Well, I'm back in school until mid June.  I came back simply because I can set up my scarabs to mine Liquizit with minimal real time participation.  There are plenty of buyers for the ores I mine, so in that regard, it seems like a good time to be here.

I found they did fix the mining nerf.  The rest of that nasty balancing patch still sucks, IMHO, in the form of all the new extensions you have to spend EP on just to have the same (or less) capability as you did prior to the patch.

The one glimmer of future hope is the randomized mission system.  I have three accounts, and one of my favorite activities was setting up all three bots to run assignments at the same time, <alt><tab>ing as needed.  Then I'd buy beacons and run those.  The randomized system could provide a lot of fun, um, if and when it is implemented...

I have not tried to stealth mine Epi, which would be a reasonable test of how many players are online and actively patrolling.  But with my schoolwork, I really don't have the time to do a lot of hands-on.

So, I just set up my scarabs to mine Liq and makes a couple million while I read texts and do the write ups.  If you are looking for the thrill of the hunt, I just saw players in gen chat "gf"ing after some PvP.

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(4 replies, posted in General discussion)

Amano Terijima wrote:

The base yield that all miners pull was increased by 50% causing cascading amplification when parsed down the line of the algorithms making mining more efficient then it used to be. At least that's how it was explained to me, I'm not normally a miner big_smile

Thanks - I actually read the patch note posted by Aye Pod and completely missed the line about the 50%!  Doh !

The piece that seems to be missing in the notes must be that it was nerfed to hard to start with.

Thanks again guys !!!

Edit for spelling.

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(4 replies, posted in General discussion)

Came back today and found lots of mining changes.  Someone in Gen Chat said mining was given a 50% bonus "at the last balancing". I assume this was AFTER the balance patch everybody complained so much about.  Anyway, I don't see any info in the patch notes referencing the 50% mining bonus and removal of heat map. 

Can someone explain the changes and/or point me at a link ?

Thanks guys !!!

There's a cargo exploit?  How come I never know about these beneficial, I mean dastardly, phenomena ?

I'm here which proves I have network access.  Can't connect but client states servers are up !

What's going on ?  Me?  System wide ?  Unannounced system downtime ?  I sure don't see any announcement of downtime ...

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(15 replies, posted in General discussion)

Thanks Xstence!  I'll do some homework and try scanning down some fields ten go from there.

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(15 replies, posted in General discussion)

Ville wrote:

Honestly just contact Syndic and Mongolia Jones and an agreement can be met.  It's typically a modest fee.

I have sent in-game email to these two guys ... no response for over a week.

So if Syndic and/or Mr Jones are listening, how about a personal mining license for your Beta island ?

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(15 replies, posted in General discussion)

Ville wrote:

Honestly just contact Syndic and Mongolia Jones and an agreement can be met.  It's typically a modest fee.

KK - thnx for the info !  This seems way better than dodging PvPers.

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(15 replies, posted in General discussion)

Thanks for your input so far.

I knew that there were "license" agreements between corps.  And while Syndic indicates the existence of individual licenses, I did not think such a commodity was affordable for a single independent miner.  Nor do I have contact info for any such provider.

And I understand what Norrdec and Hunter said.  It is Hunter's comment "everybody will try to kill you" that is the topic of concern.

I was wondering about specifics : good techniques for scouting in and out, best times with fewest roaming gangs (if there is such a thing in Perp), how much time you can realistically expect to suck up Epi before being sighted/ganked, etc. 

I suppose I can just dive in and learn from the school of hard knocks...  Maybe what I really need is a link to a Perp PvP guide with a section for miners...

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(15 replies, posted in General discussion)

I can't find any guides to mining on beta islands, so I figured I would post here.

If there is a guide I missed, please post the link and we're done.

Elsewise,  how does one go about mining Epi on Beta islands ???

I figure I can start with a T1 fit Argano with minimal ore quantity goals so there won't be a big loss if I'm caught and killed.

But are there strategies to get in, scan, mine, get out, before detection ?

Thanks in advance for any insight you can offer !!!

I found a nice 10-plant Norg farm with all plants harvested down to 1 each.  It looks like somebody was managing this farm.  I came back the next morning with some Ninja harvesting in mind, and 7 of the 10 plants were vaporized.

I have to assume that someone harvested them down to zero, thus killing the plants.

I see no reason to do this as somebody or everybody can benefit from such farms.

Please don't kill the Norg !!!  This is a resource beneficial to many : owners and ninjas alike.

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(10 replies, posted in General discussion)

Any ETA ?

EDIT :: LOL - I just got in...

From change blog : "Change: NPCs destroyed by AoE explosion damage will not drop loot anymore ..."

So, this means no more beacon pit action ?  I'm sure there are other implications that I am unaware of.  Seemed like a good game mechanic to me and I don't understand why they did that.

Also, I see in the posts some people saying there is a transport mission exploit, but Dev Zoom states it's not an exploit?  Can someone tell me about that ?  I've been running transport missions and everything seems normal to me ... nor have I seen any 50U drops and I have run enough mission to have well over 1500 tokens.  So what is up with these "exploits" ?

Thnx for any insight you can offer.

EDIT :: LOL - I now see the date on this topic and it was from June ...  Joke's on me I guess.

Jita wrote:

So long as you don't target a rat they won't target you no matter if beacons or not. If your fitting sensor amps on any not ratting your losing efficiency. Remote sensor amps are better with your damage not having all damage tunings. As your riveler should never be targeted it only has to lock once and so do all armor tunings on that too.

I have noticed something different.  If I use a RivelRepper to help activate a beacon, it WILL be targeted by the some of beacon spawn on the initial wave without ever locking anything.  My approach there is to take out anything shooting at my Riveler first.  After the first wave, what you say is what I observe.

I think I partially misspoke on sensor amps : I'm using ONLY remote sensor amps on my RivelRepper.  I have to agree that burning a head slot for internal sensor amps is not effective in the case of generating max DPS / max repps for PvE.

Ville wrote:

On Beta the idea is players "hide" they do ops off in the corner, things remotely, travel is not an issue there. 

Adding more teleports to Beta will also have a negative effect with detectors just bouncing internal gates looking for things to kill.

On the other hand -

Adding internal teleporters to Alpha provides faster missioning. (New Players would + 1)
Better access to transportation to minerals.
Increased Logistics.
I would even go as far as placing an internal teleporter as close as 1K from the terminal.

I vote for reducing travel time / speeding up access to the action

Having been gone so long, I kinda feel like a new player.  One of the big issues I had upon return is travel time, especially during assignments. 

I generated a thread suggesting the ability to teleport to terminal, and I guess that's not such a great idea.  But I said in that thread and I say again now :: ANYTHING to speed up game play will be a good thing.  For me, I realized I was spending considerably more time traveling to and from the action than actually being IN the action.  This seems very backward from a "having fun" perspective.

This is a topic that could get the discussion going around in circles.  With that said, here is my take:

In a twisted logic sort of way, getting Gamma back is like getting new content, except it's just a revamp. 

I think this would be good.  I was in A.S.S. corp and had to take a long hiatus due to work demands.  Before I left, as a corp, we were heavily involved in building up the Gamma base on Novaya Trava (IIRC).  That was immensely fun and provided a focus and direction for cooperative game play.  I particularly liked the group beacon pit events.  But whether or not we mined, harvested, or blasted NPCs for recyclable trash loot, most resulting resources went to building up the base.

I think the return of Gamma islands would allow this again.  I just hope such a land grab would not be dominated by the power blocks... I agree with those who have said that the Gamma issue should have been resolved before STEAM, which in my way of thinking, makes it the highest priority for Dev time.

Just wanted to thank you guys for your input !  I read all the posts and tried out some loadouts while farming NPCs.

Slightly off topic : The first thing I notice is that dual ECCMs are pretty much worthless.  I think it's strange that I keep getting serially jammed even with dual T4 ECCMs.  It does prevent some jam attempts, but not enough to justify dedicating two head slots, not even close. 

So, I tried the sensor amp approach --> dual T4 sensor amps on my RivelRepper.  It's very annoying to be jammed so frequently, but at least I can lock quickly and get some volleys off with the advantage that all my head slots are dedicated to missile tunings.  Plus, standard aggro management applies, like only lock one jamming type bot at a time, and deal with adds as they lock on.

More on topic : Using 1 universal hardener, two active racial hardeners for primary and secondary DPS types, and a medium plate, my RivelRepper has no problem keeping up with DPS even with 6 Hero Berserkers firing at me simultaneously.  On purpose, I wait for the spawn to produce 2X triple packs of Berserkers and I'll aggro all of them at once.  My health bar hits 50% but by then the non-primaried NPCs get bored and disengage.   Bottom line, this set up is handling terrain spawns just fine.

So, I'm saving up EP to get my DPS higher before I take on a max beacon.  I did some wimpy beacons as a test and I don't think the broken aggro triggers apply to beacons the same as for terrain NPCs.  For one, the RivelRepper is targeted  by the initial wave, but no subsequent.  Then, the attacking NPCs do not disengage, so there is a need to recovery max health between waves.  I'm not 100% I'm can do this solo and/or at current DPS capability.  But fortunately, my extensions are far from maxed out, so I have plenty of DPS and Armor skills yet to be applied.

Annihilator wrote:

im not so experienced with gropho, but i prefer dual RSA and a fast-lock nexus on my Support Bot.
aside of that, i would fit all headslots with tuners and all lows with uni-hardeners. The second NEXUS buff from my support is then assault.

kk - my follow bot is not Nexus capable yet - and I must devote EP to core competencies currently.  So, this represents a great longer term goal for my RivelRepper !!!

Now, going on my generalized experience with EvE, Omni Tanks, i.e., all universal hardeners, are more for PvP when you cannot predict with high certainty what damage type will be thrown at you.  For Rats, you know the damage type with fairly good certainty, so you can load up on the appropriate resists to maximally minimize incoming DPS.  Having said, it is certainly worth a try to fit as you describe and see how it goes.  I can test these ideas out while spawn camping, which is way less of a concern compared to 3-flag-beacons...

Thanks to all for your contributions so far !!!

kk - I hear what you guys are saying.  Your points are well taken.  And Tund's point brings it home quite clearly.

Thanks for the perspective guys !

I realize that the reality of Dev priorities means that this will never get looked at, but it is worth mentioning.

I'm sure many consider the Autopilot function a God send.  And it is very useful.  The problem is that is uses a rudimentary "follow the wall" algorithm that is oblivious to the high speed highways.  It is so oblivious, that frequently, your bot will be jogging along parallel to the high speed roadway and NOT utilizing it.  Also, by blindly using a "follow the wall" algorithm, it turns into every little pocket along the way, rather than sensibly maintaining a straight line toward the objective.  In short, it can't establish efficient pathways from start to end points.

So, if there is ever any Dev time, the autopilot path finding algorithm needs, at the very least, to be aware of high speed roads and use them.  Also, it needs a better algorithm to keep the bot in the middle of roadways and/or splitting the difference between obstacles as compared to skirting the perimeter of each obstacle the bot encounters.

Oh well.  I guess I should be glad there is ANY autopilot function at all.  I do remember when it didn't work or was very very flaky (way before Gamma destruction).  It certainly has improved since then and I'm using it as is.  But, it could be better.

I've been playing with loadouts as outlined above and here's what I found :: an ECCM trumps a  sensor amp if you have a follow bot with remote sensor amp(s). 

The sensor amps are great for rapidly re-targeting after your locks are whacked.  But I am finding it better to maintain locks in the first place compared to increased speed of re-locking.  So, sensor amp(s) on the follow bot with ECCM on the combat bot.

Now, what I want to test out is whether or not to displace two missile tuners with two ECCMs.  Which is better : more DPS per hit or maintaining locks for uninterrupted DPS. 

When I did some beacons, the NPCs were whacking my locks serially and I could not get a shot off.  In that case, I'd have to go with 2 ECCMs.  Spawn farming seems fine with a single ECCM.  In both cases, I find ECCM superior to Sensor Amp on the combat bot unless soloing (no follow bot) as stated above by Ville.

Opinions please ?

kk guys - I actually was online and actually did a comparison of two main concepts from posts in this thread.

3 boxing Assignments versus Spawn Farming, with proceeds from Tokens/Beacons not yet accounted for.

Assignments : I ran LvL 5 combat with my T4 solo rigged Gropho, and LvL 5 Xport with two Argano's. Yes, there is efficiency to be had because two acct's are auotpiloting while the third is whacking NPCs or scanning or something, thus ameliorating the travel time issues.  But, you have to get through the first 5 assignments to get the max income buffs.  That would be trivial if amortized over 100 assignments.  Trouble is, at the 10th iteration (30 total or 10 each for 3 acct's) I could do no more.  I was burnt out on assignments due to shear boredom.  The good news is that the NIC and tokens flow in like clock work.

Spawn Farming:  set up my T4 Gropho with two active racial hardeners + ECCM and used two RivelReppers (one a basic T1 and the other a real repper maxxed out with T4).  With this set up I can pull the entire field as fast as they spawn and farm non stop.  The only break in the looting is respawn rate and the occasional need to collect the loot with the wimpy Riveler.  So besides many T2 and some T3 mods, the plasma collected is worth crap loads of NIC - way better than the cash from Assignments.  In the current market, I am unable to sell anything - and I'm not kidding.  So it's very hard to say what the loot/recycling is actually worth.

Bottom line : comparing the dependable income+tokens with plasma sales --> Spawn Framing wins hands down on an hour by invested hour basis.

Now trying to compare tokens versus loot is even harder because it's all market driven, hence highly variable.  So the answer is : buy beacons with the tokens and acquire/sell even more plasma !!!  This is what I have not tested out yet but I suspect will turn the tide in favor of assignment running, assuming you can handle the boredom.  Using beacons from assignments make it a hybrid endeavor, some basic cash flow from rewards, but loot/plasma from beacon whacking (spawn farming style).  Weekend is here, so I'll try this out.

Now, to bring this inline with the thread topic : do we need to Teleport to Terminals to make assignments go faster?  Yes and no.  We do need something to keep the action happening compared to autopiloting to and from the action.  I think it's a mistake to design a mission system that requires 3 acct's to maintain constant action.  Teleporting to terminals would improve solo acct assignment running, but as others have stated, the real fix is a (pending) mission revamp.

Spawn farming, as I have done it, could be done with a solo acct, but is simply more efficient with 2-3 accts - and the action is mostly non stop = more pew pew = more fun.  Travel time is a non issue compared to assignments so would not benfit from teleporting to terminals. 

So I've tried to listen to the more experienced players; I tested out what was discussed, and I've said my piece.  Hope you guys have fun out there on Nia !!

I'll try to keep this to the point.

Playing with my Gropho loadout.  That native shield buff is screaming to be utilized.  And if this is anything like EvE, omni tanks are more for PvP while rat specific tanks are for NPCs.

So I need to ask : what are the best ways to fit a Gropho for NPC combat ?  What are the issues ?

Thanks in advance for any insight you can offer !!!

All this discussion has been very helpful for me.

Kinda looks like folks are talking a lot about fastest ways to make NIC utilizing the game mechanics "as is" versus game mods.  Like the idea of running assignments on 3 accts at once ping-pong-ing between autopilot based travel and handling mission objectives.   I'll try this.  But as someone else posted, single acct new players will likely get turned off by travel times, which is exactly what I experienced to start this thread.  I realized quickly that more time was spent traveling than pew pew'ing.  So the sooner the mission revamp happens, the better IMDAO.

I also read in this thread that an arti scan assignment can essentially ruin your income efficiency.  I have my son, who is a math major, working on this.  He's building a spreadsheet that takes the position and distance data from two scan points, does the trigonometry, and generates the two possible exact X Y coordinates to go to.  Our first tries only generated errors, but we will get this working, and once done, arti scanning will become a different ball game that does not rely on intuition at all --> efficiency.

kk fellas - see ya on the firing line !!!

Annihilator wrote:

mission revamp is on the todo, with missions beeing distributed on terrain too, not only in terminals.
you don't need to fu**** the most basic game mechanic, just to make missioning easier, when the solution is much simplier.

so,
-removal of T1 loot,
-mission acceptable without walking to a terminal and back
-missions randomly generated, not repeating the same two missions because no dev has time to do 50 different ones per terminal, per faction, per mission level.

why do you need an instant teleport to the terminal, which would then need countless conditions and artifical rules in PvP to not end up as an exploit?

Thank you for your comments!  I like all of what you said.  Having a somewhat limited perspective is why I floated the idea out for comment.  If indeed the assignments are slated to be improved in the ways you state, then I'm all for it !!!  Something needs to be done to keep action happening.

Right now I'm brewing a batch of beer while my twin Scarabs suck up Liquizit AFK.  Now, I do that because the game allows it.  I would prefer to blow stuff up and get rich doing so.