Topic: Tuners for all

This post is a request to add tuners for more module types to the game. Currently we have industrial tuners, missile tuners, magnetic gun tuners, laser gun tuners, and assault cannon tuners. I think we could use tuners to give bonuses to:

ECM cycle time | strength
Sensor Suppressor  cycle time | strength
Energy Drain cycle time | amount 
Demobilization cycle time | strength
Neutralization cycle time | amount 

These are some examples but the general idea is to allow for more focused specialization for players who want play in specific roles.

I do not think this would un balance the current system because there are currently tuners already in game and that does not cause an unbalance in current play.

….. more to come

Re: Tuners for all

The main difference between your proposals and existing tuners is that you're proposing some tuners that affect head-slots. It doesn't by any means guarantee an imbalance, just that there would be some very different choices involved with fitting those tuners.

If you keep all the tuners as head-mounted, for example, then you've got head slot conflicts: (e.g.) an ECM+Tuner vs 2xECM choice. Each of those combos needs a role for the new mod to have any meaning. Alternately, you could move those tuners to other slots, but that again creates different fitting choices than with the current Arm/Head system.

Not that any of this is bad. I love variety, so I can definitely get behind this. big_smile

Re: Tuners for all

Yes, I would suggest that the modules that boosted head slot modules be misc arm slots

Re: Tuners for all

So Zeniths and Vagabonds will get theyr hands they want so much big_smile

Have a productive day, runner!
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Re: Tuners for all

Line wrote:

So Zeniths and Vagabonds will get theyr hands they want so much big_smile

IKR, so ill stop seeing mechs running around with no arms looks so silly

Re: Tuners for all

well, i made somewhere a topic with the request to have most ewar modules in MISC slots instead of headslots.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
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Re: Tuners for all

Annihilator wrote:

well, i made somewhere a topic with the request to have most ewar modules in MISC slots instead of headslots.

Moving EW to misc slots would make some sense. Then you get a nice role distinction between slot types. I.e. heads are scanning and boosting, chassis is targeted stuff, legs are defense/mobility. Something along those lines anyway.

Re: Tuners for all

We could use more stuff to shove into our slots.

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Re: Tuners for all

Arilou wrote:
Annihilator wrote:

well, i made somewhere a topic with the request to have most ewar modules in MISC slots instead of headslots.

Moving EW to misc slots would make some sense. Then you get a nice role distinction between slot types. I.e. heads are scanning and boosting, chassis is targeted stuff, legs are defense/mobility. Something along those lines anyway.

yes please ... it annoys me to no end that a demob is headslot :-)

Re: Tuners for all

Demob can looks like a hand throwing lasso big_smile

Have a productive day, runner!
R.I.P. Chenoa, you'll never be forgotten.
DEV Zoom: Line, sorry, I was away for christmas.
http://perp-kill.net/?m=view&id=252086

Re: Tuners for all

Then whats the point of having a vagabond with only 3 legslots, 3 chassis, and 5 head if all EW goes to chassis??  Im ok for the EW tuning going to misc, than can make sense, and id like to have "arms" on my vaga too, but lol all EW to chassis really that doesnt make any sense for me.

Headslot number is the determining factor for EW capabilities...  Otherwise a kain (with his 4 misc chassis slots) would be more "EW fittable" than a vagabond (2 misc chassis slots). Lol at this idea...

Re: Tuners for all

If the change would happen, there is no problem with changing the slots on the kain.

<GargajCNS> we maim to please

Re: Tuners for all

Oh ok and why not change everything in the game to fit the "superior idea" of messing all the slot type balances for every type of bots/mechs, btw your telling me that, despite the fact ive nearly maxxed all ecm related skills, i would (well i know that will never happen but heh i just feel like to give my pov) in that case be able to fit only 2 of them.... ahah really guys sometimes i wonder...  you gladly ask to change everything in the fitting world so you can fit a demob and have all your head slots?  Clearly its something asked by light/assault pilots that are annoyed to have so few headslots, so they dont have to lose one on demob.  Just try to get some perspective about the fact everyone play the game differently.

Re: Tuners for all

Chill man. We are discussing, not forcing anything.

<GargajCNS> we maim to please

Re: Tuners for all

Ewar parts should really have to be mounted like weapons IMHO it just makes sense be cause it is a WEAPON after all, if it is only electronic.

Re: Tuners for all

Cobalt wrote:

Then whats the point of having a vagabond with only 3 legslots, 3 chassis, and 5 head if all EW goes to chassis??

Oh come on... so go 3 head, 5 chassis.

Is the Ictus broken? It's EW. It uses misc slots for its EW. But it only has 3 misc and 3 heads; Kain has an extra misc. So is the Kain a better neut bot than an Ictus? Try to guess why not.

Were you raised by drones or something? Grow an imagination and join the conversation.

17

Re: Tuners for all

Cobalt wrote:

Oh ok and why not change everything in the game to fit the "superior idea" of messing all the slot type balances for every type of bots/mechs, btw your telling me that, despite the fact ive nearly maxxed all ecm related skills, i would (well i know that will never happen but heh i just feel like to give my pov) in that case be able to fit only 2 of them.... ahah really guys sometimes i wonder...  you gladly ask to change everything in the fitting world so you can fit a demob and have all your head slots?  Clearly its something asked by light/assault pilots that are annoyed to have so few headslots, so they dont have to lose one on demob.  Just try to get some perspective about the fact everyone play the game differently.

This is being asked for by EW / Spec ops pilot. I rarely pilot lights or assaults. it just makes for a good game when you can add tuners for all types of items. ill let the DEV's figure out where they want to fit modules so it works with their plans. I just want to be able to boost my EW skills with tuners because skills only go so far, just as is the case with weapon damage and mining yield. 

They can leave everything as is and make the ew tuners fit in to turret or mics slots IDC. but EW pilots dont have the same boosting capabilities as pure dps pilots which is in a way unbalanced.

18 (edited by Arga 2011-08-25 19:16:07)

Re: Tuners for all

But since items like drainers are currently balanced for use without tuners, if you add in the ability to tune them, they'll need to drop the base drain (for example). Then your looking at needing to add the weight of a tuner to get back to the original values, with T3 adding only like 2% and T4 4% (since tuners are per bot that % is added to each installed drainer for example). Adding more fits is good, but there has to be that negative also.

Re: Tuners for all

Tux wrote:

They can leave everything as is and make the ew tuners fit in to turret or mics slots IDC.

  Im 100% ok with you as i said lets have tunings for more modules type, its a good idea and improve diversity.

Arilou wrote:

Oh come on... so go 3 head, 5 chassis.

Thats exactly what im telling, now your idea imply to modify slot numbers and positions for a mech, and if another guy comes up with similar reclamations as me, you ll say: "Ok guys, lets just modify this too!" If your asking for something (feature request right), i assume you already asked yourself if this something would not completely change balance/gameplay in the game, in such a way it would denaturate it completely.

Arilou wrote:

Is the Ictus broken? It's EW. It uses misc slots for its EW.

Some dont understand what electronic warfare does mean it seems...  Ictus is specialized in draining/neuting, wich is NOT EW, even if its a EW mech.  Look closer at ingame help, drainer/neutralizer are engineering. Ictus has bonus to it, but in no way it uses EW on chassis.

Your asking me for more imagination, but you seems to have difficulties admitting an EW mech has mostly Engineering bonuses...

And for the ones saying its logical to have EW mods fitted on chassis rather than on headslots, well were not from the same logic then.

  EW only purpose is to disrupt target specific capacities, like speed, sensor range etc...  To do so they send particular energetic signals, but as signal they emmit very low energy. So its logical to think they can be enclosed INSIDE the robot hull.

On the contrary any module type that need an EXTERNAL shape, like weapons, any type of HEAVY energy transfer, gathering modules etc... all those ones can only be fitted on chassis.

At least its how i guess the devs thinked of it, and for me its pure logic.

Re: Tuners for all

Cobalt, i wonder why in real life EWAR equipment always needs dedicated Vehicles/aircrafts and is still visible from outside because it needs stuff like antennas or external components to actually work and not f*ck up the own internal systems.

ontop of that, multi-purpose aircrafts equip ECM pods on wingmounts, ...

theres enough reason why those rather heavy modules should not be located in HEADSLOTS when the robots head has not the shape of the classic giger-Alien.

how many ewar modules does an EWAR mech really field atm if its in a roaming mech group? more then three?  If ECM, supressor or demob could be improved by tunings - would it be necessary to use more then one of those ewar modules on one target?

without even calculating, i would say - a vagabond with two ECM Arms, and a supressor-shoulder mounted, with three EWAR tuning and two sensor amps, would be MUCH MORE powerfull then any current Vagabond fit, and even more versatile becaue of the high number of headslot it has then for stuff like masking, detection, eccm, interference....

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

21 (edited by Arilou 2011-08-26 03:50:21)

Re: Tuners for all

Some dont understand what electronic warfare does mean it seems...  Ictus is specialized in draining/neuting, wich is NOT EW, even if its a EW mech.  Look closer at ingame help, drainer/neutralizer are engineering. Ictus has bonus to it, but in no way it uses EW on chassis.
Your asking me for more imagination, but you seems to have difficulties admitting an EW mech has mostly Engineering bonuses...

hmm Well, if we're being pedantic... "Class: Advanced mech specialized in electronic warfare." That's the in-game Ictus description, even though it only has bonuses in neuts, drainers and shields. 2 options: these are EW bonuses or you can't trust the game descriptions. Your conclusion is false or your logic invalid.

Arga gets at an important problem. You can find ways to boost all EW (or "engineering" roll) bots equally. But that boosts them relative to everything else.

If EW tuning works like weapon tuning, then EW w/o tuning should be worse than now, with tuning it could be a little better than now. I.e. choose focused effectiveness or versatility. Alternatively, EW tunings could be like scripts in EVE: use them to trade some of one ability for a boost in another. With made up numbers: 2xSS = 20% lock time, 40% range damp; 1xSS+1xTuner = 10% lock time, 50% range damp, 2x acc. drain for the SS.

That last bit is also, IMO, the only real way for the conflict between head-slot tuners and head-slot EW make any sense.

Past this point, we're into theory geek number crunching. Not worth the effort for a "someday maybe" feature. smile

22 (edited by Norrdec 2011-08-26 12:10:14)

Re: Tuners for all

One thing I just though about with the EW mods in the chassis slots.
"Normal" bots wouldn't be able to use one or 2 of those mods in regular roams. Yeah it's awesome to have a dedicated bot for that, but 8 assaults with an ecm each is pretty bad *** too.

<GargajCNS> we maim to please

Re: Tuners for all

why not norrdec? a normal assault roam, replacing one weapon with a neut or drainer could kill  erp tank bots with ease.

why should this not work for ecm, demob and supressor too? grofo and mesmer and tyrannos having unused misc slots for that.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Tuners for all

Yeah, that's true, I am an ECM user, keep forgeting about the neuts wink

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