I like your ideas Rex, but in all honesty the only thing that is really going to ignite small gang activity is small gangs, and the only way you're going to get small gangs is if you reset cir/phm. Other small gangs might decide to start roaming then.

I'll flat out say it, the game would be 1000x better off if cir/phm wasn't playing. Hands down, if you guys disappeared tomorrow, Perp might actually grow again.

53

(62 replies, posted in Open discussion)

Ville wrote:

Aranzeb


thanks

Ville wrote:
Rex Amelius wrote:

No one power ever dominated the server territorial ownership before sparks.

Umm..  Yeah they did.... three times actually.


No, they didn't. You're utterly wrong.

@danger stranger - Let's take a step back and actually use our brains here instead of just spouting nonsense about "try-harder!" Okay? You remember just a short 6 months ago when there was all these vets returning and new people getting into it? Yeah? Well, they're all gone and YOUR CORP is to blame, like it or not. So what makes you think that JOKE at it's hay-day that could pull 20+ pilots in mech+ with an allied corp of 20+ noobs, and the Russians that could field 10+ and we couldn't win then, that we'll be able to pull something together now? With what? It's pretty much Jita, beastmode and I left. Suppose we can imagine up some new 1m+ EP vets and put them in bots?

The problem is the current playerbase, the vets. They would rather lord over an empty game with nothing to do and no one to fight, than take a risk to break up into smaller factions and fight. What else is there to do but ask the devs step in, when it's obvious you're not interested in taking any of the responsibility for the decline in the playerbase. Joke has owned up to it's failings, it's role it played. When will you?

Cassius wrote:

You guys shouldn't have to reset.  It's not the solution to anything, it would not fix a single thing, and people in game are free to play with whom they choose.

Your conduct in game, on the forums, and the current game mechanics and how they are used, is a completely different issue. It's entertaining to watch someone who truly enjoys the game, and is invested in it, destroy it thru his oblivious sense of self importance. And I'm not talking about Cindy.

How is the whole "force the Devs to change the game by using the game mechanics to the extreme" strategy working out?


No, you're right, they shouldn't have to reset, but what's the other option? Lord over an empty game just because they can? Maybe it's all just doom and gloom and things will change in the future and more people will start playing but do you really want to take the chance that this is the end? Do the devs really want 2/3rds of the game world to be controlled by one coalition? If the players won't change it for the better themselves, and it's pretty evident sindic or anyone in cir and phm don't want to see 77th go. The question is WHY? It's probably a mix of things, but in the end it amounts to they want to keep on winning at the cost of everything else including the game dying so long as they go out on top.

@syndic - Lets see how trash your corp is at this game without 77th to carry you. No wonder you don't want to reset, we both remember what an asskicking 62nd gave you for years...

If you knew me at all you'd know I was doing neither. But watching you try to deflect my evidently pointed questions with petty little words like that,  is entertaining.

Don't look too closely at the pile of turds that is cir/77/phm's coalition, you might make yourself vomit.

57

(62 replies, posted in Open discussion)

What server is cir playing on, so I can know which server to avoid like the plague it contains?

I don't really agree with total removal of sparks or mobile tele's tbh but I do agree with probes.


I still think sparks are fine, the AMOUNT of sparks are fine, BUT THEY NEED A COOLDOWN! Undock timer or just a flat can't spark out again for 2 hours or 4 or whatever.

Mobile tele's are fine IMHO, although they're not quite so important with the speed increase, and with the planned highway changes they'll probabaly become even less important. Hop on a highway and a seth doing ~130 kph can get there nearly as quickly as waiting for a teleport to charge up.

Probes can stay or go, it doesn't really matter they're easy as *** to kill/neut and makes someone have to come replace them every time and the cost nic (nic sink... although laughably inexpensive).

Ville wrote:
Smokeyii wrote:
Ville wrote:

The problem is the veteran power blocks are bloated and fat with all the spoils from past episodes, mainly beacons, it creates a very steep hill for newer corporations to try to compete and learn.  Sadly, it will always be that way for as long as certain people keep logging into the game.

What these developers need to understand is MMOs work a different way for example WOW, you could have farmed your *** off after months of an expansion being out and day 1 of the new expansion the piece of loot you got was better than the piece you spent weeks/months trying to get in a raid....

WE NEED T5 GEAR.  WE NEED MORE ROBOTS.  The light ewar need to have epi removed from them.  Production costs of robots needs to be turned down, similar to how it used to be. 

You need to curve the Vets to give them a reason to login and play

New corporations should be Alpha 2 based -> hitting Beta strategically for pvp and maybe some industry, while Veterans should self sustain a life on Gamma.

Regardless I don't care about Spark teleports, it won't achieve the goal most people think it will.  sad


I agree with you on parts of that post, but we're talking about 3 dudes vs an entire team of 100's of people.

15 Dudes.  Not 100s. 15.

As for the whole "Veterans should self sustain a life on Gamma" it works great for your alliance, but what about everyone else? Your 3 corps are pretty much the only veterans that play. As you've said the rest of the server can't pull together a force to beat you guys, so should gamma only be for cir/phm/77th then? Anyone that tries now will have to kill one of your bases, and as Jita pointed out will take 9 days to do, of which you only have to show up once to defend. So how is any opponent supposed to do that? Shall we take danger strangers advice and "pull together 15 dudes" like we did this morning? You've run most of our members out of the game, and most I talk to have no interest in playing. I certainly don't.

Half your corp quit after making the push down the hill and got killed on Norhoop.

The only way you or anyone else in this game is going to get any new content in the forsee-able future is if you guys reset and start shooting each other. No one else on the server can fight you guys while you're allied. The fight this morning was just another reminder. Remember the whole "this is a sandbox" thing next time you're complaining about content.

Not going to happen.


First off, my reference to 3 dudes vs teams of 100's is the difference between Perpetuum's devs and WOW that you used in your original post. Not everything I say is about you vile.

2nd, what's your point about getting killed on norhoop? Wasn't cir/77/phm there for that fight? (<-- this part IS about you! YAY). We tried, we lagged/crashed and lost and then you guys started your trolling, and THAT is what drove most of the players that don't play with us out... not the loss.

3rd -- Why not? Give me a serious answer, and no... "because we're pals" isn't going to cut it. You know what you're doing. Explain it to the rest of us, otherwise we've got nothing to conclude other than you're too scaird or you really want to see the game die.

You can call it toxic if you want, if that will somehow make you feel better about the TRUTH that I typed.

Or maybe in danger stranger land there's just gonna be 100,000 people that wake up tomorrow and go "Hey, remember that game that came out 4 years ago that has like 15 dudes still playing it? I wanna BUY it for $30!"

Don't get me wrong, if that happened, I'd be ecstatic. Let's face it though, the game is essentially a clone of a game with a somewhat small niche of players, and the resources to advertise like crazy and keep new content steadily pumping into the game.

The last shining star for the game was steam release, and 6 months later it's proven to be a pretty evident flop. The devs got a boost, upgrade/moved the servers out of their mom's basement we had a fun few weeks of new people to shoot and influence and most of them *** off somewhere else.

What else is there to look forward to? You guys don't seem to want to change to infuse new content, and the only content the devs have added in the past year is a gamma revamp no one wanted, and only 1 entity will use.

Yippe.

Weedy wrote:

My PERSONAL opinion is that sparks in their current form are actually damaging the game, and 77CIR controlling the whole beta is the best example devs can have on their hands as to understand how EASY it can be for one organized entity to have such a huge impact (something that Gunner has been pointing out to you FOR AGES). It is not much about new corporations even, though it can have an effect if 77CIR decided it so (there are almost none new corps in the game atm anyway, nor the population to contest 77CIR utter dominance).


I can agree with that. As it is now, cir/phm/77 get to decide who has fun in the game and who doesn't by denying 2/3rds of the game world to anyone they choose to. If that's NOT something wrong with game mechaincs then what would be?

Ville wrote:

The problem is the veteran power blocks are bloated and fat with all the spoils from past episodes, mainly beacons, it creates a very steep hill for newer corporations to try to compete and learn.  Sadly, it will always be that way for as long as certain people keep logging into the game.

What these developers need to understand is MMOs work a different way for example WOW, you could have farmed your *** off after months of an expansion being out and day 1 of the new expansion the piece of loot you got was better than the piece you spent weeks/months trying to get in a raid....

WE NEED T5 GEAR.  WE NEED MORE ROBOTS.  The light ewar need to have epi removed from them.  Production costs of robots needs to be turned down, similar to how it used to be. 

You need to curve the Vets to give them a reason to login and play

New corporations should be Alpha 2 based -> hitting Beta strategically for pvp and maybe some industry, while Veterans should self sustain a life on Gamma.

Regardless I don't care about Spark teleports, it won't achieve the goal most people think it will.  sad


I agree with you on parts of that post, but we're talking about 3 dudes vs an entire team of 100's of people. What I find to be is that most of the games I'm playing can keep me logging in for a max of around 3 months. Some less than that. Diablo III  has managed to pull me back a few times when they release new content, but the crap they release gives me around 2 weeks or so and then im wore out as they're isn't any depth or challenge to it.

New robots, new pve encounters that require a team of more than me and my remote rep alt (and hopefully with shiny new lewtz think faction stuff!)... that's defiantly *** I'd log in for. Considering how long it's taking for everything the devs have ever put out, it's not likely we'll be seeing that this year.

As for the whole "Veterans should self sustain a life on Gamma" it works great for your alliance, but what about everyone else? Your 3 corps are pretty much the only veterans that play. As you've said the rest of the server can't pull together a force to beat you guys, so should gamma only be for cir/phm/77th then? Anyone that tries now will have to kill one of your bases, and as Jita pointed out will take 9 days to do, of which you only have to show up once to defend. So how is any opponent supposed to do that? Shall we take danger strangers advice and "pull together 15 dudes" like we did this morning? You've run most of our members out of the game, and most I talk to have no interest in playing. I certainly don't.

The only way you or anyone else in this game is going to get any new content in the forsee-able future is if you guys reset and start shooting each other. No one else on the server can fight you guys while you're allied. The fight this morning was just another reminder. Remember the whole "this is a sandbox" thing next time you're complaining about content.


Great song kanogi, love me some Johnny Horton.

Syndic wrote:

There is nothing poisonous in the community.

We stomped you and laughed at you about it, your feelings were hurt.


Nope, that doesn't bleed toxicity at all...

Syndic wrote:

Gremrod is speaking out because he has an unique perspective on the game. He has also done more then his fair share to promote the game to other players, which to be honest neither the Devs nor the game deserve.

The game has since release always been plagued by vets manipulating the Devs to get changes implement that benefit their corporations. We've seen it before and we're seeing it now, nothing new or shocking there.

What's the problem again?

Oh, Gremrod's wearing CIR tags.

Tell me more about your feelings. lol


How is Gremrod's perspective on the game unique? How is it any different that any other cir/77th member's perspective? Serious question, please explain.

I don't think anyone has questioned Gremrod's promoting of the game. Plenty of other people have done their part in that. I answered questions on steam when it was going to greenlight. Just the other night I answered questions on the youtube spot. What's your point? That because he does his motives are without question?

I do happen to agree with the next part of your statement. I've said it several times, that the community involvement in the development process is a double edged sword. Some people have more say than others, or sometimes it's seen that way. There's always an argument from one side or the other on things that are suggested, and many times the only reason is because of the side that person happens to be on.

Maybe the best thing they can do is stop listening to all of us and make the game they want to make and tell us when they want to tell us. Don't see how that could possibly make the game any worse off than it already is, because the state of the game currently is the result of one alliance's actions.

Gremrod wrote:
Smokeyii wrote:

The main causes for the poison is guys like me trying to be best of my ability to get a point across

Well glad you agree and I am not saying you are the poison. The community in a whole can be poisonous. I could have gone on further to explain in detail by what I meant by the term poison in my blog post. But catchy titles and posts that are not walls of text seem to go over better on mmorpg.com.


I get what you're saying and I agree with the fact that it can be, but for different reasons than you suggested. Other than Jita and I (and every once in awhile Jelan, although he just likes to twist the knife) there's no one else from our side that really have opinions. And every time we bring one up it's met with derision and ridicule or outright dismissed simply for our corp tags. The best thing I can say is that I've never heard Jita bring up EVER anything to do with killing the game, running other corps out of the game or anything but a desire to see Perpetuum grow and succeed, and I can't say the same for your leadership.

Stranger Danger wrote:

gremrod you realize the only reason the joke-tards are trolling you is because of your corp tag.  you post the same thing under an untagged alt and they would agree with you.


I will admit a lot of it has to do with the corp tag. When you're apart of the group that's mostly responsible for the "poisonous" community and then saying that the devs need to talk more about their vision for the game and that will cure the poison, I'm sorry but you're full of ***.


It's a shame that it's become the devs responsibility to fix the community, I've tried to get the point across that it's mostly the actions of the few leadership on your side that's the cause, and the only responses I've gotten is "Nuh-huh!" and "You're just mad cause we won" or something similar.

I also disagree with the premise of the topic as well, and I don't think that the devs stating their goals more often will do anything to lessen the "poisonous" atmosphere of the community because that's not what is creating the toxicity in the community. The devs have stated goals for years in chat and on the forums and blog posts.

The main causes for the poison is guys like me trying to be best of my ability to get a point across to people too blinded by the rhetoric one person spins and forever failing because either I don't know how to explain it properly, or they're just too dense to get it. This is a player problem for several reasons, including the lack thereof, and one persons desire to drive the train off the tracks.

Rex Amelius wrote:
Jita wrote:

Gremrod come on, your acting like we've not been on teamspeak listening to the main guys in your alliance saying they want to kill it.

YOU ARE SO FULL OF ***!!!

You only hear and see what you want to hear and see. You're so consumed by your own bitterness I'm not sure whether to be angry or just sad for you.

ITS A *** GAME WITH MECHS THAT SHOOT EACH OTHER


The same could be said for you Rex. I've been there, I've heard it. More than once. Maybe when/if you've heard it you just think it's a joke, but actions speak louder than words.

Gremrod wrote:

For the record I have only come across one person that tried to ruin this game and he even stated it in his speech to the the M2S corp after he was caught duping.


You're seriously deluded if you actually believe that. There's even been forum posts here... on this forum. I can't count how many times I've heard "This pleases me" from certain somebody on TS when anything is brought up about running people out of the game, or some perceived griefing has occurred.

Supremacy wrote:

I am referring to the 400+ accounts from the members of DP alliance that Jita promised leadership to and security but the result was absence and rhetoric.



Smokeyii wrote:

"You removed more people from the game than any other entity ever could by promising them leadership then vanishing.


Ta-Da-  !!


for reals look in the mirror, how many people were in those corps from  Demolition Patrol?

k thx bye"




Seriously gunner? Are you referring to Cons? Because the way I saw it their membership started to decline by a lot while they were still allied to us, and even after they left their membership fell apart. All we did was try to include them, but when you lot had them so riddled with spies and nutcuppers we couldn't trust them.

So look at your own alliance mates for that. cir is responsible for driving more people from the game with their underhanded tactics, starting with ecorp nearly 4 years ago. Pot calling the kettle black when it's stainless steel.


I don't know where you're getting your information, but considering that I have firsthand knowledge of leadership discussions for the most part, I don't remember a single promise to give anyone leadership in DP. Brandon and texaspete  and another one from Cons were leadership in the alliance and were included in all of the alliancewide discussions.

And don't you remember all the posts you made about how to kill an alliance and everything after it happened, and now you want to blame it on Jita? Get real. Did you take your meds today?

Gremrod wrote:
Jita wrote:

If you hate the game and it's players so much then leave already.

Now we know this is not true. Does anyone think this is true? If so I will leave.


I don't Gremrod and to be honest you're one of the only shining lights in the darkness that is cir/77th.

"You removed more people from the game than any other entity ever could by promising them leadership then vanishing.


Ta-Da-  !!


for reals look in the mirror, how many people were in those corps from  Demolition Patrol?

k thx bye"




Seriously gunner? Are you referring to Cons? Because the way I saw it their membership started to decline by a lot while they were still allied to us, and even after they left their membership fell apart. All we did was try to include them, but when you lot had them so riddled with spies and nutcuppers we couldn't trust them.

So look at your own alliance mates for that. cir is responsible for driving more people from the game with their underhanded tactics, starting with ecorp nearly 4 years ago. Pot calling the kettle black when it's stainless steel.

Gremrod wrote:
Smokeyii wrote:

I fail to see what you seek to garner by posting this topic on mmorpg.com.


Are you trying to bully the devs into your way of thinking? You're right though, this community is poisonous, with the most vile and disgusting being either in your corporation or allied to it. So, congrats on that, I guess.

Did you read what I wrote or did you only see what your eyes/mind would allow you to see?

Because you must of skipped right over this part at the end.

The developers need to convey their vision for the future of Perpetuum. Once this is done I think a lot of the poison seen in the communities posts will subside and the game will start to see successful strides.

I invite you to come and become part of this very passionate and exciting community and team of developers and players in Perpetuum!



That's kinda like saying "You're a worthless waste of space, you're no good for anything, we should put you out of our misery."  And then adding "I mean no disrespect" and the end of it and thinking that that makes up for the rest of the crap you said.

Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:

Well, we want pvp, how do you get pvp?  Force the hand of your enemy to either take it or not.

It's nothing to do with that and you know it doesn't get you PvP, quite the opposite.

Jita you know first hand what happens when pvpers roll a gamma base.  At best 60% of the corporation stops playing the game.  And that's the last thing any of us need.


So, by you're logic.... lemme see if I get this right.... "We'll control all the islands so that if someone wanted to put a base down we won't feel the need to go kill it and make them quit"

Did I get that right?

How about.... you just don't *** do it? Jesus *** Christ.

Gremrod wrote:
Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:

So its Ok if a Cam mk2 can get within Demob range without you knowing?  But its not ok to see a miner at 2K Meters?

yes because the cam needs to do the work to find the miner whereas a detector can sit at strategic points under a station or gate and see everything.

This is something that has been missing from the game for a long time. Well since detector modules were introduced. They should have left the assault masking alone and left detectors out of the game.... But some people said that the assaults were too OP.

So the more I think about it the more I am for removal of the detector module!


+9001

This is what got lemon and I crossways years ago, he was mad that he couldn't see a masked assault till he was in demob range, and I said so what? cry more. And he did.

I agree with this in part. I think sparks are ok, except for the fact that there's no cooldown to it and therefore no commitment on the players part for sparking. Mobile teles I like... a lot, although with the speed increase, and the planned highway expansion maybe they're not as important as before.

Probes and detectors should be taken out IMHO. Hell, I'd rather see the 1k meter standard detection for every bot/mech like the old days to be honest. Maskers should stay and assaults should get a masking bonus because surprise buttsecks in assaults is a lot of fun, was back in the day, would be today too.