1 (edited by Rage Blackout 2014-04-07 20:29:10)

Topic: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

(Specific Coordinates, not Island name)  to clear that up

http://oi62.tinypic.com/2rn787a.jpg




Dev Zoom, please consider removing specific coordinates location information from API killmails   (Free specific intel)


if the location data is in the API because of this

TMI (Too much information)

http://sequer.nl/killboard/index.php?a= … l_id=42094

http://oi62.tinypic.com/2rn787a.jpg


Doek, from StateCorp, deserves credit for his hard work on Sequer.nl, but this is too much information, a bit too far.






Dev Zoom,                      http://oi60.tinypic.com/1zv8rbc.jpg

Before you write reply to this request with "I dont understand why its a problem"

Intel is everything and giving specific coordinates location intel of any engagement to parties who are/were not involved (third parties) is just too much 'free' intel.... or anyone for that matter


Thanks for reading,

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

This one was really helpful.

http://sequer.nl/killboard/index.php?a= … l_id=42061

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

That is southeast Bergers Island teleport.

Once all the maps are put in, it will not be in the water..........

smartass


Ludlow Bursar wrote:

This one was really helpful.

http://sequer.nl/killboard/index.php?a= … l_id=42061

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Isn't there a delay?

RIP PERPETUUM

5 (edited by Rage Blackout 2014-04-07 19:59:15)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

not referring to the at-the-moment ramifications, just the overall gathering of too much information by persons who are not involved over time and instant time

free intel (free specific coordinates)


Although, the at-the-moment intel to third parties is also a huge problem



Not involved parties dont need to send in scouts to find out persons locations of battle in progress locations etc.

They get it for free

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

6 (edited by Cassius 2014-04-07 19:47:20)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

With all your recent PvP suggestions/nerfs, basically, PvP easy mode please, and give me lots of time to run away safely?
Your PvP style isn't the only one the game allows.

And seriously, what happens when someone dies?

1) he tells his friends immediately and they may respond, immediately. And immediately usually means about 5-10 minutes later. I would 't want to imply "instantly anywhere" when it's not actually accurate.

2) unrelated enemies get killmail intel, 15 minutes after it occurs. Hardly useful for a response, even if the exact coordinates are included.

Also, in your OP your link shows a kill on Dom with a map and location on Novastrov. That misinformation will give you even more time to escape.

Btw. Not trolling, I think these are valid points in reply to your post. Respond in kind if you choose.

Edit: I see you posted at the same time, after reading, again, no 3rd party will get free intel any faster than 15 minutes after the fact, whether the co-rods are in or not. This is the way it currently is.

7 (edited by Rage Blackout 2014-04-07 19:50:42)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

You dont find it useful because you dont know how to use it.

I could have written your response before you wrote it and frankly it is getting old and doesnt contribute to meaningful changes in the game pre-greenlight.


I would suggest to you to stop wedging in political garbage everywhere when there are subjects that are important to the game overall.

If you have some time, I would be happy to explain to you what free location intel does or doesnt do.. but not here.


Thanks for reading.




Cassius wrote:

With all your recent PvP suggestions/nerfs, basically, PvP easy mode please, and give me lots of time to run away safely?
Your PvP style isn't the only one the game allows.

And seriously, what happens when someone dies?

1) he tells his friends immediately and they may respond, immediately. And immediately usually means about 5-10 minutes later. I would 't want to imply "instantly anywhere" when it's not actually accurate.

2) unrelated enemies get killmail intel, 15 minutes after it occurs. Hardly useful for a response, even if the exact coordinates are included.

Also, in your OP your link shows a kill on Dom with a map and location on Novastrov. That misinformation will give you even more time to escape.

Btw. Not trolling, I think these are valid points in reply to your post. Respond in kind if you choose.

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Thanks, but I have played the game long enough to know exactly how to use it if I so choose. Even if I don't, and you do, doesn't this make it an advantage to you then? Why complain?

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

contribute or go away

Cassius wrote:

Thanks, but I have played the game long enough to know exactly how to use it if I so choose. Even if I don't, and you do, doesn't this make it an advantage to you then? Why complain?

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

10 (edited by Rage Blackout 2014-04-07 20:03:47)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

obvisouly Doek is going to add in the rest of the maps as he sees fit and has time to do

The general location is information enough  (Island name)


its free information and doesnt belong the in the API (specific coordinates)



The island is fine, but not the exact coordinates

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

I agree with Rage. The game should not be sending coordinate data out of the game. The island the event occurred on is plenty.

12 (edited by Cassius 2014-04-07 19:59:55)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Good luck with this forum proposal.

Not so long ago the killboard was updated instantly, and even though that provided "real time" Intel, it did not generally result in instant responses. The 15 minute delay is fine.

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Thanks my good man.  I appreciate your support and opinion.

Cassius wrote:

Good luck with this forum proposal.

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

His conserns is with miners or mining fleets.

I'm borderline on this, the timer needs to be a hour on all the kill boards.

Borderline leaning to no change.

The Gifter
Top  Killer 2013  - 01: 334 -- 17 -- 317  : Merkle
Top  Killer 2012  - 01: 027 -- 472 -- 445 : Merkle

Scarab Kill Count - 13

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

How would this be any different then lets say the eve kill boards giving out the system name letting people know not to travel down specific pipes?

John 3:16 - Timothy 2:23

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

They Devs added the specific location by coordinates of death.

That is a pretty big deal.

Merkle,

It generally applies to all PvP bear or not.  Its generally a bad idea to give away free information that is too specific.

Why do I need a scout if KB will tell me where the fight is.

You know what I am saying.  So, if anyone is going to use this information against people, it will be me.  I know it is wrong though as it is more metagaming than anything else.

These pieces of information need to be gathered within game mechanics and social channels.

not the API

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

17 (edited by Rage Blackout 2014-04-07 20:18:01)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

EVE and Perp were the same with a system name / island name only.

Now, they added the exact coordinate of death.

I hope that answers your questions.



Gremrod wrote:

How would this be any different then lets say the eve kill boards giving out the system name letting people know not to travel down specific pipes?

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

18 (edited by Gremrod 2014-04-07 20:20:11)

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Rage Blackout wrote:

EVE and Perp were the same with a system name / island name only.

Now, they added the exact coordinate of death.

I hope that answers your questions.



Gremrod wrote:

How would this be any different then lets say the eve kill boards giving out the system name letting people know not to travel down specific pipes?


I like some of the reasons you give when replying to Merkle. Those make some good arguments against this info being on outside media.

John 3:16 - Timothy 2:23

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

http://oi60.tinypic.com/1zv8rbc.jpg


^^^^^

illustration  ;P

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

the only real issue i see with this, is that the data is sent to a single person on his website,
a person who is an actual player, part of an active pvp corp.

when i remember all the *** against the GMs during beta times, that actually had not even the power to do anything but giving free teleports and changing terminal channel messages...
This API policy is a kind of riddle to me...

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Annihilator wrote:

the only real issue i see with this, is that the data is sent to a single person on his website,
a person who is an actual player, part of an active pvp corp.

when i remember all the *** against the GMs during beta times, that actually had not even the power to do anything but giving free teleports and changing terminal channel messages...
This API policy is a kind of riddle to me...

The policy is to don't *** abuse it or they'll stop spending time on it and/or just shut the whole thing down. I could have my corpmates come here and explain how disappointed they still are with me for not making a mass mailer back when the API was real-time (and it had been for like 3 years), but I think you get the point. (I never got that question anyway, most discussions concern the fitting tool and allowing comments on the killboard).

On this thread: it wouldn't hurt to be a bit more specific if you want to point out this outweighs the benefits in some way (because this is a pretty damn cool feature and a big plus over eve killboards). 'Generally' and 'just too much' seem pretty weak.

Let me just counter by stating that this is basically useless meta after the fact, most kills occur around terminals, teleports and SAPs anyway. Further increase the delay if you're in any way uncomfortable (that's my impression of this thread anyway), but it's old data and that doesn't qualify it as intel as far as I'm concerned (scouts reporting what they saw 15 minutes ago is laughable at best).

And then it also provides the killmail with a far richer picture of the battle, adding more to the speculation of why and how (blobbing, victims trying to get away, a full on engagement, etc), and it allows to make out who exploded on who.

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

TBH I have two things to say about this:

1. "This is why we can't have nice things."
and
2. Every time you put my name into a forum topic, I die a little inside.

The community shall decide.

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

C'mon guys this is not a big issue, 15 minutes delay on intel. is enough. Increase to 30min if you want to, either way, delayed intel is not really that good.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

Island location is plenty of information with detectors in-game, I don't understand the need for precise coordinates.

If it's available to everyone we will make use of it rather then depend on goodwill of people on the internet to behave "honestly".

What is the process for getting this API stuff?

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
CIR Complaint Form

The Imperial Grand Wizard of Justice

Re: Dev Zoom, please remove location information from killmails API

It isnt a big deal to you because you are not involved in the day to day things that this affects.

Precise coords dont belong in API






Let people use in game mechanics to gather this intel.







Celebro wrote:

C'mon guys this is not a big issue, 15 minutes delay on intel. is enough. Increase to 30min if you want to, either way, delayed intel is not really that good.

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."