51

(17 replies, posted in General discussion)

Arga wrote:

I guess my question for Takeo -

Did you fit demob?

I know that it was not needed pre-AI boost, but it seems like the new AI is going to require PVE bots to fit more like PVP; that's good as it allows PVP players to actually get PVP type practice on NPC's, but it's probably bad from the PVE'ers view, as it requires ratting bot to give up a tuner and probably put EP into something they wouldn't have had to.

On the other hand, your experience is with as you say, the hardest bot in the game to kill; which in theory should require more EP and extensions posibily to kill then a normal NPC.

Nope, no demob, but it does bring more light to NPC itself.  Is it not here to kill intruders (lore) and if so, why is it running away?  If it takes one guy to have ubber tank, run up and take the dps while demobing, and another to, lets say neut it, and another to add DPS, then there is not enough incentive to even engage them as their drops are at best mediocre and not worth the risk to then divide between 3 pilots.

Pin them at aggression (let them be the hunters and aggressors) or increase their drops to make it worth even pursuing them.

52

(44 replies, posted in Balancing)

Lupus Aurelius wrote:

^^^ if that is indeed the case, and the issue comes from having the outpost recycling service to 4, then yes, the appropriate response is to reduce the outpost upgrade bonus, and not the recycling skill itself.  Diminshing returns - lvl 2 outpost should still deliver at the old rates, but lvl3 from lvl 2 increase gives a lower percentage return than lvl 1 to lvl 2, and even lower going from lvl 3 to lvl 4. This should be able to be done easily by the devs, and not a general nerf to everyone everywhere.

+1 - nerf the recycle increase ranges as the beta terminals go from 2 - 3 - 4 and leave EP skilling back to the number that had us all choose to increase it.

53

(17 replies, posted in General discussion)

topic #3

How about a SAP probe that can be purchased and deployed outside of the owners terminal (say 500 km from terminal).  It would relay timers and SAP information to the station that would be accessible to the owners?

Make it a probe that can be destroyed. or assaulted and repped back to functioning levels.

54

(17 replies, posted in General discussion)

topic #3 SAP changes.

Thank you for listening to players and removing the on island SAP visibility window for anyone to see.

Change: SAP locations are only visible from within 1,000 km of the SAP location.

This distance is not sufficient.  When you own a station, you should be able to undock and see all your sap locations.  To drop a SAP probe every time to know when your station is at risk of aggression is a bit much.  It seems that you are resisting the option to add the next timer to a window for the owners to see.  I don't really understand this logic.  We can tell the station who can dock.  We can tell it to put out island wide bonuses.  We can tell it to buff 5 indy options, but it won't tell us when it goes into a vulnerability mode without doing out side of terminal probe drops?  Confusing.

I think for the short term, look at the SAP locations of all Beta station, see what distance they are from the undock and adjust the distance of site to those areas based on the farthest one on the map.  I would guess 2,500 km viability for all SAP locations, from any bot would be a reasonable distance.

55

(17 replies, posted in General discussion)

Topic #1
New NPC AI.
Wow, they have a brain.  I would like to summarize my new NPC ratting experience since the new patch (Beta mechanics)
Superior observers:
1.    They were easy to make self-drain out, shooting randomly until drained-- now they control their accumulator -- GOOD
2.    They could get caught in a nook or dead-end and just sit there to be killed--now they have much better path awareness and can adjust  -- GOOD
3.    They use to just randomly shoot into terrain and foliage without any consideration of a potential hit -- now they only shoot if it is a hit -- MIXED
Even the best pilots miss-judge the terrain and shoot errant shots into items other than their opponent -- fix: degrease the AI a fuzz so that they do, at least from time to time, shoot into an item that you are using for cover.
4.    Once aggressed they would “pin” to that spot and engage within that general area -- now they shoot, ecm, and then run off at a good clip (seems like about 52kph). – VERY BAD
If we can’t choose at least where to engage the NPC then there is no reason to even engage them.  Their new AI creates too much risk for the little reward that they offer.

Our encounter:  One Superior is engaged by a t4 fit ratting Gropho set up to hit at a 570 range.  Superior is aggressed but takes off running, firing back when we move from cover to cover.  Chased the superior about 6,000 km until he ran through an NPC nest and forced the Gropho to go another route to cut him off, this took another 5,000 km.  I called in some other support just to kill the thing.  So a Mesmer and another Gropho took to chase.  I met up with the Mesmer and pursued the Superior while the other Gropho cut his path from the front.  The Superior got to a hill and turned to light up the Mesmer that was in pursuit taking him below ½ armor before the Sup ran over the hill. The engagement ended with one Gropho at 1/3 health, one Mesmer at ½ health and the sup finally dead.  Total distance covered from initial engagement about 8,000 km.
Please understand that I agree these should be the hardest things to kill but what we have now is an NPC that will drag an 80 mill ratting bot all over a Beta island (very, very high risk) just to get the same old drops.  This is not at all worth the risk.  Please return the “pin them where they are aggressed” so we can at least control where they will be engaged.  The other AI adjustments are plenty to make them VERY dangerous and almost worth hunting these hunters.  Or - Create such a crazy drop from them that 3 guys are willing to form a hunting pack and chase them down.  I prefer the first option, pin them where they are initially aggressed.

TL/DR accumulator change good, improved path finding good, LOS shooting mixed, NPC's that run away BAD, and or loot must be adjusted to make it worth doing.

56

(17 replies, posted in General discussion)

Changes/adjustments for these main features

1.    NPC AI
2.    Factory nerfs/buffs
3.    SAP visibility

Just to keep it in one place and easy to pop open to see what everyone thinks.

Scyylla wrote:

-1.

Personally I believe adding a view to the outside or camera bots will just lead to people sitting in station and not engaging.....

Deploy camera bot
See one hostile outside station
Send camera (or use radar) to see the other 5 guys 1500m away
Never undock

Deploy camera bot
Send camera bot to scout around outpost
Observe the complete enemy force
Refit in station
Undock in the exact counter to the enemy
People stop roaming near stations as the targets always undock in an exact counter. Quick change to an Ictus! They have Ictus. We need 2 Ictus to counter!

I think adding something that allows you to scout with no risk on beta is bad. There are too many ways that this can be used to avoid combat and that is not what beta is about.

This feature would also force attackers to have detectors fit themselves (or a detector alt) so they could detect the camera bot before they were detected themselves.....

SAP awareness feature-- I like. Make it possible for anyone with the roles to change the station auras to be able to see what SAPs are coming in the next 24hr period for their station. One more thing to encourage people to invest the time into quickly getting an outpost up to a required stability and maintaining it.

so you think the current undocking with a syndicate and no way of engaging the undocked pilot is a risk?  Please rethink and post accurate scenarios.  Currently; undocking and looking at the enemy is already a feature of 0 risk.  Right now you just undock a detector bot, see the fleet and dock back up to re-ship for counter.  Give the station radar a light bot site range and add in masker reductions as needed to limit what the station can see.

perhaps give an in station radar that can be disabled then remove SOME syndicate timer so there is like 4-5 second delay from protection to ability to redock?  This way there is risk for undocking to just look around.  If your in station radar is damaged, you take the risk to undock and repair the module.

Lobo wrote:
Annihilator wrote:

A in-terminal-radar would be already a nice addition and possible SAP point upgrade big_smile

This is all that is needed give it a lightbot detection and have it running beside a landmark overlay in the background of the outpost....

Only problem i see is that I think the outposts are on a different server than the islands.

seems doable then.  Would also like to add active intrusion window (on current island only of course) to the in terminal options.

Having to undock to "see" and to have a station tell you it has a SAP up really needs to be eliminated.

Annihilator wrote:

A in-terminal-radar would be already a nice addition and possible SAP point upgrade big_smile

Like this...how about a destroyable terminal radar that can be seen in terminal just like your bot sees it in the 3d world?

Perhaps it is a stationary item on the terminal that can be taken to 0 health (shut off by intruders) then repped to a usable function once undocking is viable again.  Make either action a pvp flaged event to add to the risk reward of the item.

"Take out the terminal radar"
"It will flag us."
"I am willing to take that chance, kill their eyes!"

I like it!

If it could be turned off and on then I would give you a plus.  But anything larger than a 10 on 10 the screen would be too cluttered and the client would be jumping around so much to keep the lines on moving targets that it would be more detrimental than an aid.

~mixed~

What you propose makes too much sense to be an acceptable direction for this game...

Unfortunately the forum is full of trolls and the devs hate the idea of giving individuals or small groups incentive to go out on beta.  For as long as I have played this game their attitude has effectively been this:

"You are having trouble getting something done? Well it's your fault for not being in a big enough blob.  This is not a solo game, go get a clan (or 3 more accounts) noob!"

The only thing you NEED from beta is Epi.  If you don't want to put the time or politics into owning a Beta outpost, or you can't find a current owner that wants you as a friend, then go to the 6 Alpha islands set aside for your security and enjoy the game there.

I like the idea stated above and don't see how that line of thought is in any way a negative as you are trying to slant it.

Buy your Epi, stop whining or make some friends.  Last time I checked an MMO stood for mult-player which means going solo is only going to take you so far.  It is getting old hearing players talk like they should be handed the only portion of the game that needs to be earned.  Go big, get friends, or stay on Alpha!

I have never quite understood how you can dock into a sophisticated station or outpost that can molecularity transpose you from outside to inside and back out again but can not provide basic technology options like:

1. Looking outside through a video system.
2. Tuning into other visual aids that are within it's range (I can watch a live feed from Paris France on my Iphone in the US but I have to un-dock from an advanced structure to see what is outside?) hmm


It seems that short ranged visual cameras could be placed around an area and be looked at from within the outpost. (Loved how Tribes 2 had deploy able camera that can be destroyed and redeployed) big_smile

Please do NOT look at this as a request to "walk around" in a terminal because I don't want a SIMS game, but plugging into technology that should already be there seems elementary.

Let the faeces slinging begin!

Perhaps a crit bonus to give a risk reward of a chance of really doing some in-your-face damage and give the pilot some incentive to move in to kill tackle.

Also like the Precision for the Kain, not the sit and hit Mes!  Kain is more of a roam mech and precision would give it a measure of survivability against defending tackle.

Either of these would buff its ability to roam off a home island in smaller groups.

Or buff damage in falloff to a useful %

Ville wrote:
Takeo Prime wrote:

-1

alliance mechanics are for those that want to hide under the skirts of others.  The "Now they won't mess with my 2 man corp because i am part of X alliance" would be a terrible path to take.  the game is too small for making a super group to dominate the board.

Make friends, run with them, leave them, go another direction or whatever you want to do.  you don't need hand holding mechanics to do that.

If alliance mechanics are the path of least resistance then strong corps will just fill their ranks with cannon fodder for all the <5 man corps and the blob will be the norm.  The game is finally shaping up into some nice pockets of strength and diversity.

Get 500 active members then take another look at it.

Aren't you in an alliance lol?

checking....nope, just a corp, called WAR that has made friends with another corp, that of which neither require any kind of formal friendship mechanics.

-1

alliance mechanics are for those that want to hide under the skirts of others.  The "Now they won't mess with my 2 man corp because i am part of X alliance" would be a terrible path to take.  the game is too small for making a super group to dominate the board.

Make friends, run with them, leave them, go another direction or whatever you want to do.  you don't need hand holding mechanics to do that.

If alliance mechanics are the path of least resistance then strong corps will just fill their ranks with cannon fodder for all the <5 man corps and the blob will be the norm.  The game is finally shaping up into some nice pockets of strength and diversity.

Get 500 active members then take another look at it.

66

(217 replies, posted in General discussion)

Mark Zima wrote:

Before ragequitting I'll put a list of steps necessary to fix the [s]completely broken[/s] incorrectly balanced system within the current framework:

1) Remove outpost lockdown completely, like it never existed. It will also automatically solve alliance problem (at least the largest part of it).
2) SAP attack time and SAP defence time should be equal, forces necessary for capture and defence should also be equal. This will move stability balance to 50 and allow to maintain facility levels (at least) comparable to the previous system.
3) The whole intrusion event should not consume more than 30 minutes of game time per day. One 20-30-min event daily would be reasonable and will reduce burnout.
4) Optionally (and the only benefit for defender): allow outpost owners to move the next event +-1 hr relative to the scanned time. This should reduce alarm clocking, but will disadvantage the attacker.

I2.0 consumes 0 time per day for those that don't want to earn Beta territory, it is called Alpha.  Rage quite or move to Alpha.  I2.0 is doing great things by separating those that want to work for the territory and those that are carebears in wolves clothing.

Small tweeks, baby steps, bright future! wink

67

(217 replies, posted in General discussion)

Mark Zima wrote:

* I want alliance feature so that many corps can hold ONE outpost without the risk of kicking each other out on a whim of a single CEO. So more outposts will be available to hold by new alpha corps (don't see anyone waiting in the line tho). Anti-nova rhetoric by WAR and 62nd is irrelevant to this matter.


Please leave Beta life – RAW. 
Do not add alliance mechanics that makes life easier for anyone.  Alliance mechanics are for those that want the option of allowing others to do work that they don’t want to do.  They want to be protected by numbers and not activities.

Beta should be unpredictable, emotionally challenging.  Big ups, big downs, rouge CEO’s who lock you out of your stuff, friends that turn on you in the middle of a war, enemies that become friends for the greater good.  I want to wake up and say WTF, what happened?  Alliance mechanics smooth’s out all of these epic events that turn into awesome stories that are told by others for years.

There are mechanics in place for the life of the predictable, it is called Alpha!

Bring on the unexpected, and thank you, thank you, thank you, for bringing PVP back to life in this game! wink

68

(217 replies, posted in General discussion)

Zoom, great to hear of some needed tweeks, but please consider activities that the defender can do while they sit on their SAP timers....ie, repping to even higher HP, sitting on a passive to count the timer down, or other that makes sitting there "feel" like you are being productive. roll

Agree with Arga, when things go boom, things need bought; when things get bought, things need to be built; when things get built; materials need to be gathered; when things get gathered, they need to be sold....markets begin to thrive, demand goes up....looks like a great run for carebears!  Roar your little heads off! big_smile

69

(217 replies, posted in General discussion)

one more point about outpost ownership and scanning.  If you own the outpost you should have the timer and what SAP is coming without having to leave the station to drop some kind of scan charge.

You own and manage the station, the timers can be random but the knowledge of what is coming would and should be known by the owner.

BTW why do all these posts get cluttered with game play commentary (here is what I did to you haha) instead of helpful game mechanic possibilities?  Isn't GC ingame enough space to run our mouths? hmm

70

(217 replies, posted in General discussion)

DEV Gargaj wrote:

4. Destructive SAP - Allow the defender to "rep up the HP” on the SAP.  Have it start at about twice the current HP, and allow the defender to double or triple that number with remote reppers.

Quick note: you can already repair the SAP, although not beyond it's max. What you mean (I suppose) is to have double the max and have it start at half?

Repairing the SAP right now with its minimal HP is counter productive if you have an enemy force applying DPS to it already.

Have it become active with (example) 4,000 HP.
Defenders can add remote armor reps to the site and take it to say 12,000 HP cap.

Use the same idea when you get rid of Specimen SAP and change it to "Energy SAP" -
Energy SAP comes on line containing (example) 800 accumulator -
can be remote energy repped to 24,000 accumulator

To the alliance benefits - NONE, do not add any benefits to grouping corps together.  No alliance island bonuses, no alliance ownership, no alliance fees.  You want control of that many pilots, have them join your corp.

Alliances lead to part time players benefiting from the work of the alliance instead of having to do the work required for their own bonuses/benefits.

Alliances lead to mega alliances that lead to coalitions, that lead to mind numbing blobs.  You want friends, hoof it to their island to help them, or stay on yours and leave them to do the work themselves.

Alliance mechanics added will erode the game to a one or two powerhouse scenario where no smaller entities could ever push out and make a start - this would be a tragic move!

71

(217 replies, posted in General discussion)

I2.0 has brought a great deal of activity to Beta areas that have been vacant for months!  Kudos! wink

The larger alliances that have to defend multiple islands and multiple outposts for their friends or pet corps are complaining....Kudos again! wink

Corps should stay home and defend their own SAPS.  If you want to control pets and have pens for all of them, then welcome to the hard work of a large ranch! tongue

Fixes are needed but I love the direction.  Some suggestions:

1. (Mentioned) kill the on island SAP information for all but the corporation that has an active one.

2.  Scanning for a SAP timer that you do not own, reduce its accuracy by 1+ hrs.  You want it, then commit to a semi-random timer for you.  Owning corp should get a 100% accurate scan.

3. Passive hacking- allow one pilot from owning corp to sit in the passive zone and reduce the SAP count down at a 1/1 ratio. This would take that SAP down from 60 to 30 min and make it more defendable. (Benefit of being on your island)

4. Destructive SAP - Allow the defender to "rep up the HP” on the SAP.  Have it start at about twice the current HP, and allow the defender to double or triple that number with remote reppers.   This in an essence would also reduce the time needed to defend as the HP would get higher than a small roaming gang could deal with. (Benefit of being on your island)

5. Kill the Specimen thing...I mean what is that anyway?  Make it an “Energy SAP”.  Attackers Drain x from it to capture while defenders get to add with remote energy transfers to double or triple totals when it comes online. (Seems energy should be one of the focuses of the station since from lore, that is why we are here anyway. (Benefit of being on your island)

6. Add some more awesome PVP bonus auras to the station options like: reduced lock time, speed increases, enemy interference, enemy molecular time reduction at teleports, or other small aids to defend against larger attacking groups. (Benefit of living on a Beta Island)

These changes will give the owners something to do while they await the aggressors and give them a slight time advantage as the aggressors will not have a specific time that the SAP comes online.

We have had some great fights and it has only been a few days.  Some minor adjustments and there should be a bright future for Beta Outpost owners. big_smile

72

(27 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Well it seems that a simple cycle time on a shield would give enough opportunity for an attacker to cause damage to a shielded opponent if he decides to drop his shield to apply any dps....guns, missiles, lasers.

If you drop your shields just have a 15 sec recharge timer before they go back up. I think this gives good strategy to  shield and non-shield fits.

73

(25 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Annihilator wrote:

indeed, the field container cannot be moved after deploying, nor does it last longer then 15minutes without interaction with a robot.

and this has what reasoning with its size?

74

(27 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Arga wrote:
Takeo Prime wrote:

While a shield is activated: - a defensive turtling posture

So ... when a sheild is active, mobility should be reduced to turtle speed too? Meaning you're applying demob to yourself by activating a sheild, in which case, I agree that demob should have no additional effect. If you want a turtle shell, you have to take the bad with the good, not just all the good.

I think that an aggressive act like firing a weapon and demobilization should not be allowed while the shield is activated.

Add the demob to "not allowed" list along with the other current aggressive acts on the list.

That is all

75

(16 replies, posted in Feature discussion and requests)

Well we can discuss lore and how "deploying" is a materialization from one area to another or...

Help players out by allowing an abort action that will penalize them for 3 min to wait for re-entry, re-deploy and get players on the game board where we need them.

+1 - abort deploy