Re: New devblog: September status report

Celebro wrote:

Assuming most vets have a godly amount of stuff which is (n), what difference does n+1, 2, 3 or whatever reward you want to make worthwhile doing on pvp areas.

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Instead of the current climate where joking russians botting spawns on Hershfield and Shinjalar and afk-mining liquizit and HDT is the income generating ceiling, it structures the game for new players with an easy-to-understand progression with regards to risk vs reward that incentivizes activity.

Hopefully the foundation will be in place for winter sale. Make it a big one, 75% off or something.

Then add robot paint and decals or something to make newbies buy credits.

Done.

Re: New devblog: September status report

Naismith wrote:
Celebro wrote:

Assuming most vets have a godly amount of stuff which is (n), what difference does n+1, 2, 3 or whatever reward you want to make worthwhile doing on pvp areas.

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Instead of the current climate where joking russians botting spawns on Hershfield and Shinjalar and afk-mining liquizit and HDT is the income generating ceiling, it structures the game for new players with an easy-to-understand progression with regards to risk vs reward that incentivizes activity.

Hopefully the foundation will be in place for winter sale. Make it a big one, 75% off or something.

Then add robot paint and decals or something to make newbies buy credits.

Done.



Agreed.  This game can't be designed around the qualms and cries of the current community, and needs to begin looking at how to access a broader audience. 

The target influx of a new playerbase should outweigh any amount of ill-gotten goods through abused past mechanics of the elite few.  Certainly the first few months the vets can throw their weight around on the market or on pvp islands, but if new content and marketing is done right that new playership will catch up and be viable to compete economically and in combat in a few months.

Re: New devblog: September status report

logicalNegation wrote:
Naismith wrote:
Celebro wrote:

Assuming most vets have a godly amount of stuff which is (n), what difference does n+1, 2, 3 or whatever reward you want to make worthwhile doing on pvp areas.

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Instead of the current climate where joking russians botting spawns on Hershfield and Shinjalar and afk-mining liquizit and HDT is the income generating ceiling, it structures the game for new players with an easy-to-understand progression with regards to risk vs reward that incentivizes activity.

Hopefully the foundation will be in place for winter sale. Make it a big one, 75% off or something.

Then add robot paint and decals or something to make newbies buy credits.

Done.



Agreed.  This game can't be designed around the qualms and cries of the current community, and needs to begin looking at how to access a broader audience. 

The target influx of a new playerbase should outweigh any amount of ill-gotten goods through abused past mechanics of the elite few.  Certainly the first few months the vets can throw their weight around on the market or on pvp islands, but if new content and marketing is done right that new playership will catch up and be viable to compete economically and in combat in a few months.

living up to your name

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: New devblog: September status report

Naismith wrote:
Celebro wrote:

Assuming most vets have a godly amount of stuff which is (n), what difference does n+1, 2, 3 or whatever reward you want to make worthwhile doing on pvp areas.

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Vets are not irrelevant, with all their assets it's keeping new players out of this game too. Rewarding new players is still good. Remember though, vets can also take much more advantage on increased rewards.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: New devblog: September status report

Celebro wrote:
Naismith wrote:
Celebro wrote:

Assuming most vets have a godly amount of stuff which is (n), what difference does n+1, 2, 3 or whatever reward you want to make worthwhile doing on pvp areas.

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Vets are not irrelevant, with all their assets it's keeping new players out of this game too. Rewarding new players is still good. Remember though, vets can also take much more advantage on increased rewards.

Vets are irrelevant because you are divided into microscopic factions with long standing grudges that won't be resolved, and the factions will mostly cancel each other out. And if that doesn't happen, POE will murder all of you anyway 2-3 days after the horn of goondor is sounded, so it's a moot point.

Re: New devblog: September status report

DEV Zoom wrote:

Rewards (and the NPCs coming from beacons) can be tweaked when we rework the loot system, which is probably next up.

Rewards do need to be tweaked upwards but I'd rather do it by having more waves of NPCs per anomaly rather than just better drops.

You don't want the effort of getting a team together, travelling to anomaly and hauling back loot to be 90% of the time you spend. People want to spend time blowing things up not doing logistics.

Re: New devblog: September status report

Originally beacons were meant to have an ever increasing difficulty curve, e.g. less and less time to destroy each wave, so the number of robots coming from a beacon would depend on how good you are. Maybe it's time to revisit that.

Re: New devblog: September status report

Your over looking one thing though.  Roaming NPC packs.  Making more waves ensures you encounter roaming npcs.

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Re: New devblog: September status report

Celebro wrote:
Naismith wrote:
Celebro wrote:

Assuming most vets have a godly amount of stuff which is (n), what difference does n+1, 2, 3 or whatever reward you want to make worthwhile doing on pvp areas.

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Vets are not irrelevant, with all their assets it's keeping new players out of this game too. Rewarding new players is still good. Remember though, vets can also take much more advantage on increased rewards.

I don't think Vets are keeping new players out of this game.  Many new players come to the game, but they get bored and leave without ever getting involved in our long standing grudges.  New players need content to keep progressing.  Once they get to the point of needing to get into beta/gamma, then we should be discussing all these vet changes. 
We need to get over ourselves and realize new players don't give a crap about who screwed who over 5 years ago, they just want to play a game and have fun things to do (which they don't)

Re: New devblog: September status report

Ville wrote:

Your over looking one thing though.  Roaming NPC packs.  Making more waves ensures you encounter roaming npcs.

Makes the world more interesting if the coincidence of one or more random events can sometimes create uncomfortable situations, even make you loose a bot. It's an open world why would you want to do the new beacons in a bubble?

Re: New devblog: September status report

Ville wrote:

Your over looking one thing though.  Roaming NPC packs.  Making more waves ensures you encounter roaming npcs.

The same thing could have happened with old beacons on gamma too, so I'm not sure I see your point.

Re: New devblog: September status report

DEV Zoom wrote:

Originally beacons were meant to have an ever increasing difficulty curve, e.g. less and less time to destroy each wave, so the number of robots coming from a beacon would depend on how good you are. Maybe it's time to revisit that.

as i am pretty 100% sure that you guys have played "Firefall" for at least a few hours, i am confident in your knowledge how unbalanced such a system is, even when a multimillion-$ DEV-team works on such a feature. (Thumper grind)

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
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Re: New devblog: September status report

Altera wrote:

I don't think Vets are keeping new players out of this game.  Many new players come to the game, but they get bored and leave without ever getting involved in our long standing grudges.  New players need content to keep progressing.  Once they get to the point of needing to get into beta/gamma, then we should be discussing all these vet changes. 
We need to get over ourselves and realize new players don't give a crap about who screwed who over 5 years ago, they just want to play a game and have fun things to do (which they don't)

Quoted for truth.

This is why botting and afk-mining needs to be purged from Alpha.

And mining needs to be redesigned as a mechanic to be either faster or much less eye-gouging painful.

39 (edited by JetNexus 2015-09-29 06:51:11)

Re: New devblog: September status report

Mining is fine, don't touch AFK-mining. People that want to do mining usually expects exactly this. And if they want something more intense, they won't do mining.

What is pain about mining though, is that when you using a specialised mining bot, you need to either go to the terminal and back very often, or use containers and hauler bot later.
Don't want to write how is done in other game, but can't those containers have legs and go to the terminal and back by themselves like NPC? lol Or the can cannon to shoot at the terminal. Or mobile gate Field -> Storage. Or...

Re: New devblog: September status report

DEV Zoom wrote:
Ville wrote:

... Roaming NPC packs.  ..

The same thing could have happened with old beacons on gamma too, so I'm not sure I see your point.

Roams have predictable routes (controlable by walls as well), nobody sane deployed before a beacon on gamma on the path of a roam. With random positions you cannot simple choose your place wisely.

Re: New devblog: September status report

Goffer wrote:
DEV Zoom wrote:
Ville wrote:

... Roaming NPC packs.  ..

The same thing could have happened with old beacons on gamma too, so I'm not sure I see your point.

Roams have predictable routes (controlable by walls as well), nobody sane deployed before a beacon on gamma on the path of a roam. With random positions you cannot simple choose your place wisely.

Like behind a set of walls on a peninsula where no NPCs are currently at..  Not in the middle of an island randomly on the island.

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Re: New devblog: September status report

and?

is this a game element, or just another industrial mechanic for advanced macros ?

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Re: New devblog: September status report

And?  Maybe you should go out and play with mechanics like trying to do industry on gamma while battling continually spawning npcs.  Maybe not everything is Macroing.  Maybe they enjoy playing and have the foresight to see what is going to be a problem before it happens.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
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Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: New devblog: September status report

Altera wrote:
Celebro wrote:
Naismith wrote:

Vets are irrelevant. It's the new players that matter.

Vets are not irrelevant, with all their assets it's keeping new players out of this game too. Rewarding new players is still good. Remember though, vets can also take much more advantage on increased rewards.

I don't think Vets are keeping new players out of this game.  Many new players come to the game, but they get bored and leave without ever getting involved in our long standing grudges.

I'm also talking about players that has not even played the game because the player gap is too large, no one is willing to wait 6 months of grinding just to be slaughtered in Beta, to provide content for POE. Allying up to them has always ended up badly in the long term.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: New devblog: September status report

Ville wrote:

And?  Maybe you should go out and play with mechanics like trying to do industry on gamma while battling continually spawning npcs.  Maybe not everything is Macroing.  Maybe they enjoy playing and have the foresight to see what is going to be a problem before it happens.

currently i am alone. why should i care about trying to do something ALONE on an island that is dedicated multiplayer territory?

and even if i where there a group, i would need entertaiment for those 23/7 hours when no pvp player bothers to show up.

Probably you mastake gamma for something like those planets they added to starbound that have ZERO monster spawns, no weather and relative flat surface for easy construction?

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: New devblog: September status report

I dunno what game your taking about but maybe you mistake perpetuum for being a game where more than 5 people want to do the same thing at the same time?  I. E. Maybe wanting to do beacons.

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Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: New devblog: September status report

Celebro wrote:
Altera wrote:
Celebro wrote:

Vets are not irrelevant, with all their assets it's keeping new players out of this game too. Rewarding new players is still good. Remember though, vets can also take much more advantage on increased rewards.

I don't think Vets are keeping new players out of this game.  Many new players come to the game, but they get bored and leave without ever getting involved in our long standing grudges.

I'm also talking about players that has not even played the game because the player gap is too large, no one is willing to wait 6 months of grinding just to be slaughtered in Beta, to provide content for POE. Allying up to them has always ended up badly in the long term.

What Player gap are these fantasy new people scared of?? The 12 current players in GC?  Maybe they are reading your posts and thinking there is some big scary group on this game?? wake up!! PVP is dead! PvE is dead! Population is dead!  Players come to this game and last 6 hours, not 6 months.  They log in see its dead and play to find out that the starter content is boring. New players are not worried about Beta, they are struggling with being entertained on alpha. 
While all us bitter vets troll these forums and come up with absurd tweaks to content that has been in game for 5 years and DEVs waste their limited time on removing content and changing the same *** over and over again.

Time to go kick a puppy. fuuu

Re: New devblog: September status report

Altera wrote:
Celebro wrote:
Altera wrote:

I don't think Vets are keeping new players out of this game.  Many new players come to the game, but they get bored and leave without ever getting involved in our long standing grudges.

I'm also talking about players that has not even played the game because the player gap is too large, no one is willing to wait 6 months of grinding just to be slaughtered in Beta, to provide content for POE. Allying up to them has always ended up badly in the long term.

What Player gap are these fantasy new people scared of?? The 12 current players in GC?  Maybe they are reading your posts and thinking there is some big scary group on this game?? wake up!! PVP is dead! PvE is dead! Population is dead!  Players come to this game and last 6 hours, not 6 months.  They log in see its dead and play to find out that the starter content is boring. New players are not worried about Beta, they are struggling with being entertained on alpha. 
While all us bitter vets troll these forums and come up with absurd tweaks to content that has been in game for 5 years and DEVs waste their limited time on removing content and changing the same *** over and over again.

Time to go kick a puppy. fuuu

I guess you haven't be here long enough, when a surge of new players show up, vets show up, when POE feels threatened they show up in numbers (when needed) to say who's boss and spoil it for the new players. I have seen it all happening time and time again.


Those who last 6 hours not sure how many those are not seen any, from my experience they last a few weeks, then there are countless more who have left after 6 months to a year playing, which you are right probably tired of the devs doing too much absurd tweaks for far too long.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: New devblog: September status report

Celebro wrote:

I guess you haven't be here long enough, when a surge of new players show up, vets show up, when POE feels threatened they show up in numbers (when needed) to say who's boss and spoil it for the new players. I have seen it all happening time and time again.

I have been playing since feb 2011, so you tell me when I have been around long enough. 

Your problem is you still living this game in the past (like lots of other bitter vets).  New players will never get to the stage where PoE dominance will be an issue.  New players are bored long before that point, so they just leave.

Celebro wrote:

Those who last 6 hours not sure how many those are not seen any, from my experience they last a few weeks, then there are countless more who have left after 6 months to a year playing, which you are right probably tired of the devs doing too much absurd tweaks for far too long.

Of course you don't know, you don't even play this game.  Didn't you officially quit this game? But still here you are trolling forums. GG

Re: New devblog: September status report

Altera wrote:

Your problem is you still living this game in the past (like lots of other bitter vets).  New players will never get to the stage where PoE dominance will be an issue.  New players are bored long before that point, so they just leave.

New players are not bored in a sandbox when they can engage in player made content. When that content is purposely strangled because of bad game design they become bored and leave.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."