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Has anyone worked this out yet? I've been messing about with convergent series, natrual logarithms and all sorts but my maths isn't good enough to "see" it yet. Here are some key numbers in case it leaps out at anybody. Numbers in brackets I'm pretty sure are correct but I can't test them since they involve fractions of ME points.
Points: %
0: 150%
25: 140%
(33.3333: 137.5%)
50: 133.3333%
(66.6666: 130%)
100: 125%
150: 120%
200: 116.6666%
300: 112.5%
It suddenly leapt out at me when i noticed that at 250 points the ratio was 1.1428571 which (as everyone knows) is the decimal equivalent of 1/7 - formula is:
ME = 1+(1/( (p/50) +2) ))
Where ME=material efficiency and p=points. This applies to prototype, factory and refining.
I knew it was a simple 
Implications:
To two decimal places 100% efficiency is not achieved until 9901 point (clearly unachievable).
With a 325 point factory, max skills and a 200 point CT (only achievable with a good calllibration lab and a high-tech factory with upgrades on gamma you will only achieve an ME of 1.067114.
Methinks that the curve is a little to shallow at the high end.
do you have formulas for the rest as well? including the time ratio calculation?
I don't have formulas for recycling, repair or time but if I was provided with enough of the correct type of raw data I'm sure I could work it out quite quickly.
Alternatively you could ask DEV Alf. I heard a rumour that he was thinking of making formulae public anyway. Is this true, Alf?
Celebro linked a graph a couple days ago, an official one showing all (3) lines.
I'll try to find and relink it.
Edit:
http://content.perpetuum-online.com/ima … points.png
this graph doesn't have the same slope as yours. On of them is incorrect, I'm actually leaning toward the official dev graph being out of date.
this graph doesn't have the same slope as yours.
Tough to tell exactly from that graph but I'd say the slope is the same. The formula I worked out for ME on Refining, prototyping and factory is 100% correct. No doubt. (Unless, of course, they've changed it since test-server).
I didn't collect data on time when test was open and I wish I had now but feed me numbers and I'll work it out.
A look at that graph and I think the formulae for Repair and Recycle are:
Repair = 3/( (p/25) +4 )
Recycle = 1 - (3/( (p/25) +4 ))
ofc, the graph does not provide me with particularly acurate numbers so if someone could test in game (I'm on lunch break atm and won't have much time in the coming days either) that would be grand.
I guessing that repair formula is also multiplied by some sort of base cost for the mod in question and the amount of repair required to get a final figure in NIC.
both are off
fyi: repair ratio shows you the discount(!)
-> 0% discount means 100% costs; 75% discount means 25% costs
your formula calculates the costs, not the discount
it has to be 1 - {} as well
input:
repair points: 75 -> 42%; 15 -> 13%
recycle: 255 -> 71%; 140 -> 58%
Thanks for those numbers, Chris.
From the testing I've done, though, the formulae check out. For example:
1xT3 Cargo scanner needs 125 Espitum to build. At a 110 points I recover 80 which is:
1- (3/ ((p/25)+4)) = 0.6428572
0.6428572*125 = 80.35715
Floor (80.35715) = 80
The % on the facility in game reads 52% but I'm pretty sure this is supposed to refer (as it used to pre Industry 2.0) to the progress towards maximum achievable points. Although in this case that doesn't seem to work because by my calculations maximum achievable points is 275 so who knows what that 52% figure is.
The formulae, however, do work.
apparently your repair formula works its just that the ratio shown ingame is misleading
This might be a bug, but the material ratio for recycling does not correspond with the actual material ratio.
/edit: do any of the ratios shown actually work? This is very confusing.
For example:
- The recycling window shows a ratio of 71% and a gropho costs 5000 briochit but I would get 3943 back, which is 78.86%.
- 58%: 3437 back -> 68.74%
- 55%: 3333 back -> 66.66%
This means Ludlows formula for recycling is correct.
As a result of my recent research, I got the time efficiency formula at hand in case somebody's interested.
The formula is (0.9 + 90 / ( time ratio + 100)). It's derived from the ME formula, as it can be also written as 1 + (1 / ((time ratio / 50) + 2) * (1.6 - time ratio / 500). Time efficiency multiplier crosses 1.0 @ 800pts.
So for factory, it's Item base time * (0.9 + 90 / (facility time ratio + CT time ratio + 100)).
For reverse engineering, the formula is 4000 seconds * required decoder level * (0.9 + 90 / ((facility time ratio + bonus time ratio) + 100)), bonus time ratio is the extra ratio you get for your CT if you use higher leveled decoder than required.
For prototyping, the formula is Item base time * 10 * (0.9 + 90 / (time ratio + 100)).
Results are always round down (a.k.a FLOOR'd) as is expected.
As for basetimes, ammo is 800 seconds, simple items 2000, intermediate items 4000, advanced items 8000, light bots 12000, assault bots 16000, mechs 32000 and heavy mechs 40000.
did i already mention - really miss the "like" button in this forums
good work Tazca - will you contribute it into the wiki?
Thanks, it seems that all manufacturing related formulae are missing from the wiki; I'll add the contents of this thread to the Formulas page.
Worked out the armour resistance formula the other day too:
1- (1/((Points/100)+1))
Just in case anyone's interested.
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