don't whine that you're forced to.

T-E-A-M W-O-R-K

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Merkle wrote:

Don't force me to only use my account.   smile

fixed.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

No i havn't used it Merkle as do not play games this way, was never even tempted, if i have multiple accounts they will be manually used as intended.

32 (edited by Annihilator 2013-01-17 19:09:03)

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

the parts where you advocate multiboxing instead of multiplayer are all game mechanics that turn the robot using it, into "additonal module slot"-carrier with no true active role.

two examples got already mentioned in this topic:

  1. NEXUS support
    - High extension point costs. below T4 and below a certain extensionlevel hardly noticeable
    - high module fitting costs. Accu consumption, CPU and Reactor costs
    - high module production costs.

    its nothing someone would casually field or even train when he could use the EP and the module slot for more directly benefical parts (eg a tuning)
    i can hardly make suggestion here, aside the fact that they should scale with squad-size and give higher buffs. Needs cheaper base extension but synergies with other extension and module fit on same bot.
    Example: highly skilled Mining agent should be able to exchange a industrial tuning for a Nexus module to share his extension bonus with others. This would turn NEXUS buff into something expensive for a buff-only-follow-bot, but cheap for someone specialized into mining already

  2. Remote Sensor Amps
    - can fully replace sensor amp fit on the bot they are applied to
    - hardly needs attention aside of ECM breaking lock.
    - no LoS
    - buffs only 1 target per RSA, max 2 can affect one target

    While there are fits out there that sport spider-amping due to empty, else unused slots, like tyrannos or ewar bots/mechs, they are mostly dumb-down-follow bot modules. They simply replace sensor amps on a player controlled bot that has 2 free headslots for maximizing his role with either range extender or more damage tunings.

    Using them on an actively controlled bot also is either boring (when farming npcs in static spots) or you need to pay attention at the distance to the buffed bot and to not accidentally primary your target when using weapons on same bot. Either way, its not a teamplay element, but a multiboxing tool.

    removing the module and replacing it with misc slot target painter module would turn it into a non follow bot module and give field commander an active role.
    Debuff a target so it can be seen, locked faster and from further away by any1 in same squad.
    Just as example

I used those two examples, because they are meant as teamplay mechanics, while they hardly advocate teamplay.
You can extend that with capstable Remote repair, loot mechanics, etc... there are many aspects that are in for "forced teamplay", yet your teammate can be replaced by a passive alt-account.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Well ok, i have only one account. The bigass reason is.

Immersion.

Yeah, i could get three accounts multibox, and fly through the game like my *** is on fire....zooom, zoom, boom, boom.   It is not easy playing this way.....i did not have a sequer for months...with my ep going into hardpoints. Peeps would say get your miner and lets get some ore,,,"sorry i don't own one"...and i wont for a year or more. But i have had a blast when i have played.....(i take shore leave cuppla times a year) did not go to beta until i had advanced robotics 10.  and basic robotics 9.   The numbers with these two extensions,,,really do enable multi faction use of bots, with starting out of the box performance. 

Sooooo,,,there is something to get next.  Don't get in a hurry, savior the experience...while the grind is always there, grinding to a end game is really not a goal.  Picking the flowers, and evening walks, with random acts of violence is.   

The game beats me over the head some, seems unfair when facing multi boxed foes,,,but i don't want that changed.  It is not unfair when content of the game enables something.  I chose not to multi box,,,I can also choose not to engage multi boxed players. 

The one thing i clicked only once, because i instantly seen it was a sucker trade is prototyping.   

The do everything scenario happens in these games.  Some reasons have been posted. But the validity of this anomaly is without question.  I now can mine everything i want to.  I can make anything i have the research for.  I can haul medium volumes of commods. run ewars, combat bots from three factions. Was these different trades on my bucket list?  NO. You specked for a mech,, and your leader asks for a tackle bot. Argg. I would have all 10s on my combat mech if it was not used on miners, factory, stuff. But that is where the game takes me.

LOL,,,,i have dreams of a alt on my main toon,,,maybe some day.  If this was a one account sentrick game,,,we would see some love for no account alts....:)

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

No, its active roll is to follow me around and lock me up.  smile

The Gifter
Top  Killer 2013  - 01: 334 -- 17 -- 317  : Merkle
Top  Killer 2012  - 01: 027 -- 472 -- 445 : Merkle

Scarab Kill Count - 13

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

DEV Zoom wrote:

Celebro: from the top of my head, another idea would be to implement minimum effective range for support modules. This would make it hard for follow bots to use them since they always try to hug the target. It would also add some strategy for solo supports, but whether it would be more fun or not is another question.

I'm not at all convinced that multi-accounting is a problem. Nor that follow bots are a bad thing. If it is a problem, its mainly due to the ever enduring problem of Population.

The time based system will always incentivize multiple accounts. And for some, multi boxing provides further challenge and excitement.

People seem to forget that MMOs have diverse player mentalities and playstyles. You can't get everyone to act the same. AND, by nerfing support mechanics to hinder multi boxers you also hinder the very people you want to incentivise. How does nerfing support promote single account uses to specialze in that role?

Sparking to other games

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

I have my 3 accounts, but each are role specific .... My bots are usually self sufficient ...
The first one I have ever fitted a bot with a remote sensor amp was last week, and only because I had the space on a mech. My general fits are tailored for solo play and I rely on teammates for EWar when I'm dps'ing and vice versa. I prefer to have my characters specialized into their own careers. I fit bots to kill observers solo, and keep retrying until I'm successfully and they stop killing me. smile

The exception is my Indy. All my mining, production, research and prototyping, hauling, detecting is done on one toon. I can produce a lot, and mine a lot, but I have to go back and get the hauler to grab my can. And I really like this character and his setup.

Tl;Dr ... To each his own playstyle, but I certainly see single bot as viable.

37 (edited by Lobo 2013-01-21 00:18:09)

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

When I get another recruit that wants to follow me around with a near maxed nexus and sensor amps. Your d@mned right would love to leave mine at home cause I want to fraps at full screen and be able to see my video. Until the population increases and I get some more elite Jerks to fill some gaps then we will still need follows. And honestly I would bring my follow bot anyhow due to people losing bots. If you lose a nexus and don't have a back up your fleet might get screwed.

But the topic has been completely de-railed. There is no incentive to play with one account its a sandbox ffs grow up and sub a second account or stop eating lunch and drinking coffee for 2 days you can afford the dirt cheap sub and then you can likely get an ICE in your first month if you know what your doing.

Anonymous: lobo is the only hero left in this god foresaken game / :also, Lobo is god among men
http://killboard.sequer.nl/?a=agent-his … mp;month=7 Best month 104 to 1 k/d

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

But whats the incentive to only play with 2 accounts? smile I sure as hell feel like I need a third one if I want to accomplish something solo, and I'm not talking about PVP.

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

ive never felt like ive been forced to multi box. most times its been with 1 alt. I dont like running 2 accounts for PVP.

PVE how every is another thing entirely

True Pros make a Podcast to influence the Devs minds, 
The rest of you guys are Hacks tongue

PS. I got my Highways & stopped playing b4 they came in & have never used them! ...... Irony much ? tongue

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Burial wrote:

But whats the incentive to only play with 2 accounts? smile I sure as hell feel like I need a third one if I want to accomplish something solo, and I'm not talking about PVP.

Instead lets ask people why they feel the need to multi-account? Maybe this will shed the light on the subject that OP is trying to get at.

First lets look at how many accounts I have subbed.

5 total.
1 Yellow heavily E-war spec'd but can drive Seth Mk2 like a champ but my E-war power on the PVP field is Boss
1 Blue DPS, Masking and some others. Funny this was my last account subbed (EVE exodus) with the idea of being a spy... Lobo was just to good to be a spy.
1 Mixed Indy/Green This account was one of my original 2 when I first subbed was mining/harvesting when I started farming for Nic instead of mining it naturaly turned in to a follow bot then sheild skills transitioned in to ictus thoughts.
1 Green/Indy mix This started as a Alpha farm/market toon Gropho/Termis and indy nexus
1 Pure Indy when the move to Beta was made by my original indy toon I needed an Alpha producer/Miner to keep me and the corp (62nd) supplied with minerals with out losing Mk2 shineys on Betas or tons of travel time.

Now you know the back story as to why I have 5 accounts
Do I need all 5? No the 2 that were made for Alpha stuff ended up being on Beta and now all but one have been used for PVP. Have I kept all 5 subbed? No I let the 2 Alpha ones lapse but with the intro of ICE its too easy to keep them subbed. One day of Mining on alpha and hauling to the "right" places fetchs me 2-3 ices I've always enjoyed harvesting and with the islands not haveing one type of plant thats what my alpha indy toon does when I'm not PVP'ing or even when I am pvp'ing.

If I had to choose one and say its my main I wouldn't be able to.
I wouldn't actually say that I multi box PVP either as a follow bot besides the occasional re-lock/activate mobs its not that demanding. I have multi boxed PVP tho in the past with ictus/Kain and troiar/Arb but past locking and approaching and activating mods the switching to the other account and doing the same then monitioring distances. I wouldn't say I'm a good Multiboxer.

People create accounts because Sandboxs reward Min/Max and even with my accounts only 3/5 can be claimed as Min/Max. I do feel as tho I get rewards for my Min/Max efforts as well.

TL:DR
People make more accounts because they can because a kain pilot won't mine as good as a dedicated miner EVER.

Anonymous: lobo is the only hero left in this god foresaken game / :also, Lobo is god among men
http://killboard.sequer.nl/?a=agent-his … mp;month=7 Best month 104 to 1 k/d

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Whats the actual purpose of the Approach command in a WASD game? I understand its copypasted from EVE and now can't be removed because of OHNOESTHESUBS! mentality, but does it actually have any logical reason why it applies to other bots on the move?

Personally I don't even consider having a followbot to be "multiboxing" especially with the tools readily available to anyone with a better keyboard/mouse or a bit of intrawebz savvy.

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

i had follow mechanics in other WASD games too... its just an advanced auto-run. The difference in other games was, that you didnt "aim" by locking something, but with mouse aim and increasing your accuracy the longer you kept the target under your reticle... (dice-roll-fps mmo)

but syndic - i wont deny the copy/paste fact wink

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Removing approach solves most of the lazy multiboxing and leaves the possibility open to the players skilled enough to use multiple accounts at the same time. smile

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

or use application designed for multiboxing.

2nd Top Killer 2012
02: 061 -- 353 -- 292 : Xadhoom


"Annihilator no fix for crashes when fighting burial/merkle/xadhoom ?"

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Xadhoom wrote:

or use application designed for multiboxing.

This is what would happen.

Anonymous: lobo is the only hero left in this god foresaken game / :also, Lobo is god among men
http://killboard.sequer.nl/?a=agent-his … mp;month=7 Best month 104 to 1 k/d

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

As if it hasn't happened before and now. lol

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

Syndic wrote:

Removing approach solves most of the lazy multiboxing and leaves the possibility open to the players skilled enough to use multiple accounts at the same time. smile

you mean like auto-drop ore into field-container is not a game feature but can be done by any1 who is dare enough to macro it?

or like audio-ping for observer or hostile player showing up on landmarklist that is not a game feature but basic gaming experience for the gifted ones?

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

48 (edited by Gharl Incognito 2013-01-25 01:22:26)

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

The biggest incentive I can think of for runnig a single account is more economic control and player market centralization.  In game I have the same aversion to taxation that made Greece strong; this grew mainly out of seling bits and pieces to the NPC corps when I was Corpless and/or unable to create my own sell orders en masse.

If people were able to engage with the market easily and centrally there would be more incentive to play solo accounts and to do so on Beta and Gamma Islands.  As it is taxation on Alpha Islands is FAR too low and resources FAR too abundant; as a result farming NIC is really easy if you have enough accounts.

Even when the player count was quite high it was never really an issue to find the resources you wanted on Alpha islands... except Epitron of course(who cares if you can sell everyhing else for a mint?).  Oddly enough I now find that Gamma islands are, relative to size and travel times, quite low on resources.  I suppose this would be a good thing if they were more accessible for markeet orientated players.  Enter indiscrimminate ganking...

Sociorum, inimicos, omnes

-:does speak for NSA on the forums:-

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

for me, perpetuum is the first mmo, aside of oGame, that i ever had the feeling that i have an undeniable advantage using multiple accounts.

even those examples up there of players using only one account just underlining the statement that the game is not designed for multiplayer but multiple accounts (others may call it pay2win, since its exactly that - you get stuff with multiple accounts faster and easier when you pay more money... or in case of ice someone is paying for you)

Zoom, your argument is that because perpetuum is not twitch-based, multiboxing is an advantage.

This shows that even after Gremrods google ad analysis, and a little analysis of the most popular response to "this is eve with robots", you still have not much clue about what are the selling factors of your own game:

- its scifi
- it has big robots
- its a sandbox
- it has more twitch gameplay then EVE (Terrain, LoS)
- the grafic is not the worst
- non-frenchised content

Now - the only aspect AC has developed yet is the sandbox character of the game. The others are gradually fading away.

- scifi doesn't matter anymore, as that market is going to be filled with other alternatives soon.
- the selection of choices for robots is dull 3(+2) factions with ~1 robot per tier.
- sandbox aspect is undeniably good, yet IMHO lacking something
- Terrain & LoS factors are almost negated by non-LoS ewar and dull locking and energy mechanics
- I have seen much worse grafics
- you got the opportunity to create your own scifi-universe, but its unused as others already pointed out in F2P topic.

Personally, i wouldn't need two accounts, if i could collect EP on every agent on one account... just as bottom line.
and that is probably true for most other two-account-player too.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Incentives to play perpetuum with one account only?

This guy sure likes his mulit boxing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oc1D6cQjekk

Should convince him to join Perp with 100 accounts!

RIP PERPETUUM