1 Topic by Purgatory (edited by Purgatory 2011-04-13 23:51:20)

  • Infini
  • Agent
  • Offline

Topic: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

The CPU issues of the tyrannos never became apparent to me until I tried to fit a tyrannos MK2. With the tyrannos everything has always managed to fit, then again I have mostly maxed cpu skills.

What I found is that the gropho doesn't suffer the same problem, I then realised why that is when looking at the cpu/reactor for the tyrannos and gropho.

Tyrannos CPU 300
Tyrannos reactor 900

Gropho CPU 380
Gropho reactor 1025

The gropho has about 27% more CPU than the tyrannos
The gropho has about 14% more reactor than the tyrannos

And there it is, the tyrannos obviously doesn't have enough CPU, you can see that by looking at how much more CPU the gropho gets than the tyrannos compared to reactor, either that, or the gropho has way too much CPU, but then again nerf that and you'll just be ruining the gropho too.

There is definetly a problem with CPU for the tyrannos if I, with close to maxed out CPU skills, can't even use all of my slots on a tyrannos MK2, and it's not like i'm fitting all T4, i'm using a mixture of T2, T3 and T4.

For reference I have Data processing 10, optimized weapon usage 8, optimized armor usage 6 - I saw no point in training armor usage higher as even if I train it to level 10 i'll save maybe 2-3 cpu max.

  • BKK
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

i think your argumentation wont reach DEV Alf the way you have set it up.

I agree that the tyrannos could need ~10 more base CPU to be in line with its other parameters.

Facts:

  • Missile launcher do need relative high CPU, low reactor

  • Robots CPU/Reactor values are set around the factions primary weapons.
    eg. Laser bots got more reactor then anything because lasers need that

  • Missile bots are also pretty headslot-heavy (except EWAR)

  • Headslot modules primary attribute is CPU

  • Tyrannos has not more CPU then Kain, which is unlogical if you consider the previous facts

  • sidenote: Gropho MK2 will face Reactor-shortage if try to fit all slots

Purge - i wonder - do you want to fit drainer or neuts into the two misc slots?
Just asking because you didnt list the extension for lowering CPU for those...

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear
  • DEV
  • Developer
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

Annihilator wrote:

i think your argumentation wont reach DEV Alf the way you have set it up.

I always read the posts cool

"Rock is OP. Paper is okay." - Scissors

4 Reply by Purgatory (edited by Purgatory 2011-04-14 16:51:13)

  • Infini
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

Annihilator wrote:

i think your argumentation wont reach DEV Alf the way you have set it up.

I agree that the tyrannos could need ~10 more base CPU to be in line with its other parameters.

Facts:

  • Missile launcher do need relative high CPU, low reactor

  • Robots CPU/Reactor values are set around the factions primary weapons.
    eg. Laser bots got more reactor then anything because lasers need that

  • Missile bots are also pretty headslot-heavy (except EWAR)

  • Headslot modules primary attribute is CPU

  • Tyrannos has not more CPU then Kain, which is unlogical if you consider the previous facts

  • sidenote: Gropho MK2 will face Reactor-shortage if try to fit all slots

Purge - i wonder - do you want to fit drainer or neuts into the two misc slots?
Just asking because you didnt list the extension for lowering CPU for those...

No, what I want to fit is not engineering related atall.

Good points, especially on the kain having as much CPU as tyrannos.

I always thought the game was designed so that if you want to fit higher tier modules and use all of your slots, you would need higher EP investments into the fitting skills (CPU/reactor skills) but I ain't gonna be able to get any more than a few more CPU even if I invest another 50k ep into the last of the CPU reduction skills, and yet I can't even put anything in my last 2 slots because i have like 6 cpu spare on my mixed T2-T3-T4 setup.

Being able to use all of your slots with high EP investment may have just about worked for the tyrannos before, but that's the key word "just about" - the extra slots the MK2 version has are useless if you're going to have to waste 2 slots anyway.

  • Infini
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

10 more base cpu isn't really going to help it much either. it would need 20-25 more at least.

  • CIR
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

Purgatory wrote:

I always thought the game was designed so that if you want to fit higher tier modules and use all of your slots, you would need higher EP investments into the fitting skills (CPU/reactor skills) but I ain't gonna be able to get any more than a few more CPU even if I invest another 50k ep into the last of the CPU reduction skills

Not to side track the thread, but those skills are all % reduction. Its true that 4% reduction between level 6 and 10 is not alot of CPU savings on a module that uses 100 CPU (save 10 vs 6) but as bots get bigger and bigger as the game progresses and the CPU cost of modules goes up to 1000, than you will be saving 100 vs 60. I know that doesn't help right now for this problem, but it does put the issue back to the bot and not on the skill.

7 Reply by Annihilator (edited by Annihilator 2011-04-14 18:19:03)

  • BKK
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

DEV Alf wrote:

I always read the posts cool

a response! cool
(i think Black Prophecy made me sensible to DEV answers...)

so back to the issue:

if you take zero-extension, T1 med launcher fit tyrannos and gropho, you get:

Tyrannos: 
300 TF - (4x 40 TF) = 160 TF
900 RP - (4x 150 RP) =  300 RP

4 head + 3 leg + 2 body = 9 slots unfitted
~17.7 TF per slot left
~33.3 RP per slot left

Gropho:
380 TF - (6x 40 TF) = 160 TF
1025 RP - (6x 150 RP) = 125 RP

5 head + 4 leg + 1 body = 10 slots unfitted
~16.0 TF per slot left
~12.5 RP per lost left

This way it looks like the Gropho would be worse then the tryannos.
Now same with maxed Data processing and Reactor Expansion:

Tyrannos:
390 TF - (4x 40 TF) = 230 TF
1170 RP - (4x 150 RP) = 570 RP
~25.5 TF per slot left
~63.3 RP per slot left

Gropho:
494 TF - (6x 40 TF) = 254 TF
1332.5 RP - (6x150 RP) = 432,5 RP
~25.4 TF per slot left
~43,3 RP per slot left

this way it looks pretty balanced to me (except the gropho reactor).
considering that you have optimized weapons on 8, a T4 missile launcher will need less CPU then the T1's without that extension.

now i'm really curious what you are planning to equip that works on Gropho but not on your Tyrannos mk2 (which has 1 more slot then a gropho btw)

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

8 Reply by Purgatory (edited by Purgatory 2011-04-14 19:29:55)

  • Infini
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

Mk2 bots should have been given extra cpu/reactor to make up for the extra 2 slots they get, more so CPU then reactor. If they get an extra head and leg slot, then they should receive an extra 40-50 base CPU (20-25 base for each slot). It really does not make sense to bring out these MK2 bots and call them better, but then gimp them by not giving them enough CPU/reactor to actually get a proper fitting.

If this is not changed, then I guess the mech and heavy mech MK2 bots will just be worthless fluff, because apparently the light Mk2 bots don't have this problem.

IMO the better fix is give Mk2 bots extra cpu/reactor to make up for their extra fittings.

  • BKK
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

uhh, tyrannos with that equipment looks ***...

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear
  • CIR
  • Agent
  • Offline

Re: Tyrannos needs more CPU - Explanation inside.

Purgatory wrote:

Mk2 bots should have been given extra cpu/reactor to make up for the extra 2 slots they get, more so CPU then reactor. If they get an extra head and leg slot, then they should receive an extra 40-50 base CPU (20-25 base for each slot). It really does not make sense to bring out these MK2 bots and call them better, but then gimp them by not giving them enough CPU/reactor to actually get a proper fitting.

If this is not changed, then I guess the mech and heavy mech MK2 bots will just be worthless fluff, because apparently the light Mk2 bots don't have this problem.

IMO the better fix is give Mk2 bots extra cpu/reactor to make up for their extra fittings.

Their extra slots do give them extra reactor and cpu for fitting... it's called a co-processor and co-reactor. With those in the extra slots you can fit some crazy fitting that were never possible on the mk1's. Be a bit more creative there brosef, coprocessor and reactors are in the game for a reason.

GLiMPSE™'s CoolPoints™ Leaderboard