176

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

"The game is balanced when I decided when and where to fight, not the other guy."

or the same thing said another way

"The game is balanced when Mechs decide when and where to fight, not EW"

or the impossible statement;

"The game is balanced when no bot controls when or where to fight"

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

I wouldnt suggest making mechs center of the fights as opposed to know - thatd be stupid. But as Annihilator put it precisely:

EW dictate AND do allthough they should only dictate OR do. Thats basically it. Making top speed temporary would change that or atleast would speed make a tactical ability with cooldown as opposed to always having it. Or making EWs either use EW stuff with high speed as supporters OR weapons with low speed.

178

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Look at that statement in general terms again;

"A bot can't dictate when to fight and also fight."

If the bot can't fight, then its always going to choose NOT to fight, since by definition it can't.

Apply that to EW if you want, but it won't be a balance change, it will just make EW unused.

I suppose if you keep eliminating bots by removing weapons, eventually you'll get to only the mech being useful.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Ok if the outcome is either that or the other bot will be used then i vote for that one.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Redline wrote:

Ok if the outcome is either that or the other bot will be used then i vote for that one.

*** at the voting polls in some countries only count as half votes...

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

So Billy-Bob Glimpse get your brother Cletus to sign up here and do a full vote on things next time.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Redline wrote:

So Billy-Bob Glimpse get your brother Cletus to sign up here and do a full vote on things next time.

you seem upset?

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

No Sir, Glimpse of HokkogarOZ.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

We've started using mechs during our roams. It works.

"...playing a game is the voluntary attempt to overcome unnecessary obstacles."
Bernard Suits, 1978

185 (edited by Container 2011-02-20 04:51:18)

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Even M2S is getting bored of EWAR lights though they work much much better at roaming than mechs.  Small bots just get boring.  That is the entire reason to buff the bigger ones.

Bigger bots are more interesting as they get better fitting, and require more EP to train so they give more interest to training plans.  When people lose them, it drives the economy more too as they require more to earn and replace.

Good job Avatar on HP buff for mechs/heavy mechs.  That is something.
Not enough, but at least mechs/heavy mechs start looking more worth the effort.

I doubt it will matter too much to any alliance when you buff mechs/heavy mechs as most are getting bored of EWAR lights and now have EP in mechs/heavy mechs anyway.
As I said, people want a path of progression and mechs/heavy mechs is it.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Making mechs even more important then they currently are on the battlefield (and they are crucial now) will push the game even more into blob-warfare. Only the big alliances will be able to field PVP teams, and smaller corps will be forced to merge & blob up to be able to produce enough bots & fits for PVP.

... Kinda nice when you're CEO of biggest industry corp in-game.

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
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Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Mechs are not useful in roams.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Di9LN2-7wmc

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Nobody said that theyre not useful in roams - they just arent useful to push off EWs.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Redline wrote:

Nobody said that theyre not useful in roams - they just arent useful to push off EWs.

God forbid that 1 class of bots can't do everything best in game.

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
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Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

well EW can on roamings.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Im sure a group of ewars will kill a group of mechs.

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192 (edited by Redline 2011-02-20 14:57:27)

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Its easy to do actually. Take the speed, use terrain to avoid mech range, kite the group and focus the nearest.

Then its a EW group against a single mech for any mech in the group.

edit: since you have the speed - you can dictate in which terrain to fight and always use this advantage and if things get tight you run out of range in 5 secs and start over.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Redline wrote:

Its easy to do actually. Take the speed, use terrain to avoid mech range, kite the group and focus the nearest.

Then its a EW group against a single mech for any mech in the group.

edit: since you have the speed - you can dictate in which terrain to fight and always use this advantage and if things get tight you run out of range in 5 secs and start over.

Good luck using speed with 300m demob. wink

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
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Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Through a hill? Go try.

And moreover - to need a diverse mech setup to counter a cheap EW setup - isnt balanced. And then again EW can always chose to fight or not.

Its 3:1 for EW.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Redline wrote:

Through a hill? Go try.

And moreover - to need a diverse mech setup to counter a cheap EW setup - isnt balanced. And then again EW can always chose to fight or not.

Its 3:1 for EW.

... You do realize demobs are distance-based and not at all affected by terrain? lol

But ok I'll play your game - EW's can choose to fight or not. So can mechs. GL getting killed by EW's when you're standing in a clump on flat terrain. Point?

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
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Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

God is this *** topic still going, I better even the people in your own alliance are facepalming by now.

197 (edited by Redline 2011-02-20 16:57:35)

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

The points still stand. Why should one class of bots be free to dictate fights and do the fighting? The demob thing doesnt do anything.

Youll need a gang of diverse mechs to cope with gang of dps fit EW. The latter is easier to achieve, cheaper and your still free to roam anywhere.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

The point still stands that if your group of mechs gets killed by a group of ewar, you are terrible.  The solutions were already posted a million times but a few folks(like 2) just put their hands over their ears and yell LALALAALALALA.

Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Redline wrote:

The points still stand. Why should one class of bots be free to dictate fights and do the fighting? The demob thing doesnt do anything.

Youll need a gang of diverse mechs to cope with gang of dps fit EW. The latter is easier to achieve, cheaper and your still free to roam anywhere.

Who is dictating fights? The ewars who run away because they can't kill anything BUT a lonely mech/group of noobs who dont know wtf they're doing,, or mechs who stand wherever they wanna stand and ewars have to run away from them?

What exactly do you want? 120kph base speed on mechs (for a start)?

[18:20:30] <GLiMPSE> Chairman Of My Heart o/
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Re: Root Issue: INCENTIVES TO PLAY, INCENTIVES TO FIGHT

Tiggus wrote:

The point still stands that if your group of mechs gets killed by a group of ewar, you are terrible.  The solutions were already posted a million times but a few folks(like 2) just put their hands over their ears and yell LALALAALALALA.

You seem to not get a major part - i dont have a problem with the mentioned at all - i got killed in the hoop 3 times total and havent lost a single fight i was in.

Its just an observation: EWs setups are easier, cheaper and can choose their fights. Thats simply not good.