2000 masking!!

lol ...gotta get within 40-60 to find them

I'm at work and not ingame
How expensive?
How long to 'activate'?
How many hit points?
Do we have to target a buddy to kill them (like plants) or can we target them directly?
If shot directly, there is an aggression flag on Alpha/Beta when you shoot them right?
Any notification they are being shot? besides the sudden loss of sight...
Can I build 100 feet of walls around it when those come out?

Yes, I think I came across pretty harsh. That's not my intention. I want this game to succeed. I want the Devs sweating the problem of too many players!!! ohhh noo

Getting too many people to play the game and crash your servers is GREAT problem to have. I look forward to the whining on lag and overcrowding.

Whatever happens I'll be playing till you drag me out (or I get a new girlfriend)

I posted this in the 'general' forum thread but I think it was drowned out in politics ...or it's just a bad idea. But here it is again.

Integrate some NPC activity into the SAPs for two reasons:
1.) Give defenders something to do when no one comes to attack. Currently, it's boring.
2.) Force outpost owners to actively increase stability. Currently, outpost owners do not need to even log in or be anywhere near their outpost to increase stability. As long as no one attacks they will gain points. This doesn't really promote active living on Beta.

The general idea is to spawn NPCs on or near an active SAP. Those NPCs interact with the SAP (depending on which one) to prevent outpost owners from passively gaining stability points. But NPCs should not directly make owners lose points, either. Only players aggressors' actions should decrease outpost stability. If the owner wants to gain outpost stability the owner has to be there to stop the NPCs. Obviously, if player attackers show up then you have bigger problems.

NPC specifics for some of the current SAPs

• Destructive SAPs
  Spawn Combat NPCs that shoot at your Destructive SAP, player defenders, and player aggressors. Perhaps the NPCs shoot the SAP when no one is around but directs all fire to ANY player in the area. If NPCs succeeds at 'destroying' the SAP, the defender gains no stability points. If defender stops the NPC (destroys them or tanks their fire), defender gains points. If player attacker succeeds at destroying the SAP, defender loses points.

  
  

  The mechanics here may have to get tricky since, we don't want NPCs to shoot down 90% of HP only so player can ninja the last 10%. Nor do we want NPCs to take down Destructive before player attacker gets the full hour's chance to do the same. So there may need to be some dual system: NPC shoots one thing and players shoots another, perhaps. I'm still thinking about this one. We don't want one directly affecting the other.

• Passive SAPs
  Spawn Combat NPC roaming spawn somewhere near SAP. Defender must stop the NPCs from roaming to the SAP and sitting on the passive. Same gain/no-gain/loss rules from above. Perhaps another dual system.

• Specimen SAPs
  Spawn Industrial NPCs that carry all the specimen components for the SAP. Defenders must stop them. Attackers can actually use them to gather the necessary specimen stuff. Same gain/no-gain/loss rules.

• Hacking SAPs
  Spawn Combat NPCs to hack your SAP... more or less the same as above.

The details and specifics have lots of options. Difficulty of the NPCs, how many, etc? More difficult with increased stability?

Of course, those NPCs should drop some really nice loot to the benefit of both attackers and defenders.

Overall the purpose is to incentive activity on Beta, whether it's for attackers or defenders. The system can have something for everyone. Right now it seems the defenders have little incentive to come out and play. Give them kernals.

Another thought...

I'm on board with the idea that defenders need something to do for two reason:
1.) it's boring sitting around doing nothing.
2.) the objective is to promote activity on Beta. Current system theoretically allows a corp to take an outpost and never come back again. As long as no one is taking the SAPs, the 'defender' gets increases in stability. Stupid. Defender should DO something to increase stability or at least increase it more than doing nothing.

Enter NPCs
Just like beacons, perhaps you devs can spawn some NPCs to chew down while the defenders are sitting around protecting SAPs. Which NPCs? How many? How hard? Do they spawn on the SAP? Around the station? I don't know.

That could help with the boredom issue, but not even gonna attempt to go there on how it could affect SAP gain/loss.

...just an initial idea

------EDIT, I've decided to 'go there'

Combat NPCs sits or roams toward passive: No point loss if NPC succeeds. Point gain if you keep them off. Point loss if player sits there.

Combat NPCs shoot at your Destructive. No point loss if NPC succeeds. Point gain if you save the Destructive. Point loss if player kills it.

Industrial NPCs do, uh something, and carry all the specimen requirements. No point loss if NPCs succeed at whatever they doing. Point gain if defender stops them. Point loss if player succeeds at the specimen.

Hacking?, I'm getting tired...

As much as I've learned about this game over the last 2 months of playing I'm VERY reluctant to ask for specific changes. I am still learning the mechanics and the implications of % changes here and there. I leave that to to others.

However, and this is just a thought, it may be cool to see T4 CTs come out of high stability SAP cans in a similar fashion as with Artifacting. Some % chance to find 25/50/75 in a balanced fashion that does not screw those guys who spend 10000 hours farming kernals for research.

Again its about balancing playstyles; carebears v. killers. Give both the same *** but through means that each enjoy. I would love to have T4 mods to make you cry but why should i have to spend gazillion hours farming when i may find one by chance doing something I love ...*** on your territory. Even better if I can 'passive hack' it out of your outpost inventory:P:yarr:

At the same time farmers may not like roaming ... you guys see where I'm coming from here? Give us ALL advantages, but let us play the game in different ways to achieve those advantages.

*** man, I'm gonna get fired at work if I don't stop reading these forums.

By the way devs, I love your game!

Overall I think the system is good. It may just need some adjustments.

Specifically, the ease of taking SAPs and gaining or losing stability is pretty off balance. But I have some different ideas on tweaking than what I've read so far.

I like the aggressive nature of the system, but I can really see the annoyance of sitting around waiting for something that never comes. Even if you only have one outpost it can become exhausting defending it on average TWICE a day. That requires multiple timezones and lots of manpower. Period.

Right now the difficulty of taking SAPs seems linear, though I could be wrong. Is it just as easy to take an outpost from 10 to 25 as it is to take it from 60 to 75? Or do the SAPs get easier or more difficult as you go up the stability ladder? I'm not sure.

Perhaps the difficulty should scale. Or perhaps the points you lose or gain can be adjusted. Or some combination of both. But leave the 8-16 hour timers!

One suggestion: reduce the points you lose or gain when taking or defending an SAP. This allows aggressors to get their loot or a potential fight everyday all over the map. It also gives defenders the option of prioritizing and choosing their own battles. If every SAP loss or gain is critical to your stability and operations then you are going to get burned out really quick. But if the gains and losses are not as critical a defender can afford to lose a few SAPs without terribly affecting their real life sleep. But in no way should a defender be allowed to remain lethargic forever. Eventually you have to defend yourself or you're out! It makes more sense that it takes a long time to stabilize or destabilize an outpost, not just a few days. Hence the word: stability.

Another option: Scale the difficulty of taking SAPs as they increase in points/stability. If I'm defending my home and I'm down to the last 5 points of stability I kinda like the idea that it should be HARDER for an aggressor to cross that final line of taking the outpost. We're talking final LAST STAND baby. It should not be easy for the attacker to send in some paltry force and finish it off. It should be an organized operation that defenders and attackers know is coming as points dwindle down to the last.

Continuing the scaling difficulty option, as an outpost gets closer to 100 in stability it should be EASIER for an aggressor to take SAPs. Thus raiders can get the awesome loot from high stability outposts and also make it really hard for defenders to get and maintain perfect stability. Devs say 100 should be hard, so make it easy to attack when its high.

I realize high stability / easy SAPs may be counter-intuitive but screw reality man, I want a FUN game. Reality is offline.

Also, I like the scanning process for timers, for aggressors at least. I think intelligence gathering is right on. But I do not like the in-game SAP notification that ANYONE can see when they enter an island. Perhaps only corps and/or friendly settings should see them. Finally, passive hacking is kinda gay.

edited like 3 fkkn times for grammar and clarity

Well a war front is what many people want, not a nice safe place to sit and mine epi unmolested.

I've heard this complaint about Arkhe scouts and it simply perplexes me that anyone would see it as a 'problem.' Since when is it a problem to post sentries and report enemy movements? That's called teamwork and intelligence gathering. Whether in life or in game they are fundamental components to any fighting force.

If anything the game could develop alternative methods to getting on island, but that's something for the Feature Discussion and Requests thread.