• J-D
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Topic: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

1.) Implement client side timer on "Destroying" Items from personal cargo. Players are deleting loot before dying in PvP. This needs patched asap. Add a client side timer of 30 seconds pehaps for each item right clicked and "Destroyed". After the 30 second timer, if the item is still there (and agent robot not dead etc), run the existing deletion routine via your existing code server side.

2.) Decrease the range on the Landmarks window. WAY too overpowered atm. You have people running alternate accounts that are able to spread themselves out and exploit the long range of the landmarks window to spot incoming enemy etc. Tracking players should derive off a player skill model - like probing in EvE. For now though, as a simple fix, just decrease the distance. I am hoping that would be a simple config setting in the code, or if it's a hard coded value, you can simple change it.

These 2 changes are easy, and would help a TON right now.

Thanks!

-Big C

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  • M2S
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

The drop rate is 50%, so how do you know people are destroying their loot?  Well, the better question is how do you know its happening so rampantly?

This should just be changed to a sort of "recycle bin" we have in Windows.  When you delete something, it stays there as a ghost item that can be recovered if you die.  If it is overwritten by another item (fill your cargo again) the old item is lost forever.  As I understand it, our bots transport items in a sort of "molecular data" like the means we use for teleportation and docking in terminals.



For the landmarks/radar range issue, I hear things about having dynamic radar ranges but its still likely a long way off.  Imagine that you have a default radar strength and people can detect you based on your bot type at varying distances.  You also have extensions to raise/lower these values as well as modules that do the same.  This would bring rise to specialized scouts that would be hard to detect and a "radar NEXUS" in your group that spots enemies for the guys that dont have good radars.

I am Perpetuum's Most Dangerous Agent and an equal opportunity troll.
-> You just lost The Game <-
"Perpetuum sounds like a something I would stick up my *** for enjoyement." -Kaito Kurusaki

3 Reply by BigCountry (edited by BigCountry 2010-12-13 19:11:11)

  • J-D
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Had the same exploit in Darkfall. They patched it as a timer and it worked great. It's easy to do that way. No need to over engineer it.

I really like your range suggestion. That sounds very good.

But we need something fast and easy right now to fix whats happening.

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  • DEV
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Just to be clear neither of these are actual exploits.

1. Items in cargo are the property of their respective owners and they are free to do whatever they want with them. How does a PvP situation make a difference in ownership rights?

2. For the range "issue" there is a new system in the works.

  • BKK
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

"Fast and Easy"... i'm trying to image Gargaj's face about that offer.

Neoxx wrote:

The drop rate is 50%, so how do you know people are destroying their loot?  Well, the better question is how do you know its happening so rampantly?

i wanted to ask the same question. how do you know?

  • J-D
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

So what are the "risks and rewards" involved if someone can destroy their cargo before being killed? If I risk my *** going into an un-allied territory, take out a Sequer who deleted all his cargo because he knew he would die, how does that make the game any rewarding for me? It's all risk at that point...seems like an exploit...he is deleting his cargo because he knows he is going to die.....

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  • M2S
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

You cant destroy your equiped items.  And many-a-sequer have been killed and looted successfully.

Maybe now that you posted a thread about it more people will start deleting their cargo before they die.  And for that, we thank you.

I am Perpetuum's Most Dangerous Agent and an equal opportunity troll.
-> You just lost The Game <-
"Perpetuum sounds like a something I would stick up my *** for enjoyement." -Kaito Kurusaki
  • DEV
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Do you realize you are wanting something that is not yours in the first place? In my (humble) opinion they have every right to do what they want with their cargo since they worked their *** off for it.

  • M2S
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Your reward is.... you blew his sequer up and his cargo. costing him time and money.  Thats not your stuff until he is dead.  If you want loot for blowing stuff up, there are npc's to farm.  Go get em pirate! yarr

10 Reply by BigCountry (edited by BigCountry 2010-12-13 20:29:29)

  • J-D
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Your missing my point....you sold me on a game where its open pvp and looting. By allowing players to delete their cargo before death its no longer looting.
sad

I want to role play robin hood and take a squad into enemy territory searching for enemy Sequer hauling goods....I want to be able to destroy and loot the cargo...but game mechanics allow me not to if the pilot knows he can simply insta-delete it.

No other sandbox pvp game works like that.
sad

[img]http://www.cryptostudios.com/PO/Sigs/BC.jpg[/img]

11 Reply by BigCountry (edited by BigCountry 2010-12-13 20:31:39)

  • J-D
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Neoxx wrote:

Maybe now that you posted a thread about it more people will start deleting their cargo before they die.  And for that, we thank you.

So you now agree it's an exploit. hehe
big_smile

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  • M2S
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

DEV Zoom wrote:

Do you realize you are wanting something that is not yours in the first place? In my (humble) opinion they have every right to do what they want with their cargo since they worked their *** off for it.


you kidding right?

just stop and think about it for a second

thx

13 Reply by Vorgrim Scout (edited by Vorgrim Scout 2010-12-13 20:43:41)

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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Consider for a moment this example, Zoom.

If I rob an armored truck carrying gold bars, can they right click their cargo, selct all and delete it? No they can't and if I have gone to the trouble of being out on the roads with a bloody shotgun risking getting by head blown off by armed popo or going to jail for the majority of my sorry life, you better beleive I deserve that gold too.

The same holds true in Perpetuum. I'm not out there to flex my epeen or hurt people economically as some long game to dent their prodction or finances, I'm out there to get some goddamn riches.

Gimme the loot.

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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

BigCountry wrote:

Your missing my point....you sold me on a game where its open pvp and looting. By allowing players to delete their cargo before death its no longer looting.
sad

Even if they delete their cargo you still have a chance to loot their fit modules. That's still looting.

  • DEV
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Vorgrim:apart from the fact that real life references are always flawed since this is a game, can you tell me what exactly are you risking here if you kill a defenseless sequer? (Being in a PvP area doesn't count, it is not specific to this case).

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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Vorgrim Scout wrote:

Consider for a moment this example, Zoom.

If I rob an armored truck carrying gold bars, can they right click their cargo, selct all and delete it? No they can't and if I have gone to the trouble of being out on the roads with a bloody shotgun risking getting by head blown off by armed popo or going to jail for the majority of my sorry life, you better beleive I deserve that gold too.

The same holds true in Perpetuum. I'm not out there to flex my epeen or hurt people economically as some long game to dent their prodction or finances, I'm out there to get some goddamn riches.

Gimme the loot.

One word: scuttling

17 Reply by Vorgrim Scout (edited by Vorgrim Scout 2010-12-13 20:59:39)

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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

DEV Zoom wrote:

Vorgrim:apart from the fact that real life references are always flawed since this is a game, can you tell me what exactly are you risking here if you kill a defenseless sequer? (Being in a PvP area doesn't count, it is not specific to this case).

Ofc its specific to this case. I'm out there on my own risking my robot, mods and ammo for the opportunity to get something better from reckless corps with 140+ agents on their teams, full scale production at tier 3 facilities and alliances.

Don't you think I deserve a sequer load of loot if they don't protect it adequately?

18 Reply by BigCountry (edited by BigCountry 2010-12-13 21:04:13)

  • J-D
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

DEV Zoom wrote:

Vorgrim:apart from the fact that real life references are always flawed since this is a game, can you tell me what exactly are you risking here if you kill a defenseless sequer? (Being in a PvP area doesn't count, it is not specific to this case).

Yes it is. It's exactly specific to this case because a PvP area is the only place where this exploit is happening.

It does not apply to the PvE areas. My suggestions had nothing to do with those areas.

Once your player base realizes they can simply right click and destroy their cargo before death it's going make the PvP zones even more baron. You might as well fix/patch it now man before it really affects the game....

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  • -CS-
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

If something like this is implemented, it had better damn well work for the cargo driver too; That is if they delete thier cargo, and you don't kill them, then they can undelete it and continue on thier way.

Of course, drivers will delete/undelete and work the timer and if attacked just let it run out, and you still don't get your loot. So lets just leave it like it is.

The next counter to any inventory based thing, is to drop a field container; which you'll than ask to prevent drivers from dropping containers while in combat. And then drivers will come up with something else.

Ocean pirates had to deal with this same issue, throwing stuff over the side so no one can have it, or just smashing up the cargo.

The correct answer is for Pirates to go around almost killling cargo bots until drivers don't know if you are going to kill them or let them go, so they have to make a decision about deleting that 200 Million NIC load.

  • AXE
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Guys, this is a game right. But you not saying that this is impossible. If I hauled my *** for all this stuff for 2 hours and you will get it for free? NO. Why? Because I have explosives placed all over my cargo compartment - if I see that situation is dare - I will blow up all my loot so you don't get anything. Every ship in sci-fi and whatever has this feature - self-termination. I see that there is no way out for me - so I, as a rightful owner of my *** - have a right to destroy it - in result - you get crap LOL. Its sort of a relief for me that you blew me up but at least you won't get anything. Mehehehehe.

You can destroy stuff in EVE too can't you? I never tried, since I didn't think about it. Now if I am about to blow - I am destroying all my cargo. THANKS FOR THIS AMAZING IDEA! lol

  • PIRATE
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Field containers should be destructable on beta island and have atleast the 50% droprate players do. This has been brought up before.

Give them 30k hps or whatever.

22 Reply by BigCountry (edited by BigCountry 2010-12-13 21:15:54)

  • J-D
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

You cannot do this in EvE or Darkfall. If EvE you jettison the cargo out into space. In Darkfall they implemented timers on item deletion from personal bags (cargo). It was exploited in that game and they fixed/patched it within the first few weeks of release.

It's lame. And its an exploit.

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  • -CS-
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Wait.. if I have 80U of material in my cargo, and you blow me up with a mech, at best your only going to be able to haul away a few U of it anyway; hardly enough to make it worth it if its materials, and if its a whole bot you'll need another Seq.

No corporation is going to use transports to move combat components anyway when a Mech can carry them and defend itself.

Killing transport is about denying the other corp that material, not about pirating.

If you want cool PVP stuff, kill other bots.

  • -CS-
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

I agree about the field containers being destructable, it gives the corp time to send out a kill party if they have one available.

  • PIRATE
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Re: 2 Exploits Need Patches For ASAP To Fix PvP (Easy Fixes)

Arga wrote:

Killing transport is about denying the other corp that material, not about pirating.

Says you. I say its all about pirating.