Topic: To the Devs: Time

After more than 400 hours in game, and 4 months of daily play I'm pretty much done for awhile.

I could write 3 pages on what's wrong with this game and what it needs but I think I can sum up most of it in 3 words:

Ridiculous.  Unmitigated.  Grind.  (It could also be rephrased as: Stop. Aping. Eve. - It's killing your game)

Cut the time it takes to do literally everything in game by 75% and watch the subs come in.  Build some real solo content.  Foster PVP and stop catering to alliances and big corps. 

There is nothing going on in game.  There is no reason to log in except to spend another 8 hour shift in some ore field to keep my production for myself going and I don't really even need to do that since I'm sitting on 20+ of every kind of bot/mech I can use.

Research is ***.  Relation grinding is ***.  Travel time is ***.  Resource grinding is ***; etc. 

The difference between EA player EP and new players is vast.  No gear accessibility because the grind (either for money or resources to make it yourself) makes it 10x worse (I do have access to an EA EP account and have directly compared it with my main who is 4 months old so I'm speaking from both sides here).

This whole game has less than a 1/6th of the people playing who bought Darkspore at a STEAM sale just this week (myself included) and the reasons go beyond it being a niche of a niche.

Anyway, I got COD:BLOPS/Wings of Prey\Darkspore/AI Wars all for less than the cost of a single year time code.  I plan to log in to spend EP occasionally but that's about it.

This game has an amazing concept and the underlying mechanics are for the most part solid with decent PVP balance.  Please stop *** it up. 

All you have to do is look at how many trial accounts sign up and then leave.  Most don't bother giving a reason; the ones that do are nearly always the same.

o7

Population graphs

<GM Synapse> please don't abuse our fresh players before blowing them up. And for god sakes, don't do that after it!

Re: To the Devs: Time

your stuff, can i haz

Re: To the Devs: Time

Don't think he's leaving... permanently.

This is starting to remind me of Lineage 2... please find a way to fix the grind!

Re: To the Devs: Time

Thanks for the input Crepitus!

5 (edited by Jelan 2011-06-16 21:30:41)

Re: To the Devs: Time

Bugger

6 (edited by Celebro 2011-06-16 22:10:48)

Re: To the Devs: Time

I couldn't agree more with OP this MMO needs some serious changes yet base mechanics and pvp seems quite well thought out, so its a pity if it goes belly up and I really hope it survives.

For the mean time I will not resubscribing anytime soon unless I see some serious changes and a growing player base which has been on a decline since time of launch, when I started playing.

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: To the Devs: Time

"Build some real solo content...and stop catering to alliances and big corps.  "
I agree with, but disagree with the rest

Re: To the Devs: Time

I can assure everyone that the whole crew is working on solo content. No doubt, we also see the missing things. But thanks again for pointing those out.

Re: To the Devs: Time

I would like some Ice Cream please... everyone else can have cake - for PIE al a mode.

Re: To the Devs: Time

I think I said this months ago at some point but, Alpha needs the Milk and Honey,. so the casual alpha player can just day dream and get lost in things to do,. then call his friends,.

More exploring content is perfect,.The relic thingy? perfect type of concept, More please,. There is a major lack of interest in exploring,.

Take this wonderful blue/green/red system and make it into something more..

I dont care what anyone says,. But daily missions, or repeatable daily content is a must. give casual subs something to do, an GASP,. not log out after spending some ep.

An good lord, more light bots,. LOTS.. you should be patching them in faster then battlefield can add new weapons..

Re: To the Devs: Time

Any news you can share with us on the type of solo content?

Re: To the Devs: Time

Agreed on the solo content its very very lacking also mission very low standings for work done on most of them.... Also (and this is my issue not the games) being part of a mostly AU corp and also seeing a good part of the player base on EU/AU timezones I'm pretty bored most days.....Not to mention where as I see the point in Roaming mobs etc. Tone it down a bit on alpha getting pretty old....another one.. when some !@#$% (filling that in with bad stuff) pops a Observer spawn and don't kill it and runs away after they get there loot ......Then it roams around for hours and kills helpless nubs .....consider a shorter despawn ? just my opinion

Re: To the Devs: Time

Arga wrote:

I would like some Ice Cream please... everyone else can have cake - for PIE al a mode.

As in Cookies, Cake and Pie? (IE: BoB) Thanks but no thanks.

quote=Jelan "Edit: Same old, same old. - DEV Calvin"

Re: To the Devs: Time

Didn't play Eve... so, not BoB... PIE, with ice cream on it, because cake is a fabrication. (Chocolate Chip pumpkin cookies would suffice too) smile

15 (edited by Monster 2011-06-21 21:17:55)

Re: To the Devs: Time

Precisely what I was telling a guild last night. This game gives you absolutely no incentive to log in.

Solo content is boring, uneventful, and tedious. Don't think I need to elaborate there...

Zero high end content. What can be attained in beta that sets itself apart from something that can be acquired by a newb running parallel assignments can't get in a few days. Know the irony of it all? Aforementioned newb cannot pilot a mech for months because of the ep requirements. Nothing he can do to speed up the process. He has nothing to gain by staying logged in and participating in the game.

That's the problem. There is No incentive to play the game right now. And no I never played eve nor do I give a *** about it's business model or functionality. I am a graduate level business major and avid gamer who knows the devs/designers have a lot of hard work ahead of them if they plan on saving this sinking ship.

16 (edited by Tilron 2011-06-21 21:40:39)

Re: To the Devs: Time

Monster wrote:

Precisely what I was telling a guild last night. This game gives you absolutely no incentive to log in.

Solo content is boring, uneventful, and tedious. Don't think I need to elaborate there...

Zero high end content. What can be attained in beta that sets itself apart from something that can be acquired by a newb running parallel assignments can't get in a few days. Know the irony of it all? Aforementioned newb cannot pilot a mech for months because of the ep requirements. Nothing he can do to speed up the process. He has nothing to gain by staying logged in and participating in the game.

That's the problem. There is No incentive to play the game right now. And no I never played eve nor do I give a *** about it's business model or functionality. I am a graduate level business major and avid gamer who knows the devs/designers have a lot of hard work ahead of them if they plan on saving this sinking ship.

Why not go out and kill NPCs for loot which can in turn help your corp advange and build more cannon fodder for PvP?

Why cant you get a low level assault group of newbies together, grab and go out exploring?  (OMG you might find PVP and die, OH NOOS)

Mining/Harvesting for the corp.

Granted I think there should be a way to gain EP while playing the game but not alot of EP.

Re: To the Devs: Time

Monster wrote:

I am a graduate level business major and avid gamer who knows the devs/designers have a lot of hard work ahead of them if they plan on saving this sinking ship.

Well, I would hardly call it a sinking ship.. its still a good game,. installs fine, Runs good, good concepts, seems to handle player loads reasonably well,. and its not Broken with bugs or connectivity issues..


Tilron wrote:

Granted I think there should be a way to gain EP while playing the game but not alot of EP.

No. they just need to add more light bots, and other various light bots,. and possibly a few more light bots..

18 (edited by Crepitus 2011-06-22 07:30:37)

Re: To the Devs: Time

Why not go out and kill NPCs for loot which can in turn help your corp advange and build more cannon fodder for PvP?

Mining/Harvesting for the corp.

Granted I think there should be a way to gain EP while playing the game but not alot of EP.

You just described a job.  I believe most everyone playing is paying for their own accounts aka they already have one.

As for the PVP, there is no incentive to do that either other than it's fun but since people don't want to lose they zerg or sit on their outposts and shiver. 

As pointed out by Arga in another thread solo pvp is the hardest possible thing in game and there are only a handful of people who even try; I know firsthand. 

I have literally seen DEVs tell newbies who are complaining about many of the things mentioned in this thread to join a corp - telling people to change their playstyle is not how you foster growth.  You foster growth by catering to needs.  Ask every current successful MMO how they did that I think you'll find enormous amounts of overlap in the answers. 

I've never seen an "MMO" with so few players, reading the DEV interview where Zoom states that the game was originally intended to be an RTS, that influence is very apparent. 

They are also missing other opportunities.  For example, Worldoftanks, a f2p team v team tank based detailed pvp game with a level of complexity on the battlefield similar to Perpetuum (only no corpse loot; at least that I've seen), but with 10,000-16,000 active players at any given time of day and 0 grind to start fighting just grind to get access to new vehicles/weapons/ammo, has won a ton of free press for their awesome showing at E3 and got a massive bump in players from it as well.  Perpetuum could have had a modest booth and still probably got a lot of interest but afiak they didn't show up at all.

@Greenleaf I think sinking ship references the fact that by their own numbers their modest population lost more than half of its active subscriptions (that is NOT active players by a long shot) with in a few months of release.

Population graphs

<GM Synapse> please don't abuse our fresh players before blowing them up. And for god sakes, don't do that after it!

19 (edited by Monster 2011-06-22 09:19:32)

Re: To the Devs: Time

It would seem there is no sense of urgency here. As history would indicate, the overwhelming majority of companies in this industry who show the same behavioral patterns have ultimately met their demise at an accelerated pace.

Most of these issues can be resolved without a significant amount of time or funding, but the devs efforts are being misdirected and they are focusing on content that should be taking a back seat at this point. Marketing, however, is a tricky issue here and it actually goes hand in hand with the consumers first impression of the product, which at this point has been less than stellar.

--

If you think that was tl;dr, then be glad I didn't follow my first inclination to break down every individual flaw of this game all the way up to the operational level. Fact is, I am tired and at some point you have to start paying your consultant wink (I do not demand much though, a mere 5% equity share and 5 figure salary would suffice)

Re: To the Devs: Time

Don't forget to state you currency. In Belarus, a 5 figures salary is equivalent to 3$.

I play both World of tanks and Perpetuum, and I don't think the games are comparables.

However, I agree that while I enjoy the EP system for slowing down players evolution, and making everyone progress at the same pace... it has the big flaw of not giving people any incentive to log-in and play.

I think to improve the market, players activity and pvp, the production of equipments should be mainly limited by time, and not material as it is currently.
I am talking about keepint the current production time, but doubling the mineral extraction yield. Ressource should be very easy and abundant to the skilled players. A major part of this bonus would be beta only. All this to reduce the insane grind.

Secondly, as incentives to log-in and play, we could add a system that reward 200 bonus EP on a daily basis if you go out and harvest at least 100K mineral, or kill 20 NPC. (that's one day bonus per week if you play every day.) The goal should be easy to achieve, but the reward enough to encourage people to log into the game on a daily basis, get out of the station, and say Hi to their friends (very important for socialisation of the community, people stay on a game because they have friends there too).

My blog about MMO design:
http://mmockery.wordpress.com/

Re: To the Devs: Time

Theme park games give you levels and skills for completing quests, for example. EP translate into the equivalent of levels, but the base mechanics of how theme-park and sandbox games operate is fundamentally different. To provide EP based on some type of in-game activity, the rest of the game would need to change also; it would have to be less sandboxy and more theme-park.

The incentive to log in and play, should be engaging and rewarding 'game play'. Trying to buy your players in with skill or NIC rewards isn't self sustaining.

<--- Oh, look. I used industry game terms, I'm must be a game designer too.

22 (edited by Grim Faust 2011-06-22 20:12:42)

Re: To the Devs: Time

There are a lot of things that could be done with PO. The best thing that could be said to sum up my opinion is that the game needs more content to engage people. Sandbox's are great because of the freedom you get, to do what you like and have no pre-defined theme park mmo style path to follow. PO doesn't really offer much yet though. Sure you can do what you want, but when you have nothing of greater importance to do, that freedom doesn't really seem as rewarding. It's like putting someone in an empty room and telling them they can do absolutely anything they please. You can see how moot freedom becomes when there's no content to interact with.

Currently in game you can artifact scan, run assignments, hunt npc's, mine and produce. I won't include roaming/intrusions because you can't do that when you want, that's a concept driven by the players for roaming and a set schedule for intrusions. At any rate, the game needs more flavor. The end game was highly over looked. I'm doing now what I could do as a newbie. For a sandbox, that's somewhat expected. But in our case, there's no 'newer' system you can engage in as a vet that a new player can't do. So essentially, from day one you're really seeing all the content the game has to offer. The main difference between day one and somewhere down the road is what tier of gear you're fitting . There's no interesting concepts that define PO. You have all the basics of crafting, questing and farming as in any other game.  PO has a good foundation for growing, but it's not going to grow if all that's being done is random balances and changes to the already existing content sets.

The change to outposts is interesting at most, but again why have them? To buff your members so they can partake in content that's already there? Where's this game going? Where's terraforming and player built structures? What systems are the PO team developing that will actually define PO and keep people playing? All I've really heard about is more weapons and paint and basically things that aren't really going to do anything aside change how people interact with current systems. Without new systems, this game is not going to grow. Where's this game heading and when are we going to start seeing new systems to play with?

Take the long way around back to square one
Today we're just outlaws out on the run

Re: To the Devs: Time

Nicely put Grim.

24 (edited by Norrdec 2011-06-22 23:25:36)

Re: To the Devs: Time

Nicely put, but everyone is very hasty in judging what's not in the game and how it should be already there. To be frank if anything the Dev's are doing a LOT in such short time. There is going to be more content with time. When? Soon ™

<GargajCNS> we maim to please

Re: To the Devs: Time

Crepitus wrote:

@Greenleaf I think sinking ship references the fact that by their own numbers their modest population lost more than half of its active subscriptions (that is NOT active players by a long shot) with in a few months of release.

Your to involved with game drama,. that stat sheet is,. Flawed in so many ways,. and has been a bad smell on forums for years..

Many players from Mankind, like ( myself ) would argue its history on there. 2002 is around the time of a mass server wipe, they basically lost ALL there current players, But mankind from (1999 or so) survives..

Guess what im pointing out is,. Stats like that are not reliable.

Perpetuum is still a long way off from petering out,. come back later if it got boring.

And yes, Hats off to Grim,. Good post,.