And what is to stop people from just corp hopping en mass every 24 hours to circumvent this, driving up the cost each time, since the outpost owner needs to add a new corp every time. Once the outpost owner removes an old corp, people can rejoin that one and voila docking rights again.

It's horribly exploitable, so a big no to that.

I have to disagree again, look what you're making me do.

I think the main difference between our POV's is that I'm looking from a long-term down-the-road perspective, where you seem to be considering every feature on its own merit. Both POV's are right in their own way, but let me explain mine a bit better.

There is a very good reason to own an outpost and go through the extra trouble of interacting with people and corporations, honoring agreements, etc. You have the best economical and industrial advantage in the game from it. The problem so far has been that the difference between economical and industrial advantages between Beta islands, and New Alpha islands has been very very negligible.

Suddenly it made complete sense to swap all T1->T3 production on New Alpha, and relegate Beta operations to super-guarded Epriton Days where you see anywhere between 20 and 40 rivelers chewing up entire sectors fields with maxxed out NEXUS accounts to speed them up, supported by countless mechs, ewar mechs and heavy mechs obliterating everything that even jumps on the island.

On top of that, you could procure Espitium and Alligor by recycling modules that you could farm infinitely and in perfect safety on Alpha. At the same time, you could be mining all other resources in again - perfect safety on New Alpha on semi-AFK.

But all of this is slowly changing. First we get control of our outposts - by the time this settles in the corps that have the know-how will be established powerblocks in their own right, or they'll never grow out of the T1-phase.

Next we will receive those NEXUS auras, station improvements, etc - THESE will provide a reason to make the effort and own land on Beta.

Down the line, we will receive POS structures - again, THESE will provide yet another reason to make the effort and establish your corporation on Beta. Suddenly you realize that L5 or L10 or LX factory-structure you have is so efficient you can outproduce any Alpha corporation. Industrial aspect picks up, demanding more and more ore. You don't have time anymore to mine on Alpha and haul around, it needs to be done on site. PVP prospers, as the military and political aspects get more important.

With POS structures and terraforming, suddenly NIC will have a purpose. The reasons to do inter-corporation trade will increase beyond accumulating useless liquid wealth, and again the economical and industrial aspects of the game will increase in value exponentially. Political aspect will follow closely in lock-step, as suddenly you don't want "friendly roaming PVP" coming over and blowing up your customers that bring you in money to fuel your machine.

With such huge deposits in outposts taking or losing one will be no small task. Logistics will become even more important as corporations play smart and dont keep all of their eggs in the same basket. Again the potential for courier player-made missions would blossom here, as critical mass is reached where one corp can't handle all of its logistics by itself. It will become a symbiotic relationship where the haulers buy from the producers who feed off the haulers who feed off the producers who feed the PVPers.

All of this will make the military aspect relevant because without muscle, you better be a damn good diplomat or you will be nothing.

This is just one small piece of the puzzle, one small fragment of a larger picture of a future Perpetuum. I hope that some day we will be able to look back at this time and say "yup, thats when it started getting good".

are you disagreeing that I agree with you?

I am indeed looking short term, and I'm not being fully altruistic here.

A few 'wild' islands are OK, but I can't establish trade with those islands, and while a few lemon-aided mining outings would be fun (and likely destructive for me after my usefulness as bait was done), having multiple customers is more desirable.

Even if these Islands aren't trading with me, they will increase the flow of goods, and only when something moves is there profit to be made; not to mention it makes the market stronger.

Of course, this also all hinges on having some reason to trade, as well as something to trade for and someone to trade with.

So, other then long versus short views, I think your wrong, we don't disagree with how the game should be, but maybe we do on how to get there.

Then you look at the ways that its exploitable and find ways around it.  If every time some exploit was found and the devs just said "well, I guess we scrap that whole feature!" we wouldnt have a game right now.  Dont write something off just because you think of an exploit for something.  Thats just being lazy

I think thats one reason I like brainstorming new features is BECAUSE my mind looks for such loopholes all the time.  I dont necessarily intend to use them, but thats just how I think.

I see it in a similar way to war decs in eve.  The longer you want to dec the more expensive it costs.  Why didnt people in eve just jump corps to circumvent either the cost or the consequence of being dec'd and force their enemy to make more of them?  Maybe they did?  What was the consequence?

I really cant see having a whole corp jump to a dummy corp just to be able to dock in an outpost.  The logistics of it are just f*cking stupid unless you dont ever bother with corp storage AT ALL.

So will all beta assignments be gone now?

If not how do you finish one or pick one up from an outpost that you can't dock in?

Or is there some type of mailbox outside of the beta outposts now?

I think I read something in the dev blog about some new building for assignments. Too tired after typing this....

I would like to see outposts have some meaning

Rather than docking rights, I would like to see the facility cost altered according to relations, plus a weekly rent required for being able to access corporate hangars, and perhaps a fee for docking rights too. Some ideas...

Facility fees

If a corporation owns an outpost they can opt to provide discounts or an additional premium to use the facilities. Each discount is optional and selected by the owning corp individually. The Syndicate would get the usual 50% of the normal price, and the discount/premium is taken from/added to the owning corp's share.

Green corps - Up to 50% discount on total facility fees
Blue corps - Up to 25% discount on total facility fees
Neutral corps - no discount or premium can be set
Yellow corps - Up to 25% premium on total facility fees
Red corps - Up to 50% premium on total facility fees

Corp storage rent

This is not the fee for creating corp storage, but an ongoing maintenance fee.

This is an option that could be set by the owning corp, but with the option to reduce the rent to 0%, 25%, 50% or 100% for each colour of standing. Thus they could choose just to give free storage to green and blue corps, or free storage to all corps regardless of colour, or just set a fee for yellow and red corps.

Rates (example amounts only):
Level 1 - 500k NIC per week
Level 2 - 1m NIC per week
Level 3 - 5m NIC per week
Level 4 - 10m NIC per week

The owning corp would receive 100% of the revenue from corp storage rent.

If a corp already owns hangars in an outpost controlled by an enemy, they can choose to pay the fee, and thus have access to those hangars for 1 week after the fee is paid. If they don't pay, they can't access the hangars.

Docking rights

A corp can choose to set docking rights exactly the same way as it would for corp hangar access.

Rates (example numbers only):
<10 agents in corp - 500k NIC per week
10-50 agents in corp - 1m NIC per week
50-100 agents in corp - 5m NIC per week
100+ agents in corp - 10m NIC per week

The fee is the same regardless of how many agents actually dock up or use the outpost. Again, a corp would choose to set this as an option for their outpost, and then have the option to choose a 100%, 50%, 25% or 0% discount for each colour of standing.

The owning corp would receive 100% of the revenue from docking rights.

The amounts are just examples, I don't know what would really work, but this gives a way to penalise corps who lose intrusions, and an element of risk to losing them beyond e-peen, but at the same time doesnt cripple the game for new corps trying to move from alpha to beta.

We are the lulzpirates. We pirate your lulz, burn them onto CDs and then sell them for profit. Fear our anarchic ways.

Yes it should. Isn't that why you guys do it? Or is it all SRS INTERNET ROBOTS over there?

Again, too many questions about this subject and not enough answers.

The reason why the 'new' beta islands dont have assignments was because we were told at the time "we may implement docking rights in the future on these bases"

So outpost-less corps may suddenly be making a grab for power before it becomes too hard only for devs to say "well.. we only meant the new beta islands duh"

whaaa, ultra necro.
don't look at that old blog - things announced there got implemented like a few weeks ago  (point click on map to set waypoint)

just steal darkfalls siege system...straight up.

that's a dead sandbox game as well...but when a siege is dropped everyone knows and one thing leads to another and its an epic battle involving 3rd parties that you don't know whos side they are on and its crazy fun.

Current system is the one active STC guy tries to ninja a sap but then runs when he sees someone else.  anything but fun.

I remember back when you were a decent human being and I had gone through I think four scarabs you gave me a Lithus mk2 to haul in and I still have that to this day despite quite a few attempts to kill it. If you can't use a scarab adapt.

Beta without gamma is endgame station content and I can see a reason for locks. With gamma it's mid game content and there is no reason for locks - you want that level of safety then assume that level of risk and get a gamma.

As a compromise why not allow beta 1 stations to be always unlocked and leave beta 2 lockable.