51 (edited by Gharl Incognito 2013-02-16 03:49:41)

Re: The failings of a free market

Tux wrote:

If i could in a day go to the terminals I want to sell at and place items there and either put them on the market for 6 months at a time or do remote sell orders then I would fill the market with all types of mods and bots but until that happens i feel no need to spend hours upon hours managing sell orders.

This would make me a very happy camper.  I'd love to be able to PvP a bit but I cannot really afford the losses; if supply was high then prices could fall... provided some smarty pants with a bazillion NIC doesn't buy everything he can in the name of 'market PvP'.

EDIT: Also the systems you describe are essentially facist: NIC becomes a 'token' which can be redeemed with the Company Store for items of value.  The relaitve worth and merit of an individual are not accounted for as an individual can be denied access to their 'deserved' items arbitrarily by their superiors. 

In a truly Capitalist Corp all produced items would go on the open market before they went on the internal market and they would be placed at prices intended to see them sell so long as a profit of some kind could be made.  Selling to ones enemies would be a matter of risk versus reward.

In a true Communal Corp all members would have access to all folders and production would carry on for the good of all.

Only the first of these systems has a hope in hell of working, just ask China.

Sociorum, inimicos, omnes

-:does speak for NSA on the forums:-

Re: The failings of a free market

Gremrod wrote:

The T1 standard Lightweight Frame (LWF).

NPC Sell Price: 138K+
Player Sell Price: Ranges from 22k+ to 44k+

If we use the LWF base commodity requirements and then use the market commodity prices a LWF is worth 28k+.

So why are the npc sell orders for this basic item 5x+ more than what they are really worth?

This is only one item I checked last night. I am guessing I would find the same for all or some of the other seeded items.

Lets look at something that is missing for setting base prices in a virtual market.

The production cost for the T1 LWF is around 60-65 k.
All sell orders below this price does not come from the manufacturers. It comes from PVE players (NPC loot).
Therefore, the NPC sell order is about 2 times higher than the production cost.
For most items which I have compared, the NPC sell price is approximately 2 times higher than the production cost.

I think that these prices are correct, so it gives producers an incentive to produce T1 module to sell at market.
NPC orders are necessary as long as we have a problem with a small number of players.

Re: The failings of a free market

My own point of view is that the problems are caused by a number of factors, but the issues that stick out are the research and (old) production systems (I don't know the new production system). I joined the game with a large number of Eve players, and our intention was to run an essentially capitalist corp.

The initial plan was do to NPCing / Mining / Whatever, make money and buy mods. Making money was pretty easy, finding mods and bots to buy was much harder. At this point a lot of players started to look at manufacturing but hit the problem of not having any research and so not having access to prototypes (Good Luck buying those on the market). So they all started farming and buying kernels and got some T2/3 research but it doesn't really end up making them any money, since ppl want T4 gear.

After discussion (and some arguing) we decide that if we want to make T4 available for our members, we need one prototyper to feed all the kernels too and we start working to that. We skill up a few ppl to do Indy stuff and start making stuff. It turns out with all the stuff you have to do (source multiple materials, do T1-3 production and then T4), that just producing for a single corporation is a lot of work, and so guess what, we become another internal market, centralised production corp only producing for members.

The point is, that is not what we wanted to do, but the way the game works in regards to research and production basically forced us in that direction.

Re: The failings of a free market

Good point Dazamin, perhaps being able to focus research will help with this?

Sociorum, inimicos, omnes

-:does speak for NSA on the forums:-

Re: The failings of a free market

Guys thanks for all the input. I think the problem I thought was there is not a problem after all. big_smile

John 3:16 - Timothy 2:23