51

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Blocks only help 1 person at a time ... if you have the same player or group of players throwing insults aimed towards race/ethnicity/religion/ancestry/nationality/sexual preference at many many different people their is a problem. Blocking only protects one person at a time, the source of the problem still exists to effect others.

So NO!,  blocks are not effective to stop the behavior if you do not deal with the source of the problem.

Bragging that you won a fight is good / bad sportsmanship how ever you see it. that can be accomplished with out personal attacks.

Baiting your enemy to fight you is expected it can be done with out personal attacks.

Trying to say that the person being attacked is the source of the problem is insane.

Devs, you want to make your game grow many it fun for people, watching people call others N___rs or C___ks or what have you is not fun to watch unless your a racist yourself.

Tux ~ Kill the messenger, he was part of it all along.
Euripides ~ Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head.
Bertrand Russell ~ War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

52

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

When some one sends you screen shots of the abuse what is the difference if its in game in vicinity, or on the forums.?

In either case the abuse is taking place and something needs to be done.

DEV Zoom wrote:

Tux: the rule you quoted is for the forum, which is pretty easy to moderate, which can't be said about ingame chat.

Tux ~ Kill the messenger, he was part of it all along.
Euripides ~ Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head.
Bertrand Russell ~ War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

The people who cross the line are fully aware of when they do it and they do it for as much the "shock" effect as the "look at me ima internet tough guy"

Ville, the best troll of all is the fact that you started this post.
The fact you can still post here says it all. I havent used the "report" buttton on the forums yet in the 3 years I have played and I probably wont, but I have called people out on the forums directly on threads or posts that were clearly over the line. The posts were removed in short order. The posters still posts.

Zoom its not about hardening up. Martha hit it directly ... things are let slide, and the comments get worse, and repeated ...

Its the internets. *** will be *** because they can. Its totally on the Devs to control it, and if you dont you reap what you sow.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Ticket PvP best PvP.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

High threshold.
Tiered warning system.
Perfect enforcement.

Otherwise the Offendee could abuse the system in retaliation. Just look at the actors in this drama. Same opponents as usual.

Account banning is so over the top I'm a little shocked it's a suggestion. If you feel account bans are a solution you should GTFO of the game. It's not yours and it never was.

Is "GTFO" offensive? Where is the line?  So much potential for abuse!

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Tux wrote:

Blocks only help 1 person at a time ... if you have the same player or group of players throwing insults aimed towards race/ethnicity/religion/ancestry/nationality/sexual preference at many many different people their is a problem. Blocking only protects one person at a time, the source of the problem still exists to effect others.

So NO!,  blocks are not effective to stop the behavior if you do not deal with the source of the problem.

Bragging that you won a fight is good / bad sportsmanship how ever you see it. that can be accomplished with out personal attacks.

Baiting your enemy to fight you is expected it can be done with out personal attacks.

Trying to say that the person being attacked is the source of the problem is insane.

Devs, you want to make your game grow many it fun for people, watching people call others N___rs or C___ks or what have you is not fun to watch unless your a racist yourself.


Just keep at it, eventually youll igore all the meanie pies out there and be able to enjoy a game where you only see/hear what you want to hear.

Also, if you are sooo sensitive there is the option to leave general chat, and other public chats...which is what you do anyway so im not sure your need to for tyrant style ban system to remove your in game enemies...oh

Stranger Danger / Capital Punishment / Cyberdown
Pillar of the Community
Ruler of Recruit Chat
CIR Ministry of Truth

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Tux wrote:

Blocks only help 1 person at a time ... if you have the same player or group of players throwing insults aimed towards race/ethnicity/religion/ancestry/nationality/sexual preference at many many different people their is a problem. Blocking only protects one person at a time, the source of the problem still exists to effect others.

So NO!,  blocks are not effective to stop the behavior if you do not deal with the source of the problem.

Bragging that you won a fight is good / bad sportsmanship how ever you see it. that can be accomplished with out personal attacks.

Baiting your enemy to fight you is expected it can be done with out personal attacks.

Trying to say that the person being attacked is the source of the problem is insane.

Devs, you want to make your game grow many it fun for people, watching people call others N___rs or C___ks or what have you is not fun to watch unless your a racist yourself.

Your recruiters were spamming this for weeks.

imediro.net/join

Maybe you should be moderating what happens in your own backyard before sling stuff into others. big_smile

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

58

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

You cant block vicinity outright

Stranger Danger wrote:
Tux wrote:

Blocks only help 1 person at a time ... if you have the same player or group of players throwing insults aimed towards race/ethnicity/religion/ancestry/nationality/sexual preference at many many different people their is a problem. Blocking only protects one person at a time, the source of the problem still exists to effect others.

So NO!,  blocks are not effective to stop the behavior if you do not deal with the source of the problem.

Bragging that you won a fight is good / bad sportsmanship how ever you see it. that can be accomplished with out personal attacks.

Baiting your enemy to fight you is expected it can be done with out personal attacks.

Trying to say that the person being attacked is the source of the problem is insane.

Devs, you want to make your game grow many it fun for people, watching people call others N___rs or C___ks or what have you is not fun to watch unless your a racist yourself.


Just keep at it, eventually youll igore all the meanie pies out there and be able to enjoy a game where you only see/hear what you want to hear.

Also, if you are sooo sensitive there is the option to leave general chat, and other public chats...which is what you do anyway so im not sure your need to for tyrant style ban system to remove your in game enemies...oh

Tux ~ Kill the messenger, he was part of it all along.
Euripides ~ Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head.
Bertrand Russell ~ War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

59 (edited by Tux 2014-04-29 20:09:13)

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

If it offends you you should report it.

Their needs to be enforcement of the rules or their are none. Selective rule enforcement is bad.

Devs wrote:

We'll soon introduce a profanity filter into the game, until then, please use the right-click block feature if you feel you're being harassed.

^^ to me means there will be no bans for breaking the Rules of the Forum or EULA in game.

I only ask for Dev confirmation one way or another that the EULA will or will not be enforced. 

It seems as of now they will not enforce but I would hate to get banned for breaking one or several of the rules myself roll

open season on doing and saying what ever you want is different then having rules everyone has agreed (I Agree to EULA Agreement that everyone has done to play the game) to follow.

Ville wrote:
Tux wrote:

Blocks only help 1 person at a time ... if you have the same player or group of players throwing insults aimed towards race/ethnicity/religion/ancestry/nationality/sexual preference at many many different people their is a problem. Blocking only protects one person at a time, the source of the problem still exists to effect others.

So NO!,  blocks are not effective to stop the behavior if you do not deal with the source of the problem.

Bragging that you won a fight is good / bad sportsmanship how ever you see it. that can be accomplished with out personal attacks.

Baiting your enemy to fight you is expected it can be done with out personal attacks.

Trying to say that the person being attacked is the source of the problem is insane.

Devs, you want to make your game grow many it fun for people, watching people call others N___rs or C___ks or what have you is not fun to watch unless your a racist yourself.

Your recruiters were spamming this for weeks.

imediro.net/join

Maybe you should be moderating what happens in your own backyard before sling stuff into others. big_smile

Tux ~ Kill the messenger, he was part of it all along.
Euripides ~ Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head.
Bertrand Russell ~ War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Tux wrote:

You cant block vicinity outright

But you can not click the window

Population graphs

<GM Synapse> please don't abuse our fresh players before blowing them up. And for god sakes, don't do that after it!

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Crepitus wrote:
Tux wrote:

You cant block vicinity outright

But you can not click the window

Vicinity is a waste of space in my chat channel lineup. I would remove it if I could.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Maybe I will just go thru my Gen Chat logs for the last 2 months and quote every single derivative of "Hungarian Horse ...." and who says it. And post it here.

But hey, it's just a term of endearment certain players use for the Devs, right?
And it's just said in Gen Chat, where every player starts. Innocent little fun right? Certainly doesn't make the game community look bad right?

So really Ville, this is what you are saying is perfectly fine to say, right? You're defending your right to be "cool" and "mature" because throwing slang around like that is ok and "if you don't like it harden the *** up", right?

Rage Rex, the usual suspects are on their usual sides in this thread because it's how each side generally conducts themselves. People certainly choose how they want to act.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Cassius breathe mate, your Canadian calm down. Nobody in this thread is saying the status quo is fine. Some are saying that a general level of smack talk is part of the game and clear guidelines that are universally enforced is needed.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

64

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Jita wrote:

Some are saying that a general level of smack talk is part of the game and clear guidelines that are universally enforced is needed.

Yes, I agree with you in that general smack talk (lolz we kicked your arse !!!) and "a good ribbing" are part of every game ...

Personal derogatory attacks have no place here.

Tux ~ Kill the messenger, he was part of it all along.
Euripides ~ Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head.
Bertrand Russell ~ War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

65 (edited by Cassius 2014-04-29 20:54:15)

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Jita wrote:

Cassius breathe mate, your Canadian calm down. Nobody in this thread is saying the status quo is fine. Some are saying that a general level of smack talk is part of the game and clear guidelines that are universally enforced is needed.

This subject makes me angry. Seriously. Always has.
Everyone in this thread knows exactly how they conduct themselves.

The OP
the Devs and their response in general when this occurs
You
Me

I agree with the bolded part of your statement.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

This thread came about because insulting someone became a bannable offence. I personaly think that the term 'zortard' is kinda insulting but certainly not actionable where's the whole Spictron, Martha Jewert and Pedophile are probably a bridge too far.

I'm sure he doesn't like it but its no different than branding a Corp as thieves or a spy or whatever, its just part of the metagame. The racial, religious or illigal accusations can be seen as too much and fair enough.

Once again its not the devs job to police hurt feelings.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Jita wrote:

Once again its not the devs job to police hurt feelings.

there you are right.

its their job to enforce their rules. what ever that might be.

the only thing that i find funny in this topic is that the basicly the ppl that are the reason for it now agure against their own behaviour.

the world is what we make it. if ppl would use common sense and dont cross the line, then this discussion would have never been needed. sadly it is.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Perp is played world wide. Just linguistically, words don't mean the same thing, let alone phrases or idioms that are perfectly acceptable in some regions. There are also colloquailisms that are wholly accepted within some contexts.

For example, if in America I tell you to 'get your fanny moving', that's perfectly acceptable and considered a polite way of telling you to move your ***. However it's very rude in England and could probably even be a bannable offense.

There is no "LINE", at best there's a very wide grey streak.

69 (edited by Syndic 2014-04-30 00:08:57)

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

None of this is new, this has been Perpetuum's culture since 2010.

I was shocked that Jita and Ville were threatened with outright account-bans.

I wouldn't be suprised if people felt less inclined to continue volunteering their efforts to positively promote the game and report as many bugs as they find, if this is the treatment people can expect.

Then again, none of this is really new or unknown... The community has been here before. big_smile

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

See Erotica 1.

Your get your answer, they will always cave when threats of someone could....

Answer, your not going to get one, they will change them as needed, whenever enough people say they should.

The Gifter
Top  Killer 2013  - 01: 334 -- 17 -- 317  : Merkle
Top  Killer 2012  - 01: 027 -- 472 -- 445 : Merkle

Scarab Kill Count - 13

71 (edited by Martha Stuart 2014-04-30 00:07:53)

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Arga wrote:

Perp is played world wide. Just linguistically, words don't mean the same thing, let alone phrases or idioms that are perfectly acceptable in some regions. There are also colloquailisms that are wholly accepted within some contexts.

For example, if in America I tell you to 'get your fanny moving', that's perfectly acceptable and considered a polite way of telling you to move your ***. However it's very rude in England and could probably even be a bannable offense.

There is no "LINE", at best there's a very wide grey streak.

Yes, there is a line.  Just because in certain countries it is legal to beat your wife, does that make it right or acceptable?  I know that example is taking things further than they are here, but the point still stands.  No matter if you come from a backwards *** country or not, there are things that are right and there are things that are wrong, and there are lines you just don't cross.  Racism is never right, no matter where you live.  No one should have to deal with that.

The funny thing here is that the vast majority of stuff people say in game that is considered offensive they would never say in public, because they know that it is not acceptable.  But the internet offers some people a false sense of anonymity.  So they think that they can act however they want.

I honestly don't care about the smack talk, or the name calling or whatever.  Get as vulgar as you want, and you will not offend me.  But the racism, and other stuff that some people seem to think is acceptable is not.  That needs to be moderated.

It has been said before by many.  DEV's  Enforce your EULA or don't but you have to be clear and consistent about it.  That is your job.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Martha Stuart wrote:
Arga wrote:

Perp is played world wide. Just linguistically, words don't mean the same thing, let alone phrases or idioms that are perfectly acceptable in some regions. There are also colloquailisms that are wholly accepted within some contexts.

For example, if in America I tell you to 'get your fanny moving', that's perfectly acceptable and considered a polite way of telling you to move your ***. However it's very rude in England and could probably even be a bannable offense.

There is no "LINE", at best there's a very wide grey streak.

Yes, there is a line.  Just because in certain countries it is legal to beat your wife, does that make it right or acceptable?  I know that example is taking things further than they are here, but the point still stands.  No matter if you come from a backwards *** country or not, there are things that are right and there are things that are wrong, and there are lines you just don't cross.  Racism is never right, no matter where you live.  No one should have to deal with that.

The funny thing here is that the vast majority of stuff people say in game that is considered offensive they would never say in public, because they know that it is not acceptable.  But the internet offers some people a false sense of anonymity.  So they think that they can act however they want.

I honestly don't care about the smack talk, or the name calling or whatever.  Get as vulgar as you want, and you will not offend me.  But the racism, and other stuff that some people seem to think is acceptable is not.  That needs to be moderated.

I don't care if you go with a tier system or warnings or however you do it, but it needs to be made absolutely clear that it is not wanted, accepted, or tolerated in any way shape or forum.

It has been said before by many.  DEV's  Enforce your EULA or don't but you have to be clear and consistent about it.  That is your job.

Westboro Baptist Church is accepting applications, I hear. They could use a self-righteous woman like you, Martha.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Rage Rex wrote:
Martha Stuart wrote:
Arga wrote:

Perp is played world wide. Just linguistically, words don't mean the same thing, let alone phrases or idioms that are perfectly acceptable in some regions. There are also colloquailisms that are wholly accepted within some contexts.

For example, if in America I tell you to 'get your fanny moving', that's perfectly acceptable and considered a polite way of telling you to move your ***. However it's very rude in England and could probably even be a bannable offense.

There is no "LINE", at best there's a very wide grey streak.

Yes, there is a line.  Just because in certain countries it is legal to beat your wife, does that make it right or acceptable?  I know that example is taking things further than they are here, but the point still stands.  No matter if you come from a backwards *** country or not, there are things that are right and there are things that are wrong, and there are lines you just don't cross.  Racism is never right, no matter where you live.  No one should have to deal with that.

The funny thing here is that the vast majority of stuff people say in game that is considered offensive they would never say in public, because they know that it is not acceptable.  But the internet offers some people a false sense of anonymity.  So they think that they can act however they want.

I honestly don't care about the smack talk, or the name calling or whatever.  Get as vulgar as you want, and you will not offend me.  But the racism, and other stuff that some people seem to think is acceptable is not.  That needs to be moderated.

I don't care if you go with a tier system or warnings or however you do it, but it needs to be made absolutely clear that it is not wanted, accepted, or tolerated in any way shape or forum.

It has been said before by many.  DEV's  Enforce your EULA or don't but you have to be clear and consistent about it.  That is your job.

Westboro Baptist Church is accepting applications, I hear. They could use a self-righteous woman like you, Martha.

Thank you for proving my point with sexism.  Well done sir, you are a credit to your corp.

74 (edited by Rage Rex 2014-04-30 00:39:20)

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Martha Stuart wrote:

Thank you for proving my point with sexism.

Self-righteous presumes to be of higher moral authority. Usually this type of person likes to dictate to others, making black and white determinations of what should and should not be.

Based on multiple forums posts, I'm very comfortable accusing you of self-righteousness. Sexism? WTF are you talking about?

Crymia River rents boats this time of year.

Martha Stuart wrote:

You are a credit to your corp.

Thank You. I'm sure my corpmates do not join me in all my thoughts, and I do not represent their opinion, only my own. But I'm quite confident that the individuals who would fit into our culture would laugh at the butthurt in this thread.

Zoom, you should close this pointless thread.

Re: More clarification on EULAs.

Someone randomly linked this picture from the internet, http://i.imgur.com/bhd97GH.png

Could you clarify if sharing such randomly found material from the internet is going to be disallowed in Perp now too?

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice