Topic: Jumpjets Please

The game has some truly "first ever" features, particularly in the evolutionary landscape, plants, and mineral algorithms.

However, any sufficiently advanced society would surely have included jump jets to their arsenal.  I, an others, would like the option to outfit mechs with jump jets that allow temporary flight, jumping, or hovering at the cost of energy.

I can't take credit for the idea, but it's a sure fit in this game.  Please wink

Re: Jumpjets Please

i agree, there needs to be a way to temporarily boost speed rather then just having a LWF...

3 (edited by CoyoteTheClever 2010-12-28 05:16:11)

Re: Jumpjets Please

Jump jets are cool, but I dunno how hard they would be to implement, and with the kind of mechs Perpetuum has, it'd be kind of weird looking. Maybe something more like in Armored Trooper Votoms where the mechs all have skates for when they need a speed boost? Might be kind of tactical if they could only be used downhill or on a relatively flat surface too.

Re: Jumpjets Please

CoyoteTheClever wrote:

Jump jets are cool, but I dunno how hard they would be to implement, and with the kind of mechs Perpetuum has, it'd be kind of weird looking. Maybe something more like in Armored Trooper Votoms where the mechs all have skates for when they need a speed boost? Might be kind of tactical if they could only be used downhill or on a relatively flat surface too.

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5 (edited by Line 2010-12-28 08:27:39)

Re: Jumpjets Please

Carriers. We need flying carriers big_smile

Seriously, they will be useful. Ofc if they are possible to create. They can be in class of industrial heavy mechs or even higher - kinda industrial destroyer. Let them fly not higher than 500m or something - to let anti-air forces bring them down. They can be equipped with 2 mid guns or even bombs.

Almost forget - they should be able to carry one robot regardless of its class. While flying, that robot can't use any modules.

Have a productive day, Runner

Re: Jumpjets Please

The maneuverability gain from having jump jets would make them compulsory even for a heavy group. Being able to cross impassable terrain would be worth every sacrifice. Terrain feature is one of the things that make PO stand out, Jump jets would void this asset.

Re: Jumpjets Please

We need some form of fast travel and some form of easily intercepting it. Simple as.

Make your own teleport networks that require energy transferred to them to make them work. Without energy neither you or your enemy can use them. CEO's of the outposts they are attached to have the power to turn them on and off and they're destroyable from the terrain by enemies but have the same health as a destruction node.

I think these kinds of mechanics need to be corporation based and not alliance based to better focus the game back to its old ways of grouping together and fighting over limited resources rather than welcoming one and all together.

This game should have never allowed alliances to form. More, perhaps all, mechanics should be corporation based solely.

The Game

Re: Jumpjets Please

or drilling jets?

Re: Jumpjets Please

How about player built highways that give a speed bonus

Re: Jumpjets Please

Dont do a weed wrote:

How about player built highways that give a speed bonus

oh wow, that idea is so new...

no actually, i was told by the devs that it would be possible in theory, to have a speed-boost aura between those highway-poles.
I wouldn't make them completely playerbuilt. More along player maintainence of existing roads, and making them damage-able, or like in Freelancer, interrupt the speedboost for a segment.

last but not least - no % speed boost for every bot. we dont need faster ewars. the boost should scale to bring all bots to  ~the same speed.

but thats a completely other topic.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
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Re: Jumpjets Please

*images of 200kph Lithus's bumper to bumper for kilometers*

Ahhh smile

We would absolutely require the 'bumper sticker' upgrade if highways are implemented.

Re: Jumpjets Please

actually i think jump jets as in "Mechwarrior" are quite fun and usefull. No doubt it would change the way we travel now, but you dont need to forget it gives more options in tactics, you need to fit jump jets and hence sacrifice sth else and they could also be heavy which means you loose speed for flexibility.

Re: Jumpjets Please

i second that Andrew, in Mechwarrior the jumpjet was well balanced, fit in the chassis, it was speed vis jump, not to mention the mass of the mech lowering the "jump" value, and aswell the right skill to use it. it was kinda fun to Jump, launch an alpha and cover in the row.

Re: Jumpjets Please

I think this has evolved into two points, the first being travel and the second being tactical advantage.

I would propose two types of module. The first being a travel mod, it reduces combat effectiveness and defence but increases speed. This is the Indy speed mod.

The second is the combat speed/jump mod. This reduces parameters such as cargo space, increases your hit size and maybe affects armour/shield in some way. This creates a traveller/interceptor dynamic. Interceptors are hit and run, they are there to catch things and maybe take out the Indy travellers or small stuff, they are however paper thin, rely on the surprise, speed and the ability to 'jump' in and out of cover or to move onto terrain impassable by a following enemy.

So we don't have mechs fit with the first mod as it makes you pointless in combat. We do however provide a pseudo class for all current bots (except ewar, they are fast enough and have a defined pseudo role). You won't see this in larger gangs as you are made paper thin, you aren't there to hold the line.

On a side note, this also opens up something I have been toying with in the current mechanics which is based on a fast, hard hitter role to disrupt gangs but in effect is a suicide class. For anyone into Warhammer 40k think of assault marines. They jump over a hill and it's all or nothing, you either picked the right fight or you get a whooping.

All good stuff and if balanced correctly, you could end up with a whole suite of new tactics, strategy and possibilities without having to introduce spews of new mechs, it could be done with two mods smile

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Re: Jumpjets Please

Kalsius Dakalsai wrote:

I think this has evolved into two points, the first being travel and the second being tactical advantage.

I would propose two types of module. The first being a travel mod, it reduces combat effectiveness and defence but increases speed. This is the Indy speed mod.

The second is the combat speed/jump mod. This reduces parameters such as cargo space, increases your hit size and maybe affects armour/shield in some way. This creates a traveller/interceptor dynamic. Interceptors are hit and run, they are there to catch things and maybe take out the Indy travellers or small stuff, they are however paper thin, rely on the surprise, speed and the ability to 'jump' in and out of cover or to move onto terrain impassable by a following enemy.

So we don't have mechs fit with the first mod as it makes you pointless in combat. We do however provide a pseudo class for all current bots (except ewar, they are fast enough and have a defined pseudo role). You won't see this in larger gangs as you are made paper thin, you aren't there to hold the line.

On a side note, this also opens up something I have been toying with in the current mechanics which is based on a fast, hard hitter role to disrupt gangs but in effect is a suicide class. For anyone into Warhammer 40k think of assault marines. They jump over a hill and it's all or nothing, you either picked the right fight or you get a whooping.

All good stuff and if balanced correctly, you could end up with a whole suite of new tactics, strategy and possibilities without having to introduce spews of new mechs, it could be done with two mods smile

With all the whining about ewar roams do you really want to introduce something that will allow more potent killing mechs to go as fast as ewar?

If you played in beta we used to be able to stack LWF's so you could have more then 1... this is essentially what you're talking about with your module... it will make you more paper thin but you'll be doing 100kph in your kain so people will cry for a nerf...

Re: Jumpjets Please

I have no personal gripe against ewar roaming gangs but I take your point.

Maybe the module needs some additional negative effects over and above what LWF gives currently (the first one would be that you either have LWF or the Booster, not both)?

If I were to pick on light ewar at the moment its that the only counter is more light ewar..... Maybe some would disagree but this module would provide at least another option other than just blobbing up or bringing out a counter light ewar gang.

I personally think the game 'needs' fast attack, it just needs an effective counter. Consider EVE (and yes I know people will gripe but its an example ffs). I was a long range sniper specialist, all my skills made me excellent at 220-250km range. However I couldn't hit small stuff that far out reliably. Now when the enemy is at a suitable range and an MWD activated I could pop stuff in a volley, they certainly didn't like that!  (Yes I know the EVE transversal calculations played a part but here in Perp we have the hit size for calculations)

There's your counter without naffing about with all the other bot classes. If the bot activates this thing and suddenly mech weapons are effective, you provide a balance against the speed (PS this is just one example). Everyone moans now because ewar + speed APPEARS to trump everything else, here's a new mechanic with a balancing aspect which makes more bot classes effective in a fight, makes using the module need SKILL to use and doesn't require mega content development.

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Re: Jumpjets Please

Kalsius Dakalsai wrote:

I have no personal gripe against ewar roaming gangs but I take your point.

Maybe the module needs some additional negative effects over and above what LWF gives currently (the first one would be that you either have LWF or the Booster, not both)?

If I were to pick on light ewar at the moment its that the only counter is more light ewar..... Maybe some would disagree but this module would provide at least another option other than just blobbing up or bringing out a counter light ewar gang

Ok. so it's either this booster or a lwf.

And this is going to counter light ewar how?

If there faster people will use them instead of light ewar on roams and it will be the new fotm.

If it's slower... it doesn't make any difference. Speed is king and whatever the fastest bot is is what will be used.

And theres plenty of counters to light ewar... bring out a few mechs or assaults and watch the ewar fear engaging... sure you can't chase them down and blow them up... but countering doesn't always mean destroying... when they can't kill you and have no choice but stand there, run, or get off island because it's not a winnable fight... you've won even if you don't kill a single bot.

Re: Jumpjets Please

Kalsius Dakalsai wrote:

I personally think the game 'needs' fast attack, it just needs an effective counter. Consider EVE (and yes I know people will gripe but its an example ffs). I was a long range sniper specialist, all my skills made me excellent at 220-250km range. However I couldn't hit small stuff that far out reliably. Now when the enemy is at a suitable range and an MWD activated I could pop stuff in a volley, they certainly didn't like that!  (Yes I know the EVE transversal calculations played a part but here in Perp we have the hit size for calculations)

There's your counter without naffing about with all the other bot classes. If the bot activates this thing and suddenly mech weapons are effective, you provide a balance against the speed (PS this is just one example). Everyone moans now because ewar + speed APPEARS to trump everything else, here's a new mechanic with a balancing aspect which makes more bot classes effective in a fight, makes using the module need SKILL to use and doesn't require mega content development.

I just got done reading the second half... it'd be neat to have an mwd type device with similar drawbacks... would definitely make things a bit more complex and changing the 'bot size' when active would certainly create a signficant drawback...

But what's to stop heavies from rolling with these and going relatively fast and already having the biggest 'bot size' so going bigger wont really matter unless someone has seismics/precision below 4... I think they'd be too powerful on larger bots because adding speed in this game is different then adding speed in eve...Speed doesn't matter as much there.. here it's the difference between living and dying and getting kills and getting kited.

Re: Jumpjets Please

I do not know if you get the reason behind JUMPjets. As the name already suggests it is about JUMPING with your bot. Not AFTERBURNERS or sth like that.

JUMPJETS add tactics to combat and allow even heavier bots to climb up an hill they would otherwise not reach. You could for example drop some missle bots behind an hill and let them shoot on your enemies gang while he has no los.

Afterburners or Micro wharp drive as in EVE are another story. Like someone already suggested there should be some civil mod (for travelling purpose) and some combat mod (for interception, fast engagement). Well, that is not bad, but imho not necessary as there is already lightweight frame doing this. Maybe there could be a second mod that boosts speed in a different way (less accu reloading and capacity vs. slightly increased speed, stacking with lwf), but as I said, it is a different story than JUMPJETS.

JUMPJETS should not be that difficult to implement and would not change the current roles of bots in this game. Missle bots however could be more attractive with them than others (but then missle range is too short to really favor them a lot more than others using jumpjets).

Re: Jumpjets Please

Andrew Redburn wrote:

Missle bots however could be more attractive with them than others (but then missle range is too short to really favor them a lot more than others using jumpjets).

Missles have a VERY far effective range when properly fit.... being able to fly up on a hill and rain down pain while not being able to be targeted is silly.

And this will change combat... everyone will have to use them or else you'll have some mechs flying into impassible terrain to avoid a gank.


This will require significant balancing and will probably see Missle bots being hit pretty hard in another department.

I am doubtful this will be implemented in the near term.

21 (edited by Annihilator 2011-03-14 18:15:17)

Re: Jumpjets Please

why does it always have to be jump-"jets ?

the last frog that jumped against my moving car didn't have any visible jet propulsions.
we are talking here about robots that are a native life form on that planet. If jumping, then nothing more then a compareable human or animal like form of it.

what those other games with "jumpjets" on 100ton mechs seem to ignore is, that its very unlikely that any ground can withstand the impact of such a mass concentrated on the small area of the feet.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Jumpjets Please

Why not just go back to the idea stated about highways, an area that has a channel of energy that assists travel while in that channel. like from the terminals to the stations.

Re: Jumpjets Please

that has an extra topic wink

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Jumpjets Please

So with the new rework, are these coming?

I am Perpetuum.

Re: Jumpjets Please

Holy necro thread batman