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Well I am ok with a bit slower, but seems like its too slow.
Vektor: 104 km/h fitted (base speed: 104)
Yagel: 123 km/h fitted (base speed: 120)
at least +10 seems like needed.
lets be realistic, the only thing it will ever fit is a frame and a signal detector with perhaps a shield. Whats that comparison?
lets be realistic, the only thing it will ever fit is a frame and a signal detector with perhaps a shield. Whats that comparison?
Well yes, you are basically right, but for that purpose also slow.
its slower than something else but it also has a signal detection bonus. This means you have time to see them and then stay out of range unless they are full speed straight at you which is everything in signal detection.
He's right Inda. With speed Vektor will be imbalanced.
I would say scrap its detection bonus, give it speed. Make a Mk2 bots have specializations.
I would say scrap its detection bonus, give it speed. Make a Mk2 bots have specializations.
That's because you have no brain. The whole race is slow, the detection bonus makes it still usable.
Yes little one if it keeps its current detection it must be slow. Having the entire race being the slowest AND giving it the current shortest optimal ranges (75 M T1 Smalls, 125M T1 Shorts, 200M T1 Longs) just blows my mind. On-top of all of this you give it shields to the one of the fastest weapon groupings.
This is clearly "ment" to be thee detection bot. In doing so it made the Assault nearly useless DPS, speed, range, tank, just about all around.
This is all coming around to from my small picture that I am seeing, maybe Zoom has a grander master plan. Currently I am not liking the direction, as these bots add nothing meaning full to the game, and if they do. Only that one faction will have it, making them the goto faction to get.
This is why I suggested we just make them a normal race, and spread the specializations around to ALL the colors to be inclusive, not exclusive to one bot race.
Example : Light Scout
Red Lights - Prom - Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Blue Lights - Yagel - - Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Green Lights- Castel -- Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Yellow Lights - Vektor - - Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Add different names, keep them all Mk1s OR do a Mk1.5. Paper thin, Medium speeds, and bad masking. Strip off all the other Detection multipliers off all the other lights, the cost to make one is a base Light bot X2, or by some multiplier.
Now you have the indy side figured out, do this for all the specialized bots you want.
Support Bots
Red - Specializes Remote Sensor, Secondary Remote Reps.
Blue - Specializes Remote Reps, Secondary, Remote Energy
Green - Specializes Remote Energy, Secondary Remote ECCM
Yellow - Specializes Remote ECCM, Secondary Remote Sensor
Light Marksman Bots
Specializes in using Medium Weapons on a Light bot Platform, Higher Range, Slightly lower speed, Lower detection, Higher Locking, Decreased ROF
Red - Lasers, Each Lvl Decreased Fitting requirements for Medium Weapons.
Blue - Mags, "
Green - Missles, "
Yellow - Bullets, "
Same Deal, these are Mk1 bots only (for now) and has the same slot configurations.
Yes little one if it keeps its current detection it must be slow. Having the entire race being the slowest AND giving it the current shortest optimal ranges (75 M T1 Smalls, 125M T1 Shorts, 200M T1 Longs) just blows my mind. On-top of all of this you give it shields to the one of the fastest weapon groupings.
This is clearly "ment" to be thee detection bot. In doing so it made the Assault nearly useless DPS, speed, range, tank, just about all around.
This is all coming around to from my small picture that I am seeing, maybe Zoom has a grander master plan. Currently I am not liking the direction, as these bots add nothing meaning full to the game, and if they do. Only that one faction will have it, making them the goto faction to get.
This is why I suggested we just make them a normal race, and spread the specializations around to ALL the colors to be inclusive, not exclusive to one bot race.
Example : Light Scout
Red Lights - Prom - Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Blue Lights - Yagel - - Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Green Lights- Castel -- Specialization - +3 Detection Per Level
Yellow Lights - Vektor - - Specialization - +3 Detection Per LevelAdd different names, keep them all Mk1s OR do a Mk1.5. Paper thin, Medium speeds, and bad masking. Strip off all the other Detection multipliers off all the other lights, the cost to make one is a base Light bot X2, or by some multiplier.
Now you have the indy side figured out, do this for all the specialized bots you want.
Support Bots
Red - Specializes Remote Sensor, Secondary Remote Reps.
Blue - Specializes Remote Reps, Secondary, Remote Energy
Green - Specializes Remote Energy, Secondary Remote ECCM
Yellow - Specializes Remote ECCM, Secondary Remote SensorLight Marksman Bots
Specializes in using Medium Weapons on a Light bot Platform, Higher Range, Slightly lower speed, Lower detection, Higher Locking, Decreased ROF
Red - Lasers, Each Lvl Decreased Fitting requirements for Medium Weapons.
Blue - Mags, "
Green - Missles, "
Yellow - Bullets, "Same Deal, these are Mk1 bots only (for now) and has the same slot configurations.
Did you trip and hit your little head this morning sweetheart?
There is nothing wrong with the light. The assault is a little under powered and needs another low so it can fit an evasive with some kind of tank. Either that or make the hit size bonus stronger.
Would you say new race is a red headed step-child or
Its a bit underwhelming so far, I think they are trying to balance vs the t1 variants which will doom them to uselessness.
They should follow the Eve model of making them awesome, too good and overused before nerfing them in to oblivion.
I can trip hit my head, go into a coma, vomit all over the sexy nurse, and still come up with actionable numbers instead of senseless banter.
Then you say we need to follow the mantra of Eve, what is explained is that exact thing, I salute you for supporting my ideas.
If I would need a fast detector, I'll take Castel. No need to implement a whole new bot being the same as already existing ones.
Sindybots should go their own way.
If I would need a fast detector, I'll take Castel. No need to implement a whole new bot being the same as already existing ones.
Sindybots should go their own way.
QFT
Only as it has tank, speed, and detection. Its the entire package. I'm looking at this less from a vertical slice and more of a overall game direction of what the Dev team wants this new faction to become.
If they want a red-head step child, keep doing what your doing.
If they want a new faction with all the benefits, drastic, yet reasonable changes need to occur.
The DEVs put it into the robots description what they are intended for:
"The smallest member of our hybrid-technology fleet of robots. Its armor is weaker than the average, but its small size makes up for it, resulting in a hard to hit target. Coupled with excellent detection and masking systems, the Vektor makes not only a good scout, but a tough opponent in combat as well.
"The gist of our firearm-wielding force. A swarm of Locusts can quickly shred enemy groups, but their specialized framework increases their survivability in solo engagements too."
both descriptions say that they are intended to shoot things, and to survive by not getting hit.
Syndicate robots are hard to hit bulletstorm glass-ninjas
neither of them has any means to defend against beeing demobbed, and neither of them has enough evasion to survive beeing shot at. Not to forget that neither of them has a short enough locking time to lock a target faster then the target can lock them.
it seems zoom totally ignored that no matter how much mass they got, they still need to fit the obligatory LWF (-25% demob resists) and can't fit armor plates (+1m hitsize per plate) without losing their intended advantage.
Since they HAVE TO compete with mk2's in PvP, giving them only as many slots as mk1's have, puts them at an inherit disadvantage.
effectively, the vector is "just another light ewar bot" in the eyes of the playerbase, and as such not very much competitive with
cheap, high-hitpoint prometheus gate/outposts scouts that have enough evasion AND hitpoints to survive the small difference between stability and protection timer (probabyl the reason for the nerf!) or
highly efficient castels with demobs, shields and a medium accumulator for extreme recharge and a masker to scout around freely
yagel? that one has nothing left since the great nerf of small weapons. no accumulator, no hitpoint, not even enough speed to act as a scout...
And Perpetuum - since the beginning, the DEVs didn't want to have individual factions - at least not in their actions. from the beginning, playing this game meant to drop your "faction" and then use the robot that fits best the role you want to play in your playercorp. those three factions we had are only ingame for the NPC Themepark. for six (?) years development was aiming into the direction to have only that one player "faction" under the banner of the syndicate. intended or unintended.
And as such, the new robots are filling into roles that are currently missing, not making up a whole new "playable faction"
So why do you think they would suddenly do it differently now?
*edit: parts where missing*
I fully understand the lore of the game. I could agree with you if the player had the freedom to switch around EP at will, at zero cost. He doesn't, we pick a color and usually go down that road with all of our EP. Just as we do with specialization, and we SHOULD be rewarded with specialized bots.
The best examples we have in game now are most certainly Ewar. Look at the posts of -62-, CIR, look at how they have successfully leverage specialization of DPS, and Ewar together, with a jumbled mess of a RR bot, indy. Players should be rewarded with bots that let them play the game in which they see fit, with balance in mind.
Look at those bots before the great "balance" patch. We had clear speed indicators of what one was the fastest, Blue, Red, Green I believe. This gave the player base a quick idea of what they were dealing with at a glance, a good thing.
You touched on some of the imbalance we see now, we have one light that is utilizes so effectively for just one thing, the castle, all the rest are basically not used. If you want to force this hitsize thing into balancing and make it the Yellow thing, then you must rework Medium weapons to correlate with something.
I completely disagree with the Devs not wanting individual factions, if so we would have one race, one weapon set and we would go. People inherently want factions, we want options for PVP, we want different visuals, we want stuff to play with, stuff to enjoy. Syndy stuff should be a new faction, as we are the driving force for all the change we see in the game, its not the NPC's that's for sure. They just stand their to get shot.
I would think they would start opening up to newer ideas as of what we see currently with the state of the game, balance is unsatisfying at best, speed is out of control, certain bots are completely useless. I can go on, but this would start to overshadow how hard it is to nail these few things perfectly. Balancing even one bot class against each other is extremely hard to get it perfect, as were already given so many options given. We are here to help, but most of the community just wants the status quo and drastically shoots down any factual numbers that are given with no numbers on their end.
We have hope.
Wall of text
Yes, yes, options, and that's why you ask to change Vektor in a way the other lights go. You just want more options fir sure. Not like you want new fast scout/tackler with reduced hitsize instead of castel, we all understand.
Why don't you post with your main, mr. Syndic?
What I want is a light bot, that does DPS on par with the other lights (and Assaults with Assaults) that doesn't have the stupid specialization. I want that moved to a different bot for a bot truly spec'ed for Detection.
This breaks up the difficult balancing aspects of the game, moving them into subcategory's and balancing them out from their.
A detector should have neither a tank, or great masking, fast speed would be fine, but not the fastest.
Actually Anni I think this is the first race where a frame is not obligatory. When I look at the assault I don't see a frame being useful really, it just makes you too vulnerable to demob.
The problem is if you want the assault bonus to matter it needs to be a lot stronger. I would prefer the bonus is increased rather than more slots added.
I would also like to see heavies get nerfed in their hit dispersion.
None of that will matter vs a gropho who will one shot you
What I want is a light bot, that does DPS on par with the other lights (and Assaults with Assaults) that doesn't have the stupid specialization. I want that moved to a different bot for a bot truly spec'ed for Detection.
This breaks up the difficult balancing aspects of the game, moving them into subcategory's and balancing them out from their.A detector should have neither a tank, or great masking, fast speed would be fine, but not the fastest.
IMO, that's more about separating such lights on 2 - one is for detection, one is for combat. Like, Castel is for DPS, and Shmastel for detecting. They can look the same, just have different stats and slots.
But that's still has nothing to do with Vektor speed nor Vektor itself.
Actually Anni I think this is the first race where a frame is not obligatory. When I look at the assault I don't see a frame being useful really, it just makes you too vulnerable to demob.
The problem is if you want the assault bonus to matter it needs to be a lot stronger. I would prefer the bonus is increased rather than more slots added.
I would also like to see heavies get nerfed in their hit dispersion.
None of that will matter vs a gropho who will one shot you
dispersion scale needs to be widened,
just look how deadly gamma EM-Turrets are if you just boost their RoF... their dispersion was changed to what? 20°? and they still kill maxed evasive shielded trojars before they can even get into locking range.
but in PvP suddenly a 30% stabilizer will make a difference if you even have chance to miss your t4 Gauss' against mech sized targets.
though... missiles need to be looked at too. there is no point in using small missiles, if your long-range medium ones can already kill anything that comes into sight.
regarding the vektor - "ninja" or "hit&run" is not possible with a small bot that cannot get into shooting range, locking a target and deal at least some damage before having to retreat again for self repair.
If that would work, lights, especially Yagel, could be used against heavies as intended.
And for gods sake... for demobbing, we have dedicated robots, namely the light ewars.
If any bot ingame should be able to perma-demob someone while beeing protected by a shield, then by logic, it should be a trojar with 3 drainer or an injector!
I've said before that there should be an energy modifier to demobs so a small thing demobilizing a big thing would run out of energy quickly. Its so stupid that an unbonused light can demob a heavy with negligible drain.
I've said before that there should be an energy modifier to demobs so a small thing demobilizing a big thing would run out of energy quickly. Its so stupid that an unbonused light can demob a heavy with negligible drain.
at the same time, its stupid that a light bot can be fully demobbed by a heavy from 600m away.
Everything should be changed in a way where small bots deal close to no damage to big ones, and big ones miss close to every shot on small ones, like in THAT OTHER GAME. Someone wil lsay: but hey, I want to wtfpwn HMechs with by Bapho... and they could fit med guns on them. And those who want to roflstomp whatever lights are around - welcome to the small guns on big bots. Furthermore, big bots chassis slots can be changed in a way where you have like 2 of 4/6 slots suitable for small stuff.
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