Topic: Any chance of a /respec account option?

I, like many others I'm sure, didn't realize that once you spent the initial 20K EP, that you would never be able to get it back.  I figured if I wanted to delete and start over with 0 other characters that it would default back to 20K, however I'm told by other players ingame that if I delete my character I will loose it all, and never regain it back.  I know, kind of whiny, maybe if you guys can't do that, please put a major notice in the tutorial.  I really feel like I have gimped my character up already, but it looks like there is nothing I can do about it short of buying a different account.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

/respec is a good suggestion, and would certainly help new players. You could even put a timer on the facility.

Anyhow, short term you may have gimp.ed your char, however long term very unlikey. As you will train and learn lots. I wouldnt worry about it.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Exactly how have you gimped it?

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Impus wrote:

I, like many others I'm sure, didn't realize that once you spent the initial 20K EP, that you would never be able to get it back.  I figured if I wanted to delete and start over with 0 other characters that it would default back to 20K, however I'm told by other players ingame that if I delete my character I will loose it all, and never regain it back.  I know, kind of whiny, maybe if you guys can't do that, please put a major notice in the tutorial.  I really feel like I have gimped my character up already, but it looks like there is nothing I can do about it short of buying a different account.


I was going to troll this so hard....but I don't have patience to say all I want to say..... So I just say "lol"

On another note... "LOL"

- M2S -

U betr run!

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Doomviper wrote:

I was going to troll this so hard....but I don't have patience to say all I want to say..... So I just say "lol"

On another note... "LOL"

That's really valuable input. I feel like you should post more. Maybe write a book! roll

@OP: 20k EP is just about 14 days worth. Not the end of the world really. And if you really messed up it's like 9 bucks for another account atm. Also nothing major smile

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

There is no real way you  can mess it up, you may have to lose a bit of time getting things where you want them, but the toon is never really gimped.
I love the system the way it is, if you learn something you take some time to learn it, then move on to learning something else, if you spent a semester taking underwater basketweaving in RL you did not gimp yourself, you just wasted the time (unless you want to become an underwater basketweaver i guess) and can still learn more later.
Having a reset of any kind would just encourage the "flavor of the month" builds that are so common in other games, or having people decide to respec on a whim. Many here i think would not like that very much, but we will have to see what others say here.

Who the $#@% is stEvE?

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

no

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

I don't think continuous respecs are a good idea, nor what this poster was suggesting, thereby eliminating the 'flavor of the month' following. I do, however, believe that a one time respec be given to new characters who may make choices before fully understanding them. This respec should only be available for a week after character creation, simply to help reduce the frustration and potential cancellation of new players.

Most of us have gamed for years and understand the pitfalls of bad character creation decisions and can live with them just fine. However, players unfamiliar with this type of game, or MMOs in general, may not be prepared for the inability to correct a mistake that was made when they were still learning the ropes.

I read an article somewhere that said the average MMO has an opportunity lasting less than a day to convince a new player to stick with it. A little kindness towards those who are trying out this product and deciding whether or not to continue subscribing to it will do wonders to help you capitalize on that small window of opportunity.

I understand, and personally enjoy, the sandbox environment. It just seems that many veteran players now equate 'sandbox' with a hardcore, no mistakes allowed, 'deal with it' mentality. Sandbox means 'here's a world, do what you want/can with it.'

If anyone can give a reason as to which detriments of a 1-week respec would outweigh the benefits, I'd love to hear them. How does doing this negatively affect you as a player, the other players, or the game world in general?

I've already listed the benefits, and I'm pretty sure we can all agree that impressing a new subscriber, and welcoming them, rather than alienating them or chastising them for not having researched their career path ahead of time, is an important goal to have. Even using a planner and being meticulous may not be enough.

I personally had a character planned out weeks in advance, which I had tuned several times. Then I got into the game, trained him, and after two days realized that, while effective, I just plain hated the way the character played. It didn't suit my style. Luckily I had already researched this game and committed to it. Most newcomers won't have done so.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

1 respec per account within the first week (or even shorter, 48/72 hours?) of the first character creation/login.  You get a grace period to play with the EP but really never have enough time to fully utilize or even make a FOTM before you'd need to respec that 1 time.

Helps newbies play around with extensions and see what they did wrong to do it right the next time.  Cant be exploited by veterans as it starts as soon as the account activates EP gain and is only once per account not character.

I invite you to try and break my suggestion and find something exploitable beyond "spec into industry and do *** on that for 2 days then respec to combat with extra gear trololol!'.  A good suggestion is one that cant be broken, so please try so we can find a solution for this 'problem'.


Making more advanced tutorials just wont help much because no matter how informative you make them people just wont read.  you'ld have to make them voiced for people to pay any attention to it.

I am Perpetuum's Most Dangerous Agent and an equal opportunity troll.
-> You just lost The Game <-
"Perpetuum sounds like a something I would stick up my *** for enjoyement." -Kaito Kurusaki

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Neoxx your idea sounds good.  I had no clue really what I was getting into, it's amazing what 24 hours of playing the game will teach someone, regretfully I had already blown through almost all 20K EP within the first few hours.   I did speak to a dev briefly, he/she said that it might be an option in the future, but for now they are focusing on bugs, which I don't really blame them.  I'm just hoping it doesn't really gimp my character in the long run having all combat stats, the EP I'll just suck it up and live, the stats are really going to limit my fun factor though I'm afraid.  I assume if I want to delve into mining/manufacturing or whatever that it is going to take forever to even get some of the basics.

11 (edited by Vorgrim Scout 2010-11-28 06:01:57)

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

A 72 hour respec option would be great for new players and would definitely help retain players who feel they have ruined their account forever, however wrong they may be.

Especially with the cost of character deletion now, a new player might feel dissolusioned with the game if they screwed up the agent with their main handle.

A grace period for new accounts is probably the way to go.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

OP just buy a new account

To avoid criticism, do nothing, say nothing, and be nothing.” – Elbert Hubbard

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Outlaw wrote:

OP just buy a new account

This might be good for Avatar Creations or for you, but it's absolutely horrible for anyone else.

Mistakes are made all the time, especially if you're a new player. Being expected to pay for a new account is completely unreasonable.

I came into this game expecting it to have a fair learning curve and I don't mind reading up on games and learning all the nitty-gritty details about them, in fact, I enjoy doing so. I might have made some mistakes in that first part of the game but it doesn't bother me since I'm one of the people who can simply ignore it.

However, just because I like learning that way doesn't mean everyone else does, it's simply bad design to develop your game in such a fashion. Why? Because most gamers lack the patience or desire to read pages upon pages of tutorials, instructions or "how-to" guides before even actually getting to play.

People want to dive right in and explore it for themselves and if the game is not readily available to these players (you can call them casuals, but even hardcore players share these traits) then they will quickly lose interest. If they feel they've made a mistake they cannot undo, then they will lose interest.

It's all well and dandy for you to say "just buy a new account" or for developers to go in with the mindset that "well those people aren't our target audience" but guess what: Everyone is your target audience. The primary goal of a video game (and any business) is to make money. The second goal is to make the service or product work well and be enjoyable.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Impus wrote:

Neoxx your idea sounds good.  I had no clue really what I was getting into, it's amazing what 24 hours of playing the game will teach someone, regretfully I had already blown through almost all 20K EP within the first few hours.   I did speak to a dev briefly, he/she said that it might be an option in the future, but for now they are focusing on bugs, which I don't really blame them.  I'm just hoping it doesn't really gimp my character in the long run having all combat stats, the EP I'll just suck it up and live, the stats are really going to limit my fun factor though I'm afraid.  I assume if I want to delve into mining/manufacturing or whatever that it is going to take forever to even get some of the basics.

Its not so bad getting the basics of mining/indy with low stats.  Its slower sure, and if you split of points your basically becoming a hybrid, and hybrids are always not as good as a dedicated class in any mmo so this shouldn't come as a surprise. 

You also could start a second character with crafting stats and spend the points there instead if your worried about the time it takes to train them on your combat toon.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Instead of a full respec that would give all EP back in one large chunk, how about a respec system based that allowed individual skills to be untrained?

Proposal:

Let's say you thought that the Basic Kinematics skill was the best skill in the game, and you raised it to Level 10, at a cost of roughly 24,500 EP. When you realized that it wasn't as useful as you thought, you would be able to untrain levels with a high cost/penalty. The cost would be 1 million NIC per current Skill Level to go down 1 Level. The penalty would be that you would only get refunded 25% of the EP that was spent on that level.

To go from Level 10 to Level 9 in our example, it would be 10 million NIC and refund 2800 EP, out of a initial cost of 11,200 to go from 9 to 10. Total cost to go from Level 10 to Level 3 (default start for a full military character) would be 49 million NIC. The total EP that you would get back from this would be 5,964.

This would allow someone to recoup some EP from a misclick or poor skill choice, but would not be a real option to completely respec and try to follow a FOTM build.

Reactor......ONLINE
Sensors......ONLINE
Weapons......ONLINE
All systems nominal.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Draz wrote:

Instead of a full respec that would give all EP back in one large chunk, how about a respec system based that allowed individual skills to be untrained?

Proposal:

Let's say you thought that the Basic Kinematics skill was the best skill in the game, and you raised it to Level 10, at a cost of roughly 24,500 EP. When you realized that it wasn't as useful as you thought, you would be able to untrain levels with a high cost/penalty. The cost would be 1 million NIC per current Skill Level to go down 1 Level. The penalty would be that you would only get refunded 25% of the EP that was spent on that level.

To go from Level 10 to Level 9 in our example, it would be 10 million NIC and refund 2800 EP, out of a initial cost of 11,200 to go from 9 to 10. Total cost to go from Level 10 to Level 3 (default start for a full military character) would be 49 million NIC. The total EP that you would get back from this would be 5,964.

This would allow someone to recoup some EP from a misclick or poor skill choice, but would not be a real option to completely respec and try to follow a FOTM build.

Okay I've read this thread from start to finish, and the question I would ask you.

Is what dis-advantage are you at 'if' the new player does get a full respec of all EP, and goes a FOTM build.

It isn't going to impact you personally, for them to enjoy their experience in the game, and for their money to continue to go to AC, so they can keep developing new and exciting things for us to do.

So on that note, thats just my opinion.. And you can take it for what its worth.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Bluefaced wrote:

Okay I've read this thread from start to finish, and the question I would ask you.

Is what dis-advantage are you at 'if' the new player does get a full respec of all EP, and goes a FOTM build.

It isn't going to impact you personally, for them to enjoy their experience in the game, and for their money to continue to go to AC, so they can keep developing new and exciting things for us to do.

So on that note, thats just my opinion.. And you can take it for what its worth.

The obvious disadvantage is that by the time they could implement a full respec for characters less than a week old, my characters and many others will already be out of their first week. Even though many of us may have made poor or uniformed choices during our first week with the game, we would be stuck with EP placed in Extensions that we would not have picked if we had known better.

Using a system that would allow for modification of individual skills would allow people to correct mis-clicks or poor choices with an equal opportunity, regardless of the length of time a character has existed.

It would affect me personally because I would not be the one offered an option or opportunity that was given to someone else. Perhaps then I would be the the one not enjoying the game experience.

Reactor......ONLINE
Sensors......ONLINE
Weapons......ONLINE
All systems nominal.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

I wouldn't mind this. I "experimented" a little too much with another character and wasted all of my points. A one time reset would be nice for all new accounts.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

I realize you will be past a week if that gets implemented, but I see no other way to do this safely.  They would have to just have some "amnesty period" where anyone could respec then limit it to only noobs.  Still, that could open up a can of worms.

Live and learn, then buy a new account big_smile

I am Perpetuum's Most Dangerous Agent and an equal opportunity troll.
-> You just lost The Game <-
"Perpetuum sounds like a something I would stick up my *** for enjoyement." -Kaito Kurusaki

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Neoxx wrote:

I realize you will be past a week if that gets implemented, but I see no other way to do this safely.  They would have to just have some "amnesty period" where anyone could respec then limit it to only noobs.  Still, that could open up a can of worms.

Live and learn, then buy a new account big_smile

Honestly I don't see it really creating some ungodly issue, if they were to implement it like discussed, with it being a few days or week whichever they decided, but give a one time reset to everyone when it is implemented on the same timer. Use it or lose it.

Everyone gets a chance to use it, if they think they need it, and no one has any reason to start a riot and stomp their feet like two year olds because someone else got a sucker and they didnt.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Bluefaced wrote:

no one has any reason to start a riot and stomp their feet like two year olds because someone else got a sucker and they didnt.

Best analogy ever.


But all seriousness a respec isn't a horrible thing. I don't think anyone here wants the community to go as far as FOTM builds and what-not. After all there aren't elves in this game, thank god. Most people who messed up barely had a week with beta and the real issue was throwing 40k/20k of points at people who really didn't understand the full spectrum of choices and that the decisions they were making would impact their character for some time. Will it be forever? No, but if they REALLY *** up or thought something would be fun that isn't they should have the opportunity, even if only once, to fix it right?

I suppose the one I agree most with is Neoxx. Give new accounts a week to respec. Hell let them respec freely in that week so they can find their niche for what they want to do. This makes people happy and keeps subs instead of having people buy and say bye.

As far as letting everyone else do it? I don't see why not to for the first week after the system would be implemented to allow that. This early in the game it won't really affect the long-term player base allowing such a thing would it?...

22 (edited by Jerokane 2010-11-29 10:44:53)

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

I too didn't know about this and blew the first 20k on my first char I end up not liking at all. (want to roll a completely different faction)

I also believed that every new char you created at least get the initial 20k start EP. And that only time gained EP was shared among characters.

So count me in being dissapointed about this.

Luckily I started with the 4-day trial. So I can create a new account. Still it's really annoying having to create a new account, buy again. Just to correct a mistake like this.

This is sertainly gonna cost them potential customers tho. So I hope they will be able to look into this very soon. (as I understand fixing bugs is priority now, but so is this in my opinion).

Just giving every new created character the initial 20k EP and link it that that char alone, is maybe even a much better option, than providing respecs.

Just my 2 cents.

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Just giving every new created character the initial 20k EP and link it that that char alone, is maybe even a much better option, than providing respecs.

that "just" is just not possible. EP is gained account wide. The initial EP is not for your first agent, its on your account.

if the DEVs would give out 20K ep for every new agent, you would simply start with 60k EP
(three agents)
after 24h you delete two of them and spawn another batch of 40k EP. The 2880 EP Agent-delete penelaty would be a drop water on a hot stone.

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Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Recognizer wrote:

Just giving every new created character the initial 20k EP and link it that that char alone, is maybe even a much better option, than providing respecs.

that "just" is just not possible. EP is gained account wide. The initial EP is not for your first agent, its on your account.

if the DEVs would give out 20K ep for every new agent, you would simply start with 60k EP
(three agents)
after 24h you delete two of them and spawn another batch of 40k EP. The 2880 EP Agent-delete penelaty would be a drop water on a hot stone.

Nothing is impossible. And I do not see any reason why they can't change it so, that they can assign 20k "starting" points tied and bound to each character. Completely seperate from the shared time accumalitive EP pool.

25 (edited by Nipa 2010-11-29 15:29:47)

Re: Any chance of a /respec account option?

Maybe have a progressive respec mechanic? Something where you could flag a skill 'to respec' and you would slowly get their EP point back (at a rate of, say, 50% of the usual EP gain rate). Basically Eve skilling system in reverse.

This would allow youth mistakes to be fixed as well as slow respec at anytime but without enabling people to use FotM builds (but this would allow FotY builds, which I think is quite reasonable).