Re: Need rollback.

My understanding of badly translated Russian is not doing me much good here.

I am pretty sure Hunter knows something we don't know about a coming patch?
I'm not being blind. I am just not as "Informed" as Novastrov is.

What's getting nerfed? I pretty don't care as I'm only left with making more billions of NIC at the moment. big_smile

Re: Need rollback.

Hell, all the Chaos arguments make me lol, now I can't stand away from this thread too.

Population didn't grown after ERP nerf? Was unnecessary then. Hell, let's just give me over 9000 mil EP - that's will not affect population aswell.

ERP isn't the reason of your whine? OMG then why are you QQ about it in 2 threads already?

And they acting like its Chaos is the only one who knows how to play - maaan what are we doing here then, lets quit, it's theyr game big_smile

Can't afford to loose HMech? Don't deploy it, it's l2p things. Still want to pilot one? Mine more, ***! Don't like it? Go play tetris, you'll never loose anything in that game.

Have a productive day, runner!
R.I.P. Chenoa, you'll never be forgotten.
DEV Zoom: Line, sorry, I was away for christmas.
http://perp-kill.net/?m=view&id=252086

Re: Need rollback.

But you represent your corporation here, don't you? You're the best of them so they granted you the permission to post here from theyr name.

Have a productive day, runner!
R.I.P. Chenoa, you'll never be forgotten.
DEV Zoom: Line, sorry, I was away for christmas.
http://perp-kill.net/?m=view&id=252086

Re: Need rollback.

I just can not understand the reasons nerf. Yes, it was a powerful weapon. But why the other did not use it? Why just nerf?

If nerf was the one change for last 3-4 months, maybe I took it easier. But in game the global rebalancing too often.
Why?

This is not sandbox. This is a Box of Chocolates...

Re: Need rollback.

Hunter wrote:

I just can not understand the reasons nerf. Yes, it was a powerful weapon. But why the other did not use it? Why just nerf?

If nerf was the one change for last 3-4 months, maybe I took it easier. But in game the global rebalancing too often.
Why?

Because this games sadly is designed in a way where things need to be balanced depending on the number of people playing. Sadly instead of it creating a cycle like other games do it's made a constant nerf with very few useful buffs.

Like I keep saying Hunter. The game doesn't need to be balanced any more. The balance works but there is nothing to do with your awesome robots. Taking an outpost of means having to be online more and recover more NIC and resources to cover the costs of having to defend it. Look at what Infestation did recently. The server population dropped so they rallied 30+ people online and took a bunch of outposts and no one could stop them.

Re: Need rollback.

Let me summarize some statements what Hunter wants to say:

1. Last balance changes with erp ant repair tuner should be canceled (not a global rollback)
2. Armor tanks should have their place in a offence-siege-defense triangle where offence killing siege, siege killing defense, defense killing offence.
3. Defense squad should have encapsulated vitality, short range fire, but heavy disadvantage in range\speed. Pre-nerfed ERP module allowed players to fit tanked robots. The highest efficiency could be gained with highest possible count of repair tuners in a head modules, what made defense capability stable against incoming DPS, but others, such as speed and radar system, was at basic level.
4. At the moment there is no dedicated fit for defence role because closest candidate was nerfed and balance was shifted to the offence and siege squads.

32 (edited by Hunter 2011-09-09 10:58:06)

Re: Need rollback.

Okay, please answer one more question. What tech-level of equipment should be used on a standard PvP (t1,t2,t3,t4)?

And yet, I never saw that it was possible to rescue somebody, in this game. If the contact, the victim will not survive.

This is not sandbox. This is a Box of Chocolates...

Re: Need rollback.

Hunter wrote:

Okay, please answer one more question. What tech-level of equipment should be used on a standard PvP (t1,t2,t3,t4)?

the answer depends on your needs. a fast bot obviously T2 or T3- since they are the lightest. if you want extreme efficiency in an area then T4. if you are going on the cheap than T1 ...

so there is no default answer.

Re: Need rollback.

Hunter wrote:

wait-wait... Just shoot?... Only/again/f****g shoot? Ok... nwm... next.

1. they are SLOW
2. they have HEAVY GUNS
3. they only have weapon and defense bonuses

What do you expect them to do ? TACKLE ???

The only advantage of mech and up is RANGE. HP advantage is negligent and further negated by the surface hit size mechanics. Most of them need accum just to shoot.

EW mechs aside, they are only there to shoot ...

Re: Need rollback.

My 0.02$

In my timezone (EU primetime) PVP is completely non-existent and dead. Me & the rest of the EU players in CIR (and we are an EU-based corp!) have 3 choices in Perpetuum:

1. Mine.
2. Farm.
3. Spin bot in terminal.

The potential 4th choice is to roam the Beta islands for 4-5-6 hours, kill 1-2 arganos / a lonely Termis mining and thats it. Not much fun to be had.

I dont know how this lack of players/activity in my primetime can be fixed, but if rollbacking changes could do it then by all means I'm in favor of it. Personally I'm very much in favor of a marketing campaign to get more players in-game. smile

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

36 (edited by Hugh Ruka 2011-09-09 11:08:19)

Re: Need rollback.

Syndic wrote:

My 0.02$

In my timezone (EU primetime) PVP is completely non-existent and dead. Me & the rest of the EU players in CIR (and we are an EU-based corp!) have 3 choices in Perpetuum:

1. Mine.
2. Farm.
3. Spin bot in terminal.

The potential 4th choice is to roam the Beta islands for 4-5-6 hours, kill 1-2 arganos / a lonely Termis mining and thats it. Not much fun to be had.

I dont know how this lack of players/activity in my primetime can be fixed, but if rollbacking changes could do it then by all means I'm in favor of it. Personally I'm very much in favor of a marketing campaign to get more players in-game. smile

throw some event from time to time ... you know like a PvP tourney ? you are wealthy enough to do this I guess. look what 62nd is doing ...

hell act like EVE Uni and do PvP classes if you want.

There are plenty of options for you to provide contenct for other players. You can take an OP and teach others how Intrusions work. Do PvE torneys (who can get a set number of specific kernels the fastet etc.). Just use your imagination. It might even help your reputation.

Re: Need rollback.

Syndic wrote:

My 0.02$

In my timezone (EU primetime) PVP is completely non-existent and dead. Me & the rest of the EU players in CIR (and we are an EU-based corp!) have 3 choices in Perpetuum:

1. Mine.
2. Farm.
3. Spin bot in terminal.

The potential 4th choice is to roam the Beta islands for 4-5-6 hours, kill 1-2 arganos / a lonely Termis mining and thats it. Not much fun to be had.

I dont know how this lack of players/activity in my primetime can be fixed, but if rollbacking changes could do it then by all means I'm in favor of it. Personally I'm very much in favor of a marketing campaign to get more players in-game. smile

These changes didn't affected population. Why do you expect that rollbacking will?

Have a productive day, runner!
R.I.P. Chenoa, you'll never be forgotten.
DEV Zoom: Line, sorry, I was away for christmas.
http://perp-kill.net/?m=view&id=252086

Re: Need rollback.

Hugh Ruka wrote:

throw some event from time to time ... you know like a PvP tourney ? you are wealthy enough to do this I guess. look what 62nd is doing ...

hell act like EVE Uni and do PvP classes if you want.

There are plenty of options for you to provide contenct for other players. You can take an OP and teach others how Intrusions work. Do PvE torneys (who can get a set number of specific kernels the fastet etc.). Just use your imagination. It might even help your reputation.

Have tried organizing PVP events, Arena events, Guild vs Guild events, X Z Y events; despite having 20-30 people show up it still doesn't provide my guys with the "fun factor" that keeps them in-game playing. There's nothing wrong with my imagination or me not using it, I just play with a very special group of players who want certain things in a game that matter. "For fun" is only "fun" if there is a "meaning and consequence". 

I just don't have the tools in-game to provide any more different events that my guys haven't a) gotten bored of; b) aren't interested in. Hell, we even did an Arena event with full-fits, so T4 mechs going at each other and blowing each other up. lol

PVPwise it's no-choice, we EU players have to get up/stay up until 6-7-8 AM; and even then if we're going to get some action we have to play the cat-and-mouse game pretending we're not online, because if we're spotted online we can kiss the action bye-bye. hmm

We did it for a few weeks, and then we stopped getting any PVP in the 5-8 AM timeframe. Next step to getting action would be to quit jobs and play from 5 AM to Noon? Um, sorry that's a bit too much. smile

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

39 (edited by Exomorph 2011-09-09 11:44:23)

Re: Need rollback.

Alexadar wrote:

Let me summarize some statements what Hunter wants to say:

1. Last balance changes with erp ant repair tuner should be canceled (not a global rollback)

No. Maybe it was too big nerfbat but not rollback.

Alexadar wrote:

2. Armor tanks should have their place in a offence-siege-defense triangle where offence killing siege, siege killing defense, defense killing offence.

Yep this idea is good, but now with very very different bot bonuses and base stats (like kains speed+++ over the tyr and artemis), would be really hard.

Alexadar wrote:

3. Defense squad should have encapsulated vitality, short range fire, but heavy disadvantage in range\speed. Pre-nerfed ERP module allowed players to fit tanked robots. The highest efficiency could be gained with highest possible count of repair tuners in a head modules, what made defense capability stable against incoming DPS, but others, such as speed and radar system, was at basic level.

Did you ever tried tyrranos with erp tank? or artemis? Again kains was buffed with previous erp tanks. Kains have 50% rep amount base, and with 3 t4 tunings plus you could permatank even 8-10 assault damage easily. Yep there is setup or tactics against them, but just when you know that you going against erp tanked setup kains.

Alexadar wrote:

4. At the moment there is no dedicated fit for defence role because closest candidate was nerfed and balance was shifted to the offence and siege squads.

Maybe we need super plates (or buff plates hp bonuses ?), for dedicated defense (buffer tanks). For now RRs got nice buffs, so plated mechs with rr could use for siege defense very well.

Re: Need rollback.

Syndic wrote:

Next step to getting action would be to quit jobs and play from 5 AM to Noon?

Just reset everyone in server to neutral:)
You will have fun in EU tz every day!

Re: Need rollback.

Hunter wrote:

Okay, please answer one more question. What tech-level of equipment should be used on a standard PvP (t1,t2,t3,t4)?

And yet, I never saw that it was possible to rescue somebody, in this game. If the contact, the victim will not survive.

What ever Tech your willing to lose If i fit T2 I understand my bot will be faster but more expensive than t1 If t3 slower but more powerfull firepower and alot more expensive than T1.

Just like EVE you Risk what your comfortable losing. I won't bring my Seth or Mk2 Artimis out to play like lemon. I only have 1 of each and if I lose them I won't have a PVE money maker to back me up.

Participate, Congratulate cause everything else will be seen as HATE.
Max yellow max all skills lvl 10 min max for the win

Re: Need rollback.

Exolona, i hope you got the main idea: to have vitality-tank role in this game. Personlly i fine to have another alternative then ERP, but im sure, to fulfill all tactics aspects in this game, players need to have access to effective armor-tanks.

Re: Need rollback.

Alexadar wrote:

Exolona, i hope you got the main idea: to have vitality-tank role in this game. Personlly i fine to have another alternative then ERP, but im sure, to fulfill all tactics aspects in this game, players need to have access to effective armor-tanks.

Yes i agree, but not on that way that blues got them (from their bonuses), and greens and yellows (may be they got too a bit couse of their passive resist) not. As you see at least i'm trying to give some alternatives, not just whineing that this is sucks and rollback. There is no point that defenders need just to dock out 1 erp tanked kain, for a small (6-8 man) roaming gang, and tank (and kill) them all (because roaming gangs doesnt fit against erp tank, or just in some cases).

Re: Need rollback.

Alexadar wrote:

Exolona, i hope you got the main idea: to have vitality-tank role in this game. Personlly i fine to have another alternative then ERP, but im sure, to fulfill all tactics aspects in this game, players need to have access to effective armor-tanks.

nobody disagrees with that. however not as single bot pwnmachine.

Re: Need rollback.

Syndic wrote:

My 0.02$

In my timezone (EU primetime) PVP is completely non-existent and dead. Me & the rest of the EU players in CIR (and we are an EU-based corp!) have 3 choices in Perpetuum:

1. Mine.
2. Farm.
3. Spin bot in terminal.

The potential 4th choice is to roam the Beta islands for 4-5-6 hours, kill 1-2 arganos / a lonely Termis mining and thats it. Not much fun to be had.

I dont know how this lack of players/activity in my primetime can be fixed, but if rollbacking changes could do it then by all means I'm in favor of it. Personally I'm very much in favor of a marketing campaign to get more players in-game. smile


If you hadnt set most of the active server to blue you wouldnt be in this situation, reap the rewards of your actions you short sighted grobli fondler wink

Re: Need rollback.

Hugh Ruka wrote:
Alexadar wrote:

Exolona, i hope you got the main idea: to have vitality-tank role in this game. Personlly i fine to have another alternative then ERP, but im sure, to fulfill all tactics aspects in this game, players need to have access to effective armor-tanks.

nobody disagrees with that. however not as single bot pwnmachine.

What is a Single bot  pwnmachine? I mean lets ask the questions?

Assume a Full Tank bot for Tanking efficiency Mech Class:

Should it be able to Stable tank a ammount of assaults?

What is this ammount?

What is the magic number to tip and break the tank?

Using pure DPS fits.

Now look at the ease w/ e-war- what numbers, size gang should be req/expected to break it.

Undefeated 2013
"Even alone you probably are one of the best" - Khader Khan
"Lemon the 1 man army .... also know as: THE TERMINATOR!" - Obi Wan
"There are people who are just better then you at doing many things at one time, some are far better then myself, far better." -Merkle

Re: Need rollback.

Khader Khan wrote:

I won't bring my Seth or Mk2 Artimis out to play like lemon.

After the other night I don't even think he will bring them out as much as he lost one of each in a single battle.  Well, at least not off his front porch...

"...we will take undefended gammas and stations."  -Cassius of STC

Re: Need rollback.

Jelan wrote:
Syndic wrote:

My 0.02$

In my timezone (EU primetime) PVP is completely non-existent and dead. Me & the rest of the EU players in CIR (and we are an EU-based corp!) have 3 choices in Perpetuum:

1. Mine.
2. Farm.
3. Spin bot in terminal.

The potential 4th choice is to roam the Beta islands for 4-5-6 hours, kill 1-2 arganos / a lonely Termis mining and thats it. Not much fun to be had.

I dont know how this lack of players/activity in my primetime can be fixed, but if rollbacking changes could do it then by all means I'm in favor of it. Personally I'm very much in favor of a marketing campaign to get more players in-game. smile


If you hadnt set most of the active server to blue you wouldnt be in this situation, reap the rewards of your actions you short sighted grobli fondler wink

Our server has been highly polarized for a while. (M2S’ infinite cache vs the server? )The main difference between now and back then is that less people are here due to boredom in the game. The entities we had before are still here, mostly skeletons of their former size, but still around no less. The lack of tangible objectivity is what is making people bored and not really care, else we'd still have people logging in. There'd be heaps of targets if you theoretically allied with half the server anyway, but that's not really evident as half of barely any people is still barely any people.

If big alliances are such a problem, then why doesn't 62nd and M2S break up and start shooting everyone instead of crucifying others that do it? Why can't you practice what you preach in such a "dire" time for the game? 62nd did it before and looking at their recent activity in comparison to "Novablob", they could easily have "fair" fights if they took the theoretical high road.

The problem is not coming from the players though, it's coming from the lack of players and that stems from a game that's not entertaining them enough to stay. It's only all the more evident because of the polarization of ideals and lack of things for corps to want to stand alone for and take for themself. All this talk of alliances killing the game is really just a cover for the real problem and it's twofold as it's also a reason for the alliances to not break up as there's no point other than speculation that it will magically make the game more fun and everyone will just come rushing back because a handful of corps are playing together.

Take the long way around back to square one
Today we're just outlaws out on the run

Re: Need rollback.

Nicely coined grim.  Very nice.

Re: Need rollback.

You have to take into account it's not just combat pilots that aren't logging in. PVP needs industry to back it up, and while manfuctoring players may get away with logging in a few hours every other day, miners and harvesters have to be out there everyday gathering materials or there won't be anything to build with.

No modules or bots, no PVP.

Alliances offer more then just roaming buddies, and having lots of targets doesn't do any good if you don't have anything to shoot them with.

There has been a lot less rhetoric in corp dialog about alliances, and that's a good thing, but politics is just that; using rhetoric against your opponent. When someone says 'no new taxes' opposition is going to parrot that back for the next 100 years regardless if circumstances changed or not.