Mara,

I did inadvertnetly use beta corp when I meant beta alliance in a couple places. Also, I did call out the difference in corps like Ecorp and NA that were on beta and had the opportunity to gain the benefit of such before basing operations out of alpha. I'm also thinking abour your corp in general when I imagine an alliance of alpha based corps that could ally to push back and take ownership of a beta outpost, which will actually have some value when EC is put in the game.

I'm not sure that more space is going to solve the small corp issue, but I would like to see something done to promote small corps being more active in PVP, but again other than the PVP itself there doesn't seem to be any upside for them to spend the time and bots beating against the current status quo.

But, maybe with lower server pop now, there is more room for new players to get some pvp time in on beta.

What do you think about small or solo PVP on beta at this time?

Online now, Live at 8pm PST give or take.

Baphomet - 715,000 NIC
Std Sensor Amp  - 250,000 NIC
Std Laser Tuner -  30,000 NIC
5xStd sm laser -  50,000 NIC

~1,045,000 NIC to outfit for basic offense

Add std repper, LWF, and some type of armor hardener mix to suit brings it up to about 1.1M more or less.

Note the cost of the item that requires Epitron, the amp, is 1/3 the cost of the bot for just a standard item.

its 3.4M for a signal masker and 4M for a detector, so if i wanted to replace the tuner with a masker to help me get a little closer before being spotted, the cost just went up to 4.5M NIC.

For players in a large beta corporation, 4 or 5 Million NIC isn't a lot of money, and they would probably sell me the items for less or even no charge. But I'm not in one of those, and neither are the alpha players I'm talking about.

So, what can i expect to get out of my 4M NIC investement?

A couple of things could happen; first thing is I could get targeted and killed by NPC mobs that are much more aggressive than I am used to on alpha, and die without even seeing another player. Scouts see me moving toward the teleporter and a welcoming party demobs me at the 'porter and kills me in less than a minute, or various other scenrios of instant and worthless death.

The BEST I could hope for would be to find a gate with a single guard and engage in some 1-1 PVP, maybe win maybe lose, but have atleast a chance.

More liklely however, is to be outnumbered at least 2-1 against some Fast fit group, get demobbed and locked down, ECM'd, and killed without really getting any fighting, experience, or fun out of it.

This is, I think an accurate representation of a solo novice PVP'er heading to Beta.

Granted, the more I go the better my chances of having a positive encounter, but really the cost of losing 4M NIC per even for a poorly fit bot (all std T1) is alot of time farming alpha kernels. I spent 2 hours the other day, filled up a sequar with broken parts, fragments, and about 60 kernels worth about 1.3M total. Not too bad really, but that's 7 hours of farming for 1 trip to beta... i just don't have the patience for that.

So, I would disagree, and say the work to reward ratio for a solo player is stopping them from doing pvp; if they are not already proficent at it, the cost to learn is now too high.

Joining a corp and having them subsidize the learning curve is really the only effective way to learn/practice PVP.

Adjust game mechanics so the price of STD equipment drops to something a little more reasonable that a solo player can afford to lose, like 500k for an assult bot + fit, and another 1M if you want to spring for the signal masker.

I would farm 2 hours per bot and not feel to bad about getting blow'd up a dozen times while I L2P.

Maybe my perception of beta is incorrect, this is just what I saw happening while we were in HHO.  While in Infestation no one ever 'visited' us while I was on gate duty.

I agree Arga - the scenario you describe can be expensive. An important part in pvp is consequence - not necessarliy punishment for loss.

Now if there were consequences to dying other then the resource loss - and a political faction system that divided players by their player choices (dynamic factions resulting from target choice and fighting zone) there would be no need for expensive basic pvp equipment.

Neocron for example - a game with the most sophisticated pvp/trade char interconnection - suceeded very well on this part. pvp equipment was easy to get, easy to loose - and consequences resultet in a form of required social interaction to cure your pvp blessures by medicals and scientists - also reflecting on yourself with a faction system, giving or restricting access to certain areas, depending on your target choice.

hey arga - it sounds like theres one thing missing on whole alpha island, that would change the loss penalty a good bit: some npc spawns that drop standard sensor amps on regular basis.

everything else you mentioned, except the bot itself, is standard loot from DPS-fitted assault bots. (2nd star Cremator, Warrior Ram, Patrician Executioner)