Re: EP retrieval feature

-1

An idea that would attract a few, but scare away many more.
It's good for a business to maintain customer loyalty, the OP's idea promotes the total opposite.

Re: EP retrieval feature

- 1 Nonos

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Re: EP retrieval feature

I see your idea behind it and I do agree but with that I see alot of gate scouts being "back payed" to new players and old accounts of friends turning into logi bots and 4th account miners

Re: EP retrieval feature

HELLL NO!

Re: EP retrieval feature

Here's my problem with this proposal -- it isn't in AC's best interest -- this business model makes them more money by pressuring people that may want to take a break to continue to remain subbed on the 'just incase' they come back factor.

Allowing this would likely be lost monthly revenue for a game that already has a minimal amount of subscriptions...sure.. it may provide boosts on the off chance someone does this.. but overall, currently, i think it would be a poor business decision.

Re: EP retrieval feature

OP ... although I understand exactly where you are coming from, and while in theory it could be a short term cash infusion for AC, please consider the following.

If this system was implemented, would any of the current player base bother with 1 year resubs?  All that do this currently are "gambling" that the game will survive, grow, or PBS or artillery or whatever particular feature that the resubbing player is hoping for will be implemented.  If the resubbing player doesnt like the current game state .. why resub again for a long period of time when he can simply wait, see and rate any improvement, and if he likes the game resub and buy back all the EP he has missed out on.  The player will now have no risk whatsoever.

AC would actually lose a ton of steady revenue, not because the product is bad, but simply because there would be no reason for long term resubbing.  Buying back potential lost EP, even at a premium or penalized rate, does go against the fundamentals of the game. It is completely different than a player who joins a game, buys a sub for a year, and doesnt play for the first 11 months.  The player's incentives and priorties completely change.


Takeo, I told you never to post on the forums again until you take your meds! Remember!?! Bad Takeo!

Re: EP retrieval feature

you make a fair point atticus.

I'd actually like to hear what AC has to say about it.

Re: EP retrieval feature

Atticus wrote:

OP ... although I understand exactly where you are coming from, and while in theory it could be a short term cash infusion for AC, please consider the following.

If this system was implemented, would any of the current player base bother with 1 year resubs?  All that do this currently are "gambling" that the game will survive, grow, or PBS or artillery or whatever particular feature that the resubbing player is hoping for will be implemented.  If the resubbing player doesnt like the current game state .. why resub again for a long period of time when he can simply wait, see and rate any improvement, and if he likes the game resub and buy back all the EP he has missed out on.  The player will now have no risk whatsoever.

AC would actually lose a ton of steady revenue, not because the product is bad, but simply because there would be no reason for long term resubbing.  Buying back potential lost EP, even at a premium or penalized rate, does go against the fundamentals of the game. It is completely different than a player who joins a game, buys a sub for a year, and doesnt play for the first 11 months.  The player's incentives and priorties completely change.


Takeo, I told you never to post on the forums again until you take your meds! Remember!?! Bad Takeo!

Found my meds!  great points from many against, and i am leaning that way too except; the ability to gain back SOME EP with a severe reduction in what you could have had if you subed straight through....ie. 50% of the EP back max 30 days payed for back sub and when you pay for at a 6 month new sub..or other may encourage some to come back and not feel like they are soooo far behind just because they thought there were greener pastures but realized Perp rocks!

run on sentences ftw! big_smile

34 (edited by Celebro 2012-01-26 17:22:12)

Re: EP retrieval feature

I will assume pvp players want more targets, but not at the cost of a level playing field for some.

Most see this as pay to win, but don't realise that a player with 5 accounts has a great advantage over a 1 or 2 account player, its is pay to win already to a certain extent. Anyways I gain nothing from this change and I doubt anything will be changed regarding EP.

I still think EP is slightly over rated.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: EP retrieval feature

...ie. 50% of the EP back max 30 days payed for back sub and when you pay for at a 6 month new sub..or other may encourage some to come back and not feel like they are soooo far behind

thats one of the things i had had in mind making my little list before.

Of course, the general idea is hard work with only small benefits - and no one ever said to implement it asap - but some of its negative points can already be reversed just by putting up the right conditions.

Pros:

Takeo Prime wrote:

If a guy buys a years sub and never plays for 11 months then come on and places all that EP, he has not effected any game play that whole time.

-> an inactive account that had subbed just once and comes back can spend masses of EP at once; same with those guys that ragequitted, tried to misuse gamemechanics, maybe even tried to destroy the game/community... if they had a years sub - they could come back anytime without any punishment;
players that had been loyal active players that began out the same time as them (maybe couldn't afford a year) put their everything into the game but because they couldn't immediately continue their sub for reasons whatsoever are "penalized" with less EP than the inactive account -> so why not reward them by giving them the chance to buy a little bit of their absence time back;

Celebro wrote:

Developers could use the extra cash and some players would actually not feel left behind.

Problems:

  1. EP buyable in general, EP extends over the time of your subscription;
    only already player that had a sub can buy back EP for a certain break time between their subs -> already gives the first two limitations: trials can't buy EP, EP-payback limited by unsubscribed days in between subscriptions

  2. player leave game until a patch comes that fits them and buy back the lost EP of absent time;
    limit payback days to a maximum and also the unsubscribed time - for example: limit is set to 30 days EP-payback (my initial post), if you don't resubscribe within those thirty days no option to get a payback; why a maximum of thirty days? normally big game-changing patches come only every two months.

  3. Problem that may result: "Oh, I just bought back the EP, resubbed for a month, vanish again, then buy it back again";
    minimum timespan where the account had been continuously subscribed (without a day/second break) to enable the option (had set it previously to 6 months because a normal player wouldn't count as new anymore then) - example: player has subscribed for 6 months, got his last paycheck two-three weeks too late, therfore wasn't able to resub immediately, then subbed again and bought back his lost time, next time possible would be only after additional 6 months of continuous subscription

  4. "no risk whatsoever.." - others sub for a year unknowingly if the game runs until then;
    option only available if resub for more than just one month (like 3 or 6 months), evtly penalty because of the lower risk - why? to gain the possibility to pay for absence time the player has to take another risk before with subbing over a longer time;
    > still, of course the risk is lower than the player who paid for a year

  5. Problem: less full-year codes bought?
    Who buys one year-subs and why? The main points of one year subs is the discount and the big resubbing stress less, isn't it?
    So topic price: buying back EP costs you something, at least for 30 days a full month without any discounts -> result: player has to pay more than for a years sub;
    topic stress: having a month break from the game, you won't only have to resub (buy/pay code, redeem it) but in addition to that also activate and buy the lost time back = double stress

Still remaining Cons: (sry, dunno a comeback to them hmm )

  • less risk

  • how to code such a thing without backdoors that could lead to an EP-store and without destroying the fundamentals of the game?

Atticus wrote:

Buying back potential lost EP, even at a premium or penalized rate, does go against the fundamentals of the game.

Re: EP retrieval feature

-> an inactive account that had subbed just once and comes back can spend masses of EP at once;

This is exactly why not, and the reason account resets were also bad. EP is gained a little at a time, and waiting builds up a sense of anticipation and a period of time when you're not optimized, because you need to save up 60,000 EP to get level 10, and allows other players to get to level 7 in the same time period, balancing the field between newer and older accounts.

Placing large amounts of EP into extensions at one sitting is a huge advantage, and exploitable for just this purpose.

37 (edited by Arjha Shanoo 2012-01-26 19:59:10)

Re: EP retrieval feature

... with inactive accounts there I meant those with active subs but not playing after one month; the point with the EP-retrieval to hinder those masses of bought EP is under Problems...

Re: EP retrieval feature

fantazmythe wrote:

you make a fair point atticus.

I'd actually like to hear what AC has to say about it.

They may want to change the EP system at sometime, but by posting any type of response to one method or another, they open themselves up for the rules lawyers at a future date.

basically, they have nothing to gain or lose by responding or not; so they probably won't (about the concept, Zoom may troll me just for fun though).

Re: EP retrieval feature

fantazmythe wrote:

you make a fair point atticus.

I'd actually like to hear what AC has to say about it.

They have spoken. No subscription=no EP.

Inappropriate signature.

40 (edited by Lobo 2012-01-27 11:05:37)

Re: EP retrieval feature

Arga wrote:

In general, I don't like EP threads. The whole game is about persistance, and that centers around 1 EP per minute of subscribbed time. Regardless of the thread being about new players trying to buy up or old players trying to buy back, its about trying to manipulate the core game mechanic to get around it's limitations.

QFT
Arga as always has a great way of explaining most things this is one of the ones that is a 100% correct answer.

Sorry I do like the idea but I must go -1 I to lost about 2 weeks of EP when I had no interwebs at the house due to public works blowing our entire city block main phoneline boxes, but I lived with it.

Anonymous: lobo is the only hero left in this god foresaken game / :also, Lobo is god among men
http://killboard.sequer.nl/?a=agent-his … mp;month=7 Best month 104 to 1 k/d

Re: EP retrieval feature

This is not an EP retrieval system, its an EP store, there is no 'lost EP' to retrieve. Only subbed accounts get EP. It doesn't matter if you've never subbed to the game or you subbed for a couple months a while back you still can't buy more EP.

I will assume pvp players want more targets, but not at the cost of a level playing field for some.

No, its a game with time based skilling, the playing field will never be level, thats kind of the point. With the current system it will however be fair, 1 min of subbed time = 1 EP for everyone, if that no longer applies to some players, thats not fair. You could make it fair again by letting everyone buy EP, but personally I really wouldn't want that.

Re: EP retrieval feature

As a player who played in beta/launch but didn't sub until the end of last year, it would be awesome to hand over some $$ and buy a whole stack of EP, but I don't see it working well.

There is obviously a sense of entitlement to the EP (especially if you are subbed for ages, miss a month due to budget problems and come back) and the argument that more money for AC is a good thing seems reasonable, but the problem is that you remove one of the major disincentives of unsubscribing, that the EP will be lost 'for ever'.