Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Snowstyle wrote:

#1 Ofcourse not sweety smile

#2 a) Need numbers and shiny graphs.
     b) Logical fallacy


I should have known better.  This ^^ from a guy who doesn't use anything than can't hit less than half a kilometer away.

"...we will take undefended gammas and stations."  -Cassius of STC

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

If ya can't shoot more then 700 meters then ya don't wrastle.

Edit: Troll removed - DEV Calvin

53 (edited by Annihilator 2011-05-11 18:35:32)

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

whats the base explosion size that we have to put into the damage formula against the recieving side?

how much hitpoints does a speed-fit kain have? (max 2741HP)
how much raw damage would it do when exploding? (min1340, max 2741dmg)
how much would a camelion  recieve? (34%) (21% with t4 evasive)
------------------------------ example with t4 evasive---------------
300 - 600 multispectral damage against the resists:
75-150 kinetic     * 69%    =52-105
75-150 thermal  * 91%     =68-136
75-150 seismic   * 40%     =30- 60
75-150 chemical * 77%     =58-115
----------------------------------------
207-415 hitpoints damage dealt to a cameleon with evasive mod staying within the 20m full damage blast of an exploding speed-fit kain.

326-652 hitpoints damage dealt to cameleon without evasive mod.

note: t4 lwf fitted cammy has 557 hitpoints with average extensions

this post is an answer to the "small remote repair becomes useless" post

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Annihilator,

I had a Castel Mk2 went pop from a 62nd artemis blowing up in my face on Hokk on the 7th.

My castel took 712.99 damage from that explosion, how do you explain that?

"...we will take undefended gammas and stations."  -Cassius of STC

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

haha m2s arguing with each other in this tread is funny.

Explosions are fine, mongolia is mad. nothing to see here

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Mongolia Jones wrote:
Alexadar wrote:

but i suppose you want still use tunnings in your head for uber damage.

Not only tunings but also -> demob, sensor amps, masking module.

Now i see whole picture: kains was nerfed, and their headslots now should be fitted more specialized. But from other side, what should you expect after last month when short range kains become best roam squads? So, i hope, AOE patch made game more balanced. If else: i'm sure devs will fix it. I'm out of arguments, will go check another threads. Thank you for nice talk without trolling, was pleasure to read this thread! smile

57 (edited by Annihilator 2011-05-11 11:50:34)

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Mongolia Jones wrote:

Annihilator,

I had a Castel Mk2 went pop from a 62nd artemis blowing up in my face on Hokk on the 7th.

My castel took 712.99 damage from that explosion, how do you explain that?

artemis has much more hitpoints then kain = does more damage when exploding
Castel has 0.25m more hitsize then light ewar = recieves more damage

if that artemis had a medium armor plate equipped instead of a lwf = suicide if staying close to it when it goes boom.

i suggest you get someone with a chassiscanner in your roaming group to gather intel about your targets before you attack.

This really reminds me of my Mechwarrior days, going against heavy mechs with a fully-flammer fit light mech (which always ended in a huge explosion smile)

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Smokeyii wrote:

haha m2s arguing with each other in this tread is funny.

...mongolia is mad...

Smokeyii,  you obviously don't understand m2s.  Also, "mad" is not what I am feeling.


Alexadar wrote:

Now i see whole picture: kains was nerfed, and their headslots now should be fitted more specialized.

Kains was not the only thing "nerfed", here is a list of items that have been effected:
1. Short range ammo (em, laser, bullets)
2. Short range guns (guass, laser, machineguns)
3. Small bots in general
4. Small energy transfers
5. Small energy drainers
6. Small energy neuts
7. Small remote reppers

I'm sure there is another, but thats what comes to the top of my head.


Annihilator wrote:

artemis has much more hitpoints then kain = does more damage when exploding
Castel has 0.25m more hitsize then light ewar = recieves more damage
if that artemis had a medium armor plate equipped instead of a lwf = suicide if staying close to it when it goes boom.

Annihilator, face it, I blew your arguement out of the water.  Your formula was wrong and that 62nd artemis had a LWF (he was going way too fast, I don't need a chassis scan to see that).

There is no way using your formula above and skill 10 mechanics skills + lwf that an artemis will do that much explosion damage to a size 3 bot -> your formula is obviously wrong... or the way you think explosions effect small bots is different...

"...we will take undefended gammas and stations."  -Cassius of STC

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Yarren Rakarth wrote:
Loyalist wrote:

What about the bot dying when HP reaches zero but the explosion on an overload timer? 5,4,3,2,1 should be plenty of time for a zippy little light bot to flee.

that work? keep the same damage but put a 5 second kaboom delay, maybe 3 seconds...

That whould make the Explotion tactics in game useless, who cares about lightbots anyway... thay are fairly useless anyway. only light takle are okay to field.

The post is about light bots aka tacklers, clearly someone cares about them. If theyre useless, the devs might as well delete tackling items. Tacklers are an important part of the game, light bots arent "useless".

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Mongolia wrote:

JonesAnnihilator, face it, I blew your arguement out of the water.  Your formula was wrong and that 62nd artemis had a LWF (he was going way too fast, I don't need a chassis scan to see that).

There is no way using your formula above and skill 10 mechanics skills + lwf that an artemis will do that much explosion damage to a size 3 bot -> your formula is obviously wrong... or the way you think explosions effect small bots is different...

The artemis has a higher base armor and more accumulator then the kain too.

Did they demob you and blow the artemis up on purpose, or did you kill in at short range? This scenrio is totally different then the topic title isn't it?

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Arga wrote:

The artemis has a higher base armor and more accumulator then the kain too.

Did they demob you and blow the artemis up on purpose, or did you kill in at short range? This scenrio is totally different then the topic title isn't it?

I was running past him to get a demob on the kain further away.  When I started my approach to go past the artemis was around 70% or so health.  Just as I was running by 3 or 4 of our guys must have hit him in rapid succession and popped him as I ran past.  I assume I was between 30 to 50 feet past by the time he went pop but hard to say as he was no longer in my view (being behind me) and lag times.

But even so, as the artemis does have more armor and accumulator... it will be too dangerous for all short range combat and support to go anywhere near him.

This game will turn into a long-range only as it's not worth the risk/reward to do ANYTHING short range.  (If you want to survive that is.)

"...we will take undefended gammas and stations."  -Cassius of STC

62 (edited by Annihilator 2011-05-11 18:38:48)

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

sorry, i got an error up there when i applied the size difference to the raw damage.
still trying to figure out what went wrong, and what the hell i have typed into my calculator....

anyway, updated the calculation up there

and for your Castel, mk1 or 2 makes no difference:

Artemis + lwf + maxed armor extension vs. castel = 422 - 844 damage @ point blank

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Yarren Rakarth wrote:
Norrdec wrote:

To clarify, I think the light and assaults still get too much dmg from explosions. The mechs and H. mechs are fine as they are.

Why ? thay are smaller and therefor weaker. should be thesame dmg, becouse the damage is hitting the whole bot. not less of the bot becouse its a smaller, should therefor imho do more dmg to lightbots if anything.


But it's not helping the small people, making less and less tactics viable.
I again propose to make explosion size be connected with interference.

The AOE explosion is a good addon, but it needs tweaking like everything in the game. I understand getting hurt by the aoe, but to get one shotted(boom-ed) by anything bigger than an assault is broken.

<GargajCNS> we maim to please

Re: How explosion damage killed the close range mech

Norrdec wrote:

But it's not helping the small people, making less and less tactics viable.
I again propose to make explosion size be connected with interference.

The AOE explosion is a good addon, but it needs tweaking like everything in the game. I understand getting hurt by the aoe, but to get one shotted(boom-ed) by anything bigger than an assault is broken.

I agree that it should be Interference based, the thing is that it requires more tactics so you do not die in a lightbot, so it becomes a bit more challenging.
And people who do not plan on keeping the distance have themselves to blame.
if you stand next to a car that explodes IRL, you will probably most likely to suffer from something similar.