Topic: The player gap when steam comes.

The player differences between old players having billions in wealth 1000s of high tech items stocked, highly skilled accounts, and with gamma bases.


How are these possible future players going to compete?

Even if a few hundred new players after steam release arrive en masse , wouldn't they realize the this is all an uphill struggle and eventually quit?

RIP PERPETUUM

2 (edited by Burial 2013-08-25 01:43:34)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

I've always thought that's exactly where politics come into play.

Why would a new corporation actually want to compete(fight) against people who have most likely a lot more power and would win? Get friends, find advantage, compete then. If a newbie corporation thinks it's wise to go against vets just by themselves they will fail and fall.

There is no need for new players to wander to any of the PVP areas for anything right now:
> Alpha is PVP safe area that has good spawns and industrial capabilities. New corps should establish here.
> Beta islands are slightly better but attract visitors like a magnet.
> Gamma takes a lot of work and NIC, not something new corps want to bother with either.

People just need to have some ambition..

3 (edited by Gunner 2013-08-25 04:12:39)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

reroll, steam Shard

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Burial wrote:

I've always thought that's exactly where politics come into play.

Why would a new corporation actually want to compete(fight) against people who have most likely a lot more power and would win? Get friends, find advantage, compete then. If a newbie corporation thinks it's wise to go against vets just by themselves they will fail and fall.

There is no need for new players to wander to any of the PVP areas for anything right now:
> Alpha is PVP safe area that has good spawns and industrial capabilities. New corps should establish here.
> Beta islands are slightly better but attract visitors like a magnet.
> Gamma takes a lot of work and NIC, not something new corps want to bother with either.

People just need to have some ambition..

Good point Burial, but not everyone wants to be assimilated by large alliances or be at their mercy, that's why I am helping build gamma bases for new players in a neutral setting, so they can find a place with all the advantage offered on gamma and narrow the gap.

RIP PERPETUUM

5 (edited by Celebro 2013-08-25 10:57:50)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Gunner wrote:

reroll, steam Shard


Even if this was the best choice they probably don't have the resources. There is another thread explaining in detail why this is the wrong direction anyways.

On another note, for the last year NIC has been generated at an alarming pace , specially before the beacon nerf and no NIC was taken from abusers, still on going is the abuse to the assignment + spark system this needs to stop now. This abuse should be stopped NOW before it does more harm.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Celebro wrote:

Good point Burial, but not everyone wants to be assimilated by large alliances or be at their mercy, that's why I am helping build gamma bases for new players in a neutral setting, so they can find a place with all the advantage offered on gamma and narrow the gap.

Yes, that is why they can start out on Alpha and not paint big target marker on their back. No-one stops them from throwing ops on beta and gamma, but whatever they do and whoever they piss off, they can return to safety of Alpha.

Not saying the situation is optimal, but it applies to anyone who is underdog really, be it vet or newbie.

7 (edited by Alexander 2013-08-25 12:30:28)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Edit: Meh.. There will always be gaps. Perpetuum needs people. People won't stay if it's not worth it. It won't be worth it if it's not balanced. Fix a few issues/upgrade a few features and it might attract people.

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

not again...

this is a long term skill system. and we are just 2 years in the game. this is not that much. eve is running ~10 years way bigger skill and money gaps. and ppl still start to play.
if we get pop it will not matter in a very short amount of time. then new players will outnumber the vets by far. if they dont then it does not matter anyway.

9 (edited by Homer J Simpson 2013-08-25 15:10:01)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Lets be honest its not just a matter of EP. Us vets know this game so well that given a noob account we would roll any noob we met lol.

Knowledge is just as dangerous as having lots of EP & stuff.


Smart noobs will plot their way to success. *** will rush head long onto the Killboard tongue

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

tbo, the very few vets which are still in game, wont really make a difference, imo

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Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Zortarg Calltar wrote:

not again...

this is a long term skill system. and we are just 2 years in the game. this is not that much. eve is running ~10 years way bigger skill and money gaps. and ppl still start to play.
if we get pop it will not matter in a very short amount of time. then new players will outnumber the vets by far. if they dont then it does not matter anyway.


Eve may have a bigger gap, apart from having a much large playerbase, there are many players in between vets and new. Here we are going to have nothing of that sort just new and old.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

I am crossing my fingers on this being true.

If you pulled in 10,000 people, whatever quantity of people and assets we are and have shouldnt be relevent.

Good FCs and leaders, though are not a dime a dozen.  So, that being said, even with 10,000 people I could only see a half dozen good FCs.




MoBIoS wrote:

tbo, the very few vets which are still in game, wont really make a difference, imo

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

2-3 months of EP spent on specialization into what ever will allow a noob to start to be competitive (with most aspects of this game).
In PVP as Gunner said a with good FC, a bunch of noobs could be a force in the game. But only if they r smart.

Even Lemon & his god mode mechs can be easily taken down if you know how big_smile

14 (edited by Celebro 2013-08-26 01:37:55)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Homer J Simpson wrote:

Even Lemon & his god mode mechs can be easily taken down if you know how big_smile

Even if their smart enough to do this they still have 100s of Bots lined up, or more depending what a year of hoarding and easily abused mechanics can do.

So they win a few battles, a drop in an ocean for vets.

RIP PERPETUUM

15

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

why should new playes be able to compete against vets ?

should i be able to start a new corp in eve and start killing pos's and taking sov ?

time based sandbox is always an up hill battle thats the fun in it .. fighting against time and trying to advance faster that it allows, being faster smarter and more ambitious than others your around ...

with no challenge for new players they will not stay ..

newplayers should stay clear of gamma until they can afford it .. simple.

@ gunner you think the game should be wiped every time there is  a new "in flux of players" just to keep people on an equal playing field? The game would never survive. It would not be playable .. time based sand box has a niche because of the time based experience gain take that away and you might as well go play lollipops and sugar cane wonderland .

Tux ~ Kill the messenger, he was part of it all along.
Euripides ~ Ten soldiers wisely led will beat a hundred without a head.
Bertrand Russell ~ War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

How you compeat as a newcomer.

1. Keep your main operations on alpha.
2. MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE / MAKE NIC ANYWAY YOU CAN.
3. PVP in small things, Lights / Light Ewar / Assault bots.
4. Learn, learn anyway you can, from people and failures.
5. More Mining and Making Nic.
6. Don't run to Gamma until your ready.

Most Important thing, Have fun!

The Gifter
Top  Killer 2013  - 01: 334 -- 17 -- 317  : Merkle
Top  Killer 2012  - 01: 027 -- 472 -- 445 : Merkle

Scarab Kill Count - 13

17 (edited by Gunner 2013-08-26 03:20:09)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

This isnt just a new influx of players.

This is the do-or-die last chance.

You and I both know that the last year, the few people chillin have been amassing fortunes of money ice and materials. property.

This could be very intimidating for this new group of people which can be very large.

We can keep this "Legacy Shard",but give a clean slate to the Steam launch.

I know it would really be a drag for the people who built big sand castle, but you guys won the game and its time for Perp 2.0.

Steam is the last chance.  There is nothing beyond it unless it gets picked up by Sony or something.

Stop thinking about yourself and think about the children; what can you do for the children.




Also, I have already voiced that this big blue knucklehead blob you have created could be good because these Steam people, I am sure, dont want to be ganked in the face on a regular basis, so the cushy place you have setup will probably give them some comfort and allow them to explore pve or whatever it is that you guys do.

So, there are two sides to the coin.

Once the spark is modified a bit, I am sure it will bring some balance back to Intrusion 2.0 and let the people who live far away have to make some tough choices about what to defend and what to let go.  As it should.

all will be fine






Tux wrote:

why should new playes be able to compete against vets ?

should i be able to start a new corp in eve and start killing pos's and taking sov ?

time based sandbox is always an up hill battle thats the fun in it .. fighting against time and trying to advance faster that it allows, being faster smarter and more ambitious than others your around ...

with no challenge for new players they will not stay ..

newplayers should stay clear of gamma until they can afford it .. simple.

@ gunner you think the game should be wiped every time there is  a new "in flux of players" just to keep people on an equal playing field? The game would never survive. It would not be playable .. time based sand box has a niche because of the time based experience gain take that away and you might as well go play lollipops and sugar cane wonderland .

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Actually... how about a newbie zone, complete with a PvP island or two that can't be accessed if you have more than 100k EP or a certain number of days in game (90) on an account, not just a toon.  It's still on the main server, the center of the newb zone would still be the three primary alphas, but the vets would be effectively limited from stomping in and crushing the newbs at every turn.
After they've spent a couple of months learning, or even from day one, there's nothing barring them from jumping to alpha 2, beta, or even gamma save for TP mobs.

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

...This is a sandbox...not some "hold my hand online".

The Gifter
Top  Killer 2013  - 01: 334 -- 17 -- 317  : Merkle
Top  Killer 2012  - 01: 027 -- 472 -- 445 : Merkle

Scarab Kill Count - 13

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

Merkle wrote:

...This is a sandbox...not some "hold my hand online".

Take a step back here...

We want to attract new players and keep them - so if a little handholding is necessary, we damn well better do it or down the toilet Perp will go.

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

The game should be fun for people to play it. Nothing else is required.

22 (edited by Ludlow Bursar 2013-08-28 13:36:16)

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

They'll be a gap between new players and vets. So? That's the game. It wasn't a barrier to me, It wasn't a barrier to anyone else who joined Perp more than 6 months after it started. With less players it should be even less of a barrier.

Listen, I hang around in General and around Alpha One talking to new players a lot when I'm on. Offering tips and help and generally just being sociable (or annoying depending on your mood). There is a continual stream of players trying out the game and they're mostly really enthusiastic about it.

What there isn't is any new player who's prepared or willing or bold enough or maybe even capable of galvanising this bunch of bright potential recruits into a corp or two. I don't know what the reason but no one is stepping forward.

Maybe with Steam will come a leader or two.

Success in this game comes in the longer term compared with other games. Thats one of the things we like about it and one of the things that mustn't be compromised lest it should become too much like 1001 other near homogeneous slug-fest MMOs out there.

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

You need to ask your self, are you the only ones in the world that enjoy this game or find it interesting.

Of course not, but I dont think we need to do much of anything or then answer there question and recruit a few new comers.

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Re: The player gap when steam comes.

I thought it was generally agreed upon, that at about 6 months of EP a Player would at least be able to compete against a vet account if they specialized into 1 area with 1 bot type.  That's really not a major gap, especially when considering the fact that if you are in a fleet you just need to contribute, not be awesome all by yourself.  And hell, if you join a Gamma corp, you can compete in the indy sector on Day 1.

Re: The player gap when steam comes.

I more concerned with the asset gap between old and new, where steam players will not enjoy the abuse happening with missions and pre-beacon nerf. There has been much more abuse now than during the M2S insurance fraud, which was just a few billion NIC.

Ultimately you can win vets with 6 months EP if you are smart enough, but a few wins won't effect vets much economically.

RIP PERPETUUM