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DEV Zoom wrote:This will be in the next devblog too, but I wanted to put it out here: spark teleports will be removed as a whole once we're done with the teleport&highway rework of all islands.
They were introduced as a band-aid for long walk times, but with that being solved through "natural" ways, their negative effects will finally outweigh the positive ones.
That's step 1 to a better game solved. Well done zoom and thank god.
Step 2 is making beta 1 stations not be able to be locked so you have clear alpha beta 1 beta 2 gamma progression.
Step 3 is the talked about rebalancing of your weapon meta system so that PVE matters and we remove all the filler mods.
All you need for step 4 is to redo the balance change properly and you will have a pretty good game again in a month.
Then all you have to worry about is generating a new population explosion and making the balance of power so that they don't get squeezed out of the game like last time.
Burial wrote:Add kernels to Syndicate Store?
They already are by way of beacons. Common kernels come from specific rats. You can get any kind of rat by getting the right beacon. Use tokens to get beacons and get kernels that way. Let's not forget that post mission change there will be zero static rat spawns to farm, it's missions, beacons or roaming spawns. Since your all in favour of that (lunatics) you need to use beacons.
SunnyJester wrote:Goffer wrote:JcJet wrote:c) A passive obtaining of kernels from some "research" thing.
-1
Passive income is always a problem.
4 agents with 2 months EP and proper equipment each should be able to do firearm beacons. I see nothing wrong in the fact that you need to cooperate for this task. BUt maybe the change require a 0-bar beacon for T2 NPCs.
The problem with common kernel is the fact that there is no NPC dropping common kernel only, but you need far more common kernel than color kernel or even high tech. This is no new issue and several times adressed.
Exactly Goffer.....why are COMMON kernals so UNCOMMON....misnomer, bad programming or lack of interest by the Devs? Really the HARD kernals to obtain should be the Hitech, not the COMMON kernals..... Why are we making it hard for people to obtain T1-T3 tech, when it is T4 that is the desired one. Make Hitech harder and Common easier IMHO.
The balancing is based upon a population with mainly new people doing low level rats. As 95% of ratting is vs mech and heavy its perceived that the kernel balancing is wrong but that's a population problem, not balancing.
ECM won't work. You would just set up honey pots on an island and all the rats would focus on that which would never die. If you don't want to die to rats then don't be afk. It worked fine for years, it will be fine now.
It's always been like that in Perpetuum. Eve isn't but Perpetuum always.
Inda wrote:DEV Zoom wrote:Alpha1 will stay orange because of the newbies, Alpha2 will be red.
Can we have 1-2 red roamers at Alpha1 as well, beacuse of afk miners (includes me also)?
Or this. Anything that kills afk miners, scarab, haulers etc
DEV Zoom wrote:Alpha1 will stay orange because of the newbies, Alpha2 will be red.
That's good. I think removing HDT and liquizit from alpha 1 should go hand in hand with that. It would be nice to prevent beacons on alpha 1 too but I assume that's a pita.
A think time based beacons would be a nice compromise. An hour long beacon would work just as good as a static spawn.
Inda wrote:I would still see some static spawns on Alpha, why we remowe them after 5 year??? That wont solve any botting problem, if we didnt it before.
I just like more options to players, somebody like "farming" (I am not a fun of it but sometimes I do also).
Why remove content?
Indeed. They are laughingly overpowered right now - you could cut reward by 80% on the higher spawns - but they are still worthwhile
DEV Zoom wrote:Tonnik wrote:Given that the only PVE content that's going to be on Alpha is maybe level 3 missions and beacons that seems kinda crazy
And roaming spawns. Seems like this wasn't made clear enough, but fixed spawns will be replaced by a healthy number of free-roaming groups.
You can't really farm roaming spawns. IMO roaming spawns are great content if they are red where they act as good protection vs bothers and afk scarab mining but if they are orange they are not worth the bother.
Static spawns are your 'stand still and pew' niche and should make ok money.
Artefacts are your scavenger but I might get lucky and should have a low chance of great money
Missions are a progression based best money in the game chance of fat loots experience
Where are roaming spawns in that? Red spawns would give a great risk based immersion but yellow are underwhelming in both reward, fun and ability to do as an activity.
Given that the only PVE content that's going to be on Alpha is maybe level 3 missions and beacons that seems kinda crazy
Annihilator wrote:jita... you are under the assumption, that its "working content" that got removed. Well, it didn't work according the player retention...
currently more content is "locked" by a player-faction that doesnt actively play the game.
It doesn't work on its own but that doesn't mean it doesn't work. PVE is multi layered, we are not removing artifacting or roaming spawns or beacons but that element wasn't enough either.
If the reward is significantly reduced then what's the problem with Jeeping them?
Celebro wrote:Sorry for those that like the statics spawns, but you are talking about it as if it was the best game play ever. Not only that, the research on alpha2s static spawns is a joke a vet can make complete personal research in less than a month.
It wasn't the best gameplay ever but it was another aspect of that gameplay. Much the same as belt rats and mission rats in eve.
I'm all for nerfing them to make them leas valuable than missions (even a heavy nerf to loot tables) but removing them seems like a waste of working content.
Celebro wrote:Altera wrote:Tonnik wrote:I think grind has its place alongside missions. Adjust the reward perhaps.
I agree, farming static spawns is enjoyment for some (over mining or what-not), but this was the DEVs answer to the botting issue and until they come up with a better way to stop letting some folks have an unfair advantage in game, this is the best course of action.
This discussion has gone on in many different forum topics.
Farming NPC static spawns is not enjoyment, players do it for the resources/NIC they produce which is the best nic/hr in the game aside from beacons. I think static spawn is the worst gameplay I have ever seen, very few seems to enjoy it, just look at the numbers online and in decline.
I would rather spend an hour hunting an observer which drops 20-40m Nic in loot. Now that sounds much more fun.
To you perhaps. I've had many a copy io sat on a static dropping beacons for extra eats and just having a laugh rather than moving about a lot. Occasionally you get a Lobo spawn you have to watch explode.
In addition to this your requiring people who farm either damage their relations to other factions or not rat. I don't understand why you would want to remove content.
Celebro wrote:Burial wrote:Zoom, why exactly are you removing the static spawns? Removing content, bad.
It's no good content, I am in favour of removing for abuse and it is really boring stuff, I'd rather mine tbh.
I think grind has its place alongside missions. Adjust the reward perhaps.
Syndic wrote:DEV Zoom wrote:He's right though.
So how long do we have left to milk the cow before the static spawns are removed from Alpha?
For someone who wholesale account shared, mission abused and beacon abused three times now (and let's not even get on to duping attempts and infinite cargo exploits) your awful mad about imaginary botters.
Anything we should know?
Syndic wrote:I'm interested in what the actual Devs have to say, not wannabe Devs.
So salty. Such rage. So funny.
Annihilator wrote:well,
the goal should be clear:
a new player needs to be able to get back into an assault with equip from a full loss, starting with an arkhe - and that within one play-session.
at the same time, someone just doing those next-to-full afk transport assigments all day long with his 10 accounts, should not make so much out of that he doesn't need to care about anything for the next 10 years, after a few days.
not to mention all the tokens that can be turned into top-class gear that exceeds anything that you player can build with their knowledge base - directly without any restrictions.
now tell me...
how to balance that with the mission reward alone at the given mechanic restrictions?
Diminishing returns reward system. Give it a 24 hour timer and make your first mission 4x your second 2x and your third 1.5x. After 20 missions you lose 10% per ten missions until your at .35 reward. You increase the amount of daily logins, give people who don't do missions a bit of an incentive to try a couple a day and discourage all day farming / botting.
Given that they still haven't said how much they expect to make per hour per person per level of mission *** knows anni.
Yeah why not. I never did any of the missioning tbh so don't have any stockpiles but if folks are ok with a wiper that's the best option.
Of course you can but there's a whole load of STC, fnavy, DOY etc people who did it too. Best to have a solution that works across the board.
Better to convert to beacons or ammo really. It doesn't matter as much that people do that, the key is making sure every corp has a reason to do end game PVE and risk assets rather than just some.
Annihilator wrote:jita, did you actually play before station locks got introduced? i cant remember 
the reason for orange static spawns are history as soon as the new mission system hits beta islands. then all static spawns can be removed, and there is no "i cannot mine that epi under that red spawn" argument anymore.
leaves the 2km detection range 160 kph bots with intra-zone teleports all over the place to scout every beta island in a matter of a few minutes,
proxy probes without any placement restriction at any teleport and spark teleport to cover several islands in a matter of seconds.
oh, forgot... 100+ kph t4 mk2 heavy mechs.
yay...
Of course I did, I was here in closed beta.
Nine of that makes any difference really, an organised and scouted mining op on an island with open stations sat 1400m from the undock is very hard to catch and kill. Not impossible, just hard. This combination of lucrative and safe encourages beta population. Its just like 0.0 really, if your awake your almost always safe unless your moving between atations. People will still die in droves.
If they made beta the way it was before they nerves the *** out of it then it would be fine.
It had:
Big red spawns of every mineral
Static spawns with normally four Epi spots within 1400m
Red mobs that didn't cause explosion damage
Observer robots that, while difficult, dropped an observer kernel that gave a great increase to tech
Stations couldn't be locked so you could set your industry up there without risk of losing it all
The best production in the game
They ruined all of that and now beta is ***.
Bring it all back and beta is worthwhile again. Yes not having station locks can leave you open to ninja ganking but if your that bothered about it then get a gamma. Gamma should be close to as lucrative as beta but safer as you can build your own defences, wall off your base and lock people from stations.
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