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Perpetuum Forums → Posts by Syrissa
ville, probs are way too expensive to replace them all the time. lower the cost to 5k nic and i agree. but needing 5-10 mil a day is not aceptable. bewsides the gate scout with alts or trial agents as it was used all the time can not be called a good system. its just annoying. probes and walls were a usefull solution...
maybe armored probes can be another way.
oh anni im pretty sure he talks about HP or Armor Points...
but in general i think he is right. probes are totlay useless atm because you can only use them within the 3000m radius of a outpost so they can be protected by a wall. and without a wall they are useless because the will be blown up after half a day.
and btw probe 3000m close to the outpost will not realy be much of use anyway...
walls and probes are pretty much useless and broken atm...
+1 to op
very nice snipi...
but imentium and liquid is not showing anything for me 
So I make my way to a gamma island and find an outpost with everyone fast asleep in their TZ. Can I TF on, in, around it?
in the blog its said that you may need to terraform to get a suitable place for a outpost. so terraforming can not be bound to outposts
a few more things i want to add.
with the walls the defenders had for the first time in perpetuum a advatage. before that the attacker was always at the advatage. the attackers got the surprise. if even one gate scout was afk it was all for nothing at the gankers had a few easy kills.
with the walls the owner of the island could use the island for their own benefit. they could wall off entire regions if they wanted to, and as it seams it had in most cases the effect that was planed. no wall can keep anybody out of there. but it buys time. time to respond and time to get you miners or pve bots back and bring the pvp bots out. i think the alsbale natives have shown that often enough that they can pvp and do pvp. but not pvp like the persons that complain like. pvp for them is just to rush in and kill everything at is an easy target.
the walls changed that. they got no or very few easy kills. the walls kept them out for long enough. not stop them. but it gave you time to react. and if a overwelming force shows up then im realy sory that you did not get your 2 miners killed that were the only ppl online atm on that iland. but if you have the choice to fight a certain death with 3 ppl against a attack force of 10 or more. i think then it is acceptable to say that then we dont fight at all.
we like to fight and we do fight. and we have shown that often enough. what we dont like is to get ganked. and for that the walls were pretty usefull.
but back to walls:
the walls were used to create a realtivly save zone around the outpost with enough room and locations to do anything in it without beeing shot on a 30 minute basis. for that you need some decent mining or npc spots within that area. with the new patch (3000m) this will make the walls more then useless. the wall are not there to protect the outpost. that one dont needs a defense. the walls were there to protect the spots of intrest around the outpost. and there are nearly no spots of intrest in a 3km radius. with this the walls became useless, and there is no need for a medival fortress, because there is no gain in it.
if you would say 4000-5000m then i would say it still would have been of use. but with 3000 there is no gain. with this the walls will be broken to a way were there is nothing that it is worth to build and maintain them.
@zoom
just giving my concerns about it...
- outposts have to be save enough
- attacking outposts should not end in endless shooting or bombing
...
maybe i could have kept that shorter.
but in general i like your idea of the networks.
the other thing i have thought of:
everyone is talking about destroying the enemy outpost. will there be any ways to capture one???
im not sure that this system will work. but sure i will be willing to give it a try.
if i compare it to STeve. even with the reinforce timer of a pos (and there is way less at stake with a pos then with a loot filled outpost). it often took quite a while with your dreads to take down a pos. and when groups get bigger the times for you to shoot/bomb down a outpost will decrease. so either the ppl will complain that it takes half a day to bring that down with massive numbers. and even if it works it will be not enough reaction time of any holding corp if its not on their timezone.
and in the same way for the holding corp it will not be worth risking to build an (most likely) expensive outpost and store thinds even more worth in it, just to see it gone when they log in the next day (or few days).
the only way i see it that you will not need to attack for hours and hours and still have enough time to strenghen your defences and prepare for an attack.
1. the attacks have to be multible ones in a big time frame to get a outposts down. no shooting or bombing over hours.
2. the time frame has to be big enough so that the holding corp has enough time to react. this is in my opinion 7-14 days compared with what is at stake with an outpost.
in my opinion it will be hard to be able to achief this with a system. i havent given it too much thought, but i think you will need a multible layered reinforce state.
lets say the outpost facilities and buildings are shielded.
at first only the first layer of defence is vunrable, so you can attack it till the reinforce comes in. when you come back the second layer is vunrable and so on. with this you dont have to shoot 20trillion hps down that i think you would need to get a "save enough" outpost to store anything in it. so each attack is limited in the time you will need (if you breached the active defences, may it be turrets or may it be players defending). but you will need a lot of these sucessfull attacks, so you cant take an outpost within a few hours or even a few days.
Get back to WoT Tux please.
Remove the walls, no refunds and man up the rest of you
well i have to agree more and more with lemon. maybe you should change your avatar to a troll. you relay going more and more in that way.
you may have not got the meaning of a sandbox. and you may be pissed because your old easy kills tactics are no longer working.
and one last thing jelan, there is not only your way. cry lowder the devs may hear you. there is not only your "brute force we smash it all" way. there are other things ppl can do. but when they do then you cry. sad enough that the devs react to that.
we dont have to go to alpha if you dont like the way we play. but if you dont like the way we play we dont force you to come our way. you are just stuborn and i havent seen any real reason from you or your m2s friends besides "it kills my pvp".
try to use your head insted of crying. it may help. but i know. kids nowadays dont like to use their heads while playing games.
even if i dont like to day it here. i totally have to agree whith lemon here. he made the best point i have read in the forum about walls.
i dont want to add much to it so ill leve it with this.
+1 to no wall change
i totally agree here. let the ppl decide what to do. if you want to live behind a wall then its your choice. if you dont like it do something or let them be. its not your choice to say this is the wrong way...
i have to agree with arga here. look at the most maps. the oupost owners will have little to no benefit from a 3k range. there is still plenty of space left tha you can not wall of. but also you still will have a benefit. with 3k it will be more or less as it was without walls because the 3k will mostly not benefit you in the imprtant ways.
i think that 5k is a good number.
of cource it will be a difference between beta1 and beta2 islands.
beta 1 islands have more outposts and with that less area were you can not wall.
on beta 2 there is much more free room...
anyway look at the maps and see for yourself what will be in a 3km radius it will be not a lot of usefull things.
3k will make walls nearly as useless as probes. then as it has been said before probes only work with walls that protect them. and probes around a 3k radius at your outpost will not realy help you. and they are way to expensive to be droped around just to be shot.
the other thing is that all the walls on the map that are outside that radius will be very useless in a very short ammount of time. then a wall only werks when its closed. and we have enough ppl in this game that will poke qute a few holes in there once that patch comes out. with that all the walls will be mostly useless. so will have been the nic and the effort that were spend there. for these ppl it will be a slap in the face.
if you want that change then remove all walls and reimbuse all spend nic... well but will not change the effort... that was for nothing... ^^
an outpost is no pos in eve. its a way bigger thing especialy with the assets of the players in it.
so if you are able to destroy it then it has to take time. just as it takes time to capture an outpost with the current intusion system. so one attack over time period (lets just say 8h for now) should get the outpost down at max by 15%. and still you would be able to level it in 2-3 days. what i think is still too fast...
a assault on a outpost schould take at least a week with a lot of fighting and bombing or whatever to get it down.
the system has to be ballanced that the defender has the advantage, and that the attacker has it hard to take it. then there may be a lot to gain and for the others a lot to lose.
if the attacker gets the easy kill with a lot to gain with not a lot risk or effort then the pbs will fail because it will not realy be used.
i just figured that a mobile teleport beacon will have the same effect as a stationary teleporter or a outpost in comarison to wall deployability.
i just had to place a probe and a small wall segment to keep that probe relativly save. it was a long way so i took a teleport beacon with me for the way home. arrived at the destination i droped the beacon before i got to work because it would have been done fast anyway and so the beacon could already charge up. i got a shock shortly after as i tryed to deploy the first wall segment: "this item can not be deployed within a 1000m range from terminals or teleports."
ok i understand that is not possible with stationary things. but a mobile beacon preventing the placement... dont tell me this is a feature...
was a long way home... ^^
Single reinforce with a 12hr timer seems a little short given that you can lose everything you have stored there. I do like the idea of destructible terminals, but I think they may well cause issues.
i might have some issues here as well.
- powerfull blocks might take adavatge of this and wipe a lot of outposts of smaller groups just to get the loot.
- to prevent that ppl will most likely not call the gamma terminal their home. they most likely leave a lot of stuff on alpha or beta and will only use their gamma terminal as a hub with minimal equipment in its storage.
- 12 hours defently is way too short. to destroy a terminal it should be more like 12 days with mulitble successfull attacks to get it down. so ppl will have time to reorganise, repair the attackers damage, or evacuate if they see fit.
you can care about disconected ppl when you add a timer. say if you stay logged out for less then 10 mins then you can instantly log back. if its more then 10 mins the block mechanic works (what ever this will be).
im not a fan of bigger is better, but maybe here it will work. still too big also is not good. but i agree that at least 2 more "layers" of islands around the now existing ones would be nice.
a few more icons would also be nice... so you can actualy see for what item the ct is without reding thourgh all these texts.
Would be interesting to see what happened if they did put something like 500 to 1000 gamma islands in at one time.
well as i said before... pll tend to do stupid things, and there is a reason not to overdo things. you want a thousand islands? we dont even have a thousand players, even more we dont even have close to a thousand players that would be intrested in gamma or terraforming.
but this sounds nice. you just need to walk 4 hours to get to that carebare corp that build themself a outpost on the most remote isle just to kill their 2 lonly miners. then you can walk 4 hous back. sure this will be worth the fun. because you did a great job. you showed then that there is someone else besides them in that gameworld. they should realy be thankfull.
sometimes i realy ask my self if ppl think before they post... and sometimes i ask myself if they have the ability to think at all (sry pls dont take that personal)
Overall not very sandboxish but also nothing to be worried about.
this is sooo true
Suffice it to say there are a gazillion more important things this game needs than this arena...
this is even more true
but
this is a discussion to bring up new ideas. we dont discuss what is important or more important then other things. this is just about the posibillities and ideas and to discuss them... so no harm done anyway.
2. If you don't want ads on Perp-Kill, chip in to pay his hosting.
there are even better ways if you dont like ads...
try using firefox and the adblock plus addon. i havent seen too much advertising on most websites for quite a while. this stuff is good. it cant block everything, but it does block a lot. i can recomend that ^^
personaly i dont care enough about this. but for you ppl to say. just try to think outside of your box instead of just saying this is not sandbox...
dont over react to the no loss thing. this idea may need some adjustments, but in the basic this is a nice idea.
well you can put out the no loss thing. why not do this with t1 fittings only? so not much to loose anyway.
have some sort of minigame sonds intresting for a lot of ppl. this might be a good way to show ppl how this game works and maybe will give a lot ppl some fun when other things are unavalible.
give it a thought. you could do a fun thing out of this, if its done the right way.
if you come with 10 ppl to find a container so give everybody in your squad 1000 numbers to try. so you can open the continer in a reasonable ammount of time for sure. or even fast if you are lucky or the owner is stupid enough to use a stupid code. (like 1234.. oh wait thats my code. and change the code on my container at once!)
still in most cases nobody would bring a scarab to a hostile pvp island just to get some can loot. yes some pirate ppl might think of this as a good idea. but in general it will olny bring more grief. miners are prey to any pvp. why give them more? i dont see a reason. kill the hauler that gets there to collect it if you want loot. and then bring yours to get it. this is enough... if you cant be patient then its your problem.
Perpetuum Forums → Posts by Syrissa
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