Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Lemon wrote:
Jita wrote:

I don’t understand your argument, to summerise what you guys are saying:
Adding red spawns on Alpha stops botting.
Removing red spawns from Gamma (which is what turrets for all intents and purposes will do) is not going to cause botting because…
a)    All Gamma people are too nice
b)    Botting isn’t really worth it on Gamma even though it is on Alpha
c)    You don’t live on Gamma so nerr nerr

It is ok to take breaks from posting Jita, when you lose your logic we see these kinds of posts.

Ville is not asking for the removal of bots but proper tuning, we all know you can read and comprehend.

Tuning to be done through a number of methods for example.

A) Enable turrets attacking NPC's
        -Many have already stated the range issue on Turrets currently both for players and NPC's
B) Scale the NPC population in relation to the player population

Why you are doom and glooming this thread is.... up to you...

What a Dumb and uneducated post.

Soft Ville wants stuff given to him, as he would claim he has noone to help.
QQ

Harden the *** up. 
Or Ping someone to help you.  You know friends.
Yea lets scale npc's to get more people out their, so we can let them build assets and go *** them.
I am all for that, as I will get the windfalls that associate with said killings.
This is so short sighted, without any regard to what would, and is PLANNED to happen if this comes to pass.
We have people waiting for this to exploit the *** of out it.


Wants to say one side is botting, when I know we already are, yet wants to add in a mechanic that makes gamma COMPLETELY safe again. 

We have a zone like that, its called Alpha.

I am Perpetuum.

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Gamma doesn't have static spawns, so it can't be botted like you and your little russian clique frequently do.

Harvesting on Gamma is a pain in the *** when every 5 minutes you gotta dock up because a roaming spawn waltzed through my turreted choke point.

Doing beacons is on the way out, since pretty soon you'll only be able to do 1 at a time.

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Yeah I know.

Say for instance though, I wanted to use a sequer to drop beacons and then timed bombs to hit those beacon waves so that there was no explosion damage and you got all the loot per wave, there might be one or two rats that didn't die to the bomb blast. It would be convenient for turrets to kill these rather than having a combat do it.

While the real problem there is beacons and that’s going to be addressed at some point this year, why enable abusive gameplay in that way.

Even NPC’s loot aside, it still enables you to sit on a mining spot in 100% NPC safety which is something that the people who made this post have fought against on Alpha. I agree with them and think it should be like that everywhere.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Are you really gonna pretend running beacons like in 2012 is still relevant and valid today? lol

Constructing a Gamma base and powering it to harvest Alpha ores on Gamma in 100% NPC safety is hardly comparable to 100% Alpha safety without any asset investment.

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Take a look at mid way down this page.

http://killboard.sequer.nl/?a=corporati … mp;month=5

Are you really going to pretend they didn't get shown that by you guys?

And as to your second point what your really saying is it's ok to bot if you built a gamma first. I disagree.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Jita for *** sake we've been testing turrets!  Omfg dude its not hard to comprehend if I have to spend 175 million Nic to collect 100 million Nic worth of goods I lose money.

Part two is that there's too many npcs versus player base. 

I.E.  There's more npcs on a given island than in general chat!  And 9 of those npcs will *** a fleet of players.

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Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Turret testing :-)

As I've said several times, come up with a solution that prevents bottling under guns and its no problem. Without that its crazy.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Well there has to be a "balance".  The balance I am referring to is:


Carefree zone of awesome goodness  ->  Challenging fun gameplay  ->  *** Annoying.

Right now we are in *** Annoying zone.  I'm not say we need to get rid of it, just scale it down some where a team of 4 to 5 guys can easily manage NPCs.

Things that need reduction:

1.  Amount of NPCs in one Spawn.
2.  Number of Spawns.
3.  ReSpawn rate. (increase, as it is Instant right now[I'd suggest an hour])

And don't tell me this doesn't happen when we were killing Remedy's base on Krazlov, we had an NPC caravan come in, we nuked it everything was cool.  The spawn literally respawned behind us on the hill almost instantly, it kept doing that for a better part of an hour, we had to split the force.  One to kill NPCs and 1 to kill the base.  It was stupidly annoying.

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Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

you flap your lips but nothing to do with the problem comes out. How if this is implemented is botting kept in check?

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Jita wrote:

you flap your lips but nothing to do with the problem comes out. How if this is implemented is botting kept in check?

Jita...  What is there to bot?

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Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

what is it with this topics when zoom says they will do something, and someone starts a topic "do it now" ?

gamma has ZERO priority atm...

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:

you flap your lips but nothing to do with the problem comes out. How if this is implemented is botting kept in check?

Jita...  What is there to bot?

Well there is HDT and Liquizit which together makes cryo which had good energy properties.

Those minerals also make up the building blocks of every t1 structure.regardless of if you WANT to not, the question is how are you going to stop people who do.

Its not even difficult creating a bot to do noralgis tbh.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

So botting minerals that are available on alpha?  That's your concern?  Botting minerals that can be afk mined in scarabs on alpha?  Oh and botting noralgis??  Oh really not hard you say? 

So you think botting two liquids(available on alpha) is reason enough to make the content a huge pain in the ***?  Two materials that can easily be able to be hauled in are ground breaking? 

Botting noralgis is easy?  Then why hasn't the plant materials on alpha plummeted since botting is so easy?  So the concern is about botting plants and liquids that constantly move fields huh?

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Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

So you answer to how you would prevent Notting is ... Nothing? Just let it happen because it's not very lucrative?

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

build a wall around your base with doors, far enough out so npcs don't see you by whatever you do in there.
done.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Annihilator wrote:

build a wall around your base with doors, far enough out so npcs don't see you by whatever you do in there.
done.

But Annie that would take effort to do and maintain!

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

maintain? walls and terrain don't degrade in a certain radius around any building... and without any player caring about visiting hostile gammas, they stay forever until the population grows.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

You guys are funny.  Its like watching a divorced couple fight over the junk in the garage.

What Ville was asking for is a balance in the roaming red mobs, you say 'he wants this to bot', he responds and tells you it is just a balance and that he doesn't want to bot.  You then go on to show how you could bot on gamma without addressing Vile's request and then say he is too lazy to use that exploit for his botting (which he said wasn't the reason for the NPC rebalance request, but maybe he does want to.. I don't know what goes on in most places).

Bottom line is, if Vile wants to bot on gamma, he can use your trick, but I would like to keep the request, cause again, its not about botting on gamma, its about living on gamma.

Try to live on gamma and find out how stupid hard it is w/o any real benefit.  This is a small tweak that may make gamma more useable.  These are simple ideas that the devs can think about and decide.

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

*edit: Let's cut back that attutide. - DEV Zoom

I am Perpetuum.

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

He's not asking for balance, he's asking for total safety from NPCs while under guns. We have demonstrated that total safety - for a cost - is actually achievable anyway.

Both of these are wrong, total safety from NPCs encourages botting which i a something the people who made this post have gone on about for months and months. Now that it involves them its OK? Ban all botters and don't introduce features that help them IMO.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

This isn't 2011 Jita, fields aren't static anymore. If you're gonna deconstruct and reconstruct a turreted and powered base every time a field moves to "bot" a field of Alpha ore, by all means knock yourself out. lol

Instantly respawning NPC's and their amount on Gamma is not challenging, it's annoying.

Turrets shooting NPC's will be a godsend to the Gamma QoL.

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

it was way better before the speed change when you accually could avoid npcs. and you dont had five patrols on your *** within a minute.
and if im right they had 10min or 30min or a hour respawn timer as well...

right now you see a npc patrol comming. and if you are not fast it will catch you anyway...

48 (edited by Ville 2015-08-04 13:01:02)

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

I've already answered how to prevent botting question.  The systems are already in place.  No terminal with 3k of each other. Sprawl limitations of bases dynamic moving spawns.  Let's think logically.  I'd have to move a base over a moving HDt or liquizit field.  I'd then have to build a reactor.  Then have to build X number of turrets around the base.  And to have an automated I'd guess I'd need boosters online.  Which means I'd only have 6 hours of power in my base.  Now all that just to mine 200 million HDT???  That's not even close to worth it and that's with turrets shooting npcs, my suggestion just balances the npcs by thinning them down.  Which means there's still red npcs and they still roam.  No botting.  And smaller groups of players can manage the npcs.

*edit iPhone typing sucks.

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Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

You would need to move a base and two turrets, both of which could be charged using energy transfers. All of that could be t1 meaning your talking about a deconstruction cost of a third of 540 blocks.

Also it's not just the cost of HDT or liquizit or any other mined substance but the cost and ease of logistics and risk.

Your argument still is based upon if people would want to not or not rather than concrete prevention. Considering you actively campaigned to keep mission and beacon abuse as game mechanics I find it hard relying on your goodwill to balance this already deeply damaged economy.

Why wouldn't walls do the same job?

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: These *** npcs on gamma!

Ville: Just a simple question, why do you live on Gamma?

RIP PERPETUUM