-1 that doesn't even make sense.  Range extenders are bulky for a reason, so light bots and assaults can't use them effectively.  Los restriction on s demob is a huge -1 too.

isn't the issue listed up there the range bonus of the zenith, and not the one from range extender itself?

I wonder why that one is still in anyway, since DEV Alf wanted to remove it already a year ago, since zeniths are used for everything but supression.

i am for LoS restrictions on Ewar. Drainer, Neuts and Interference emitter already got it added for logical (and unlogical) reasons -> so why are the most powerfull combat systems are allowed to stay out of direct fire?

So, would PvP suffer if you would actually have to manually drive your long-range-demob zenith mk2, instead of alt-tabbing, lock target, apply demob, follow main account, then alt tab back and kill the defenseless target?
Or would the new player experience suffer if you cannot put them into a cheap castel with a demob + evasive + lwf as meat shield? They can hardly hide behind something with the short range of the demob anway.

Unfortunately there's not much going on in terms of pvp in the game so we have rather limited observations to work with but I don't that's a good reason to stop balancing things.

wha, *** arm fit...

I wonder why that is so, in a 99% hardcore pvp game, when everything is alright as it is.
We should stop balancing discussions until the server is flooded with steam-player. It won't hurt if those player will face the NERF hammer at any point of their progression, because there will be enough fresh blood to compensate for sudden ragequits after sudden "flavor of the 3 month" build-Nerfs

but back to topic:

L-Demob has twice the range then S-Demob, but:
- lower efficiency, (1/15th !)
- max 1 per bot and
- LoS restriction, together with
- higher AP consumption (x2.66)

S-Demob on zenith mk2 + 2x t4 range extender has ~ same range as L-Demob
- no LoS
- up to 4 of them on the same zenith
- no increased accu consumption
- no loss of efficiency

one got NERFed by two factors after implementation (fit limit, LoS) but the other one was untouched since then. L-Demobs are only effective against LWF fitted bots, S-Demobs are effective against everything that has not demob-immunity (2x t4 medium plate, no LWF)

something IS unbalanced there.

Huh? Those look like remote sensor boosters to me. Is that something else? If you think remote sensor boosters on a Zenith is *** you should re-evaluate. E-war mechs very often remote sensor each other ...FYI.

And with 4 S-demobs you're not gonna get the 'game breaking' range the OP is talking about. You will be in the fight. Long range demobbing Zenith typically only fit one ...MK2s fit 2. Plus you need e-war nexus for those super long ranges. It's all pretty fit intensive. Give/take, ya know.

"*** fit" was related to the visual appearance of two small arm modules on a mech...

im aware that 4-demob-2RE fit wont give you the extreme range Kaldeninen mentioned. That was not the content of my post either...
I am pretty aware that you need to overfit the zenith with RE and even boost it with NEXUS effects to reach those extreme ranges that. Its not necessary to look at the extreme-fit, when something less extreme is already out of balance compared to earlier balance decisions.

that is still the case - i wonder why the demob+ecm+supressor+interference dropper-range-bonus is still on the Zenith. could be reduced to supressor/ECM only on the mk1 and the mk2 extra 2% for everything.

why don´t you just get rid of Ewar all together? This imho is so very -1.

Same as always, if a fleet of damage whores cannot handle rock, paper, scissor, then its not the game mechanic which is broken. Start thinking out of the box, if you cannot figure how to counter.
Its totally ok, on the range that a sniper dmg dealer can shoot it´s target, when he is fit with RE´s and supported by RSA and Nexus but we wouldn´t think of nerfing this.

When ppl where QQing about Trojar´s apparent imbalance, because ppl where not willing to bring a neut or drainer to the battlefield, as it could spoil their max damage, we didn´t want to touch the insane recharge rate of the tyrannos.

How about this idea, just get rid of Ewar all together. So you can just come with your big guns to the battle, to show off. As probably 98% of the players are doing. So you can have your "fun pvp". No Ewar, just shooting each other, while being able to freely move around. I think you should consider counterstrike, as your prefered game. There´s no Ewar there and just "fun pvp" ^^

To get a max range of about 768m, that would include a suppport of T4 Ewar Nexus on lvl 9, RSA,  you will have to dedicate your complete EP´s to Ewar + secondary skills, like accu management, etc... No Guns, no Indu Bots nothing else, for about  2 years to hardcap, which I did for example. Then and only then will you be able to reach those ranges. Against Snipers which shoot you at a range 800m+, not even considering ECM and Suppression at 800+ to counter, where is there a need to rebalance?

If you are willing to dedicate yourself to Ewar, than you should be superior to a casual demob, fitted as a supplementary gadget on a dmg mech.

If you carry on nerfing everything to do with Ewar, you might as well get rid of it completley.

+1 to the this German guy.

Anni, is that you on that account? I can´t recognise the Anni I used to know. There where times, you made sense, but they seem long gone.

I did make my homework and stated the bonus which a Zenith and  i.e. a Vaga would be able to benefit from. Which what I wrote was totaly correct. For an MK2 version. Which I cannot say about your statement of the aparent bonis, a zenith, according to you, would come with:

"demob+ecm+supressor+interference dropper-range-bonus"

My sole attempt, was to show how wrong you are.

For a fact. A Zenith MK2 without remote support, completley hard caped skills, 1 Demob and 5 Range Extenders makes up for a range of 603m Demob range. Modules all T4.

A Vaga MK2, on minimal skills, does already do 745m ECM range, with 3 Range Extender and 3 ECM´s. No remote support. Modules all T4.
Alternative with 3 Suppressors on minimal skills, instead of the ECM´s on a Vaga MK2, already does 745m supressor range. Modules all T4.

So *** yeah, nerf the *** out of a zenith.

Stop QQing and start talking sense, like you used to, instead of that bull. When you are refering to inbalance of a Zenith.

@Mobios. Can you please summaries your argument? Sorry, English is my second language.

Summary: Please don't nerf S-demob/range extenders, I have spent 2 years specializing for this, don't care if the pvp is fun or not.

Edit: OP was asking an open ended request/change for good fun pvp mechanic changes. OP gets accused of whining and on not finding a counter. Same old story in PVP balancing threads.