Re: I keep cry about missions

Inda wrote:

GUYS this is INSANE.

How you can be at BETA without be in squad..

I have the whole corp at Beta and the rest is outside of the squad. That is NO WAY!

+1

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Re: I keep cry about missions

Is there really enough money floating in the game to warrant T4+ items being 500M as ive stated before that's 9Billion for a black seth.  2.5B for a black bot seems legit unless you want everyone rolling in them.  The economy isn't healthy enough to charge these outrageous prices.  Anyone else concerned that they're working on NPC AI and not concentrating on stuff more pratical.  No one gives a *** about npcs unless it's for beacons which you've clearly broke, or you could at least do the Turrets vs npc.

Re: I keep cry about missions

Rovoc wrote:

Is there really enough money floating in the game to warrant T4+ items being 500M as ive stated before that's 9Billion for a black seth.  2.5B for a black bot seems legit unless you want everyone rolling in them.  The economy isn't healthy enough to charge these outrageous prices.  Anyone else concerned that they're working on NPC AI and not concentrating on stuff more pratical.  No one gives a *** about npcs unless it's for beacons which you've clearly broke, or you could at least do the Turrets vs npc.

Sadly, this is pretty much standard practice for AC. They've also already made NPC AI far more aggressive than it used to be, not sure what the new iteration is about.

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Re: I keep cry about missions

Crepitus wrote:
Rovoc wrote:

Is there really enough money floating in the game to warrant T4+ items being 500M as ive stated before that's 9Billion for a black seth.  2.5B for a black bot seems legit unless you want everyone rolling in them.  The economy isn't healthy enough to charge these outrageous prices.  Anyone else concerned that they're working on NPC AI and not concentrating on stuff more pratical.  No one gives a *** about npcs unless it's for beacons which you've clearly broke, or you could at least do the Turrets vs npc.

Sadly, this is pretty much standard practice for AC. They've also already made NPC AI far more aggressive than it used to be, not sure what the new iteration is about.

Have you played this game?

NPC's are a shadow of the power and aggressiveness they used to be. Mission NPC's are a joke. The only possible exception to that is Observers.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: I keep cry about missions

Jita wrote:
Crepitus wrote:
Rovoc wrote:

Is there really enough money floating in the game to warrant T4+ items being 500M as ive stated before that's 9Billion for a black seth.  2.5B for a black bot seems legit unless you want everyone rolling in them.  The economy isn't healthy enough to charge these outrageous prices.  Anyone else concerned that they're working on NPC AI and not concentrating on stuff more pratical.  No one gives a *** about npcs unless it's for beacons which you've clearly broke, or you could at least do the Turrets vs npc.

Sadly, this is pretty much standard practice for AC. They've also already made NPC AI far more aggressive than it used to be, not sure what the new iteration is about.

Have you played this game?

NPC's are a shadow of the power and aggressiveness they used to be. Mission NPC's are a joke. The only possible exception to that is Observers.

They're still always fit to fill resistance holes and loaded with plates, they target support meaning you can't have an alt remote rep you and farm in peace, T4 combat missions on Beta don't pay enough to risk the MK2 heavy it takes to do them efficiently (which is as far as I've gone in combat missions, which is still hundreds) - and not even a third of what you say you make harvesting, most spawns have *** loads of ewar which is more annoying than dangerous but detracts from the "fun" which these are supposed to be, Observers are Godzilla.

On Gamma, masking doesn't mean *** they will make a B-line for you every *** time making mining/harvesting impossible outside of walled areas without full corp ops of combat guards which no one wants to do. Maybe YMMV but I've actually played pretty much every day for the last couple weeks since I came back; much of it mission running and Gamma production.

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Re: I keep cry about missions

Crepitus wrote:
Jita wrote:
Crepitus wrote:

Sadly, this is pretty much standard practice for AC. They've also already made NPC AI far more aggressive than it used to be, not sure what the new iteration is about.

Have you played this game?

NPC's are a shadow of the power and aggressiveness they used to be. Mission NPC's are a joke. The only possible exception to that is Observers.

They're still always fit to fill resistance holes and loaded with plates, they target support meaning you can't have an alt remote rep you and farm in peace, T4 combat missions on Beta don't pay enough to risk the MK2 heavy it takes to do them efficiently (which is as far as I've gone in combat missions, which is still hundreds) - and not even a third of what you say you make harvesting, most spawns have *** loads of ewar which is more annoying than dangerous but detracts from the "fun" which these are supposed to be, Observers are Godzilla.

On Gamma, masking doesn't mean *** they will make a B-line for you every *** time making mining/harvesting impossible outside of walled areas without full corp ops of combat guards which no one wants to do. Maybe YMMV but I've actually played pretty much every day for the last couple weeks since I came back; much of it mission running and Gamma production.


I think you need to have a look again Crepitus at combat missions on Beta. I imagine you are trying to do them while in a squad (which is what this whole thread is about) which is reducing your payour and increasing your difficulty. Level 6 combat missions while out of a squad can be done easily solo and take longer but pay more than harvesting missions. 60 - 70m an hour is definitely doable (but i'm talking about if you have your skills in missions maxed - it makes a big difference). The reason I prefer harvesting is you get more tokens.

As for the NPC AI, you are talking about a brief period of time after the Devs turned all mobs Orange because 77 and CIR were abusing mechanics to drag mobs and kill people on Alpha. before that occurred most of the spots you would do PVE at were red and would attack anyone as full groups rather that you able to manage by spawn. They were a lot more aggressive, a lot harder to kill and a lot more challenging and fun because of this.

Observers have always been hard, its only really recently that you stopped getting them on Alpha - a stupid change that allowed afk scarab mining and macro's all over the game.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: I keep cry about missions

obviously he is in squad.
because he "solo"'s them with multiboxing support.

the gamma NPC comment sounds strange.
I have been active on gamma for severa weeks with NER, and nearly no NPC was actively running towards us. they have been walking around in fixed travel routes, with a minimal aggro range.

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Re: I keep cry about missions

Annihilator wrote:

obviously he is in squad.
because he "solo"'s them with multiboxing support.

the gamma NPC comment sounds strange.
I have been active on gamma for severa weeks with NER, and nearly no NPC was actively running towards us. they have been walking around in fixed travel routes, with a minimal aggro range.

I was not in squad doing combat missions - with the same issues that Inda mentioned.

Come to Kras, I can park a Riveler MK2 with 281.5 masking on a field and have roaming NPCs divert course over and over to run directly over where I'm sitting. I watched it happen more than 4 times back to back in less than 15 minutes last night, sometimes same spawns sometimes different. Luckily I picked a field that was next to a station so I escaped, barely, but it's so frequent it's pointless to even try.

I wasted over an hour of my extremely limited weekday play time trying to set up for that op too, moving a hauler nearby and trying to find a spot that didn't seem like obvious suicide, etc.

You don't have to look far on the killboards to see what happens if you don't, these are all 1 loss, the guy thought he was safe because of walls:

http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/268168
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/268169
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/268165
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/268166
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/268167

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Re: I keep cry about missions

Dude Kraz NPCs are super aggressive.  I think Zoom purposely programmed it that way.  I would like to do Indy on that *** island but as soon as you setup shop, 12398`1273-891237y129-371-28938`1-378`12-89371`23890`176389`1273`01893712-3890`173-98`1273`9108237129837`1-93781`2 NPCs show up in 5 minute intervals, and it's like. egh *** it why bother.

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35 (edited by Inda 2016-03-18 06:35:44)

Re: I keep cry about missions

Missions.

Even at Alpha we dont see our members, who do what, because they out of squad.

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18.01.2014. [12:57:58] <BeastmodeGuNs> after that i remembered all those warning about 1v1 you lol, and i found out why xD

Re: I keep cry about missions

Ville wrote:

Dude Kraz NPCs are super aggressive.  I think Zoom purposely programmed it that way.  I would like to do Indy on that *** island but as soon as you setup shop, 12398`1273-891237y129-371-28938`1-378`12-89371`23890`176389`1273`01893712-3890`173-98`1273`9108237129837`1-93781`2 NPCs show up in 5 minute intervals, and it's like. egh *** it why bother.

I have to agree with this. During our time over there playing base games the NPC's certainly SEEMED to be more plentiful than other islands.

Re: I keep cry about missions

Doing industrial things on gamma means you need to supervise constantly. Its only semi-afk. Sure its way more annoying than being lazy mode alpha but I don't get how that evasive manuvering blocks the industrials from happening.

What does annoy me is that there is very minor factor of "scratch" escape from them or accumulating damage / need to retreat to repair from them. A red cloud is pretty much guaranteed to have demob and once a single one lands you are pretty much dead.

Re: I keep cry about missions

I invite anyone to mine for 30 minutes on Krazlov.  I'll even give you a termis and lets talk about how many times your interrupted.

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Re: I keep cry about missions

Ville wrote:

I invite anyone to mine for 30 minutes on Krazlov.  I'll even give you a termis and lets talk about how many times your interrupted.

About a year ago we talked about this. It gave you a huge advantage in npc-ratting. Now you're against it. Because the mission became more favorable. Then you were opposed to the change NPC. I think nothing has changed and everything should stay as it is. cool

Re: I keep cry about missions

Chemist wrote:
Ville wrote:

I invite anyone to mine for 30 minutes on Krazlov.  I'll even give you a termis and lets talk about how many times your interrupted.

About a year ago we talked about this. It gave you a huge advantage in npc-ratting. Now you're against it. Because the mission became more favorable. Then you were opposed to the change NPC. I think nothing has changed and everything should stay as it is. cool

No.  A year ago, I said cut the NPC spawns in half and less spawns.  Today I said cut the NPC spawns in half and less spawns.  Theres no need to pull a Jita and straight lie.

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41 (edited by Ensireka 2016-07-31 00:21:16)

Re: I keep cry about missions

Jita wrote:

Rolafen you don't know what you are talking about. Two people doing missions solo make more money than two doing them together in a squad. Thsi is the same for three, four and onwards. That is even before tokens where there is zero increase in squad missions.

That's stupid and needs changing.




As much as i'd love to get more tokens per assignment, giving the 'squad mates' tokens is just silly.   How many people have alts that just do NOTHING?  Oh?  Just a few?  Like almost everyone on the server ...

Now that we have that cleared ... here is the problem you people refuse to face :

With 'squad mates' getting tokens, you will just flood the market or your storage with tokens just to buy that 'next best thing' ... as usual.  Oh?  You want more beacons?  Well here is 50k tokens for that level 6 assignment!  go get em! 

Come on guys.  It needs to be balanced, but not like that.  If they did that they'd have to cut the amount of beacons down for solo assignments in accordance with the change.

I can effectively grind a whole level (as much as a grind it really is) by simply just sticking to the assignments for a day.  When i say that, I literally mean being at the pc grinding away from 4 to 5 in one sitting, 5 to 6 in another and typically 6 to almost 7 in another.  They aren't hard.  They are just ... mind numbing. 

I will say, the pay on some of the level  6's is quite pathetic with the extensions at 10 ...

They were pathetic in EvE, WoW and every other game i've ever played.  In what game have missions, quests, assignments or tasks ever been enjoyable? 

Ever played Tabula Rasa?  The npc's would take over the bases ... it was an ingenious idea.  Loved it!  Maybe we need npc's to hit saps and such ...

-Ensi

Re: I keep cry about missions

Crepitus wrote:
Inda wrote:

The current mechanic dont encourage teamplays, and squads to do missiosn together!

I just cry about it.

And just didnt mention to have to leave the squad at Beta.

PS: did I not mention the tokens?

It not only doesn't encourage team play it actively discourages it. I'm forced to leave squad every time. The rewards are kind of lackluster but since the NPC farming nerfs it's the only thing you can do on Alpha. I can make far more money mining/harvesting/artifacting on Beta/Gamma but when I'm tired after work on a week day and I don't want to have to think/worry about it that's where I'm going; back to 100% safe Alpha.

I agree with both here.

First comes squad then corp right??
It does not pay at all to run missions with more then 1 player, period.
The goals are harder and the rewards for all involved are a lot less.

I especially agree that if you do not play PVP, missions is the only thing you can do long term here in Alpha islands.

43 (edited by Annihilator 2016-07-31 11:41:28)

Re: I keep cry about missions

Ensireka wrote:

...

Ever played Tabula Rasa?  The npc's would take over the bases ... it was an ingenious idea.  Loved it!  Maybe we need npc's to hit saps and such ...

-Ensi

As former TR and also Firefall player,
you know, i have requested that for so long now... its what you call sandbox AI and living world.
its just out of reach of the current DEV team (and since the request is up for 5 years or more now, i would say, it always has been)

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Re: I keep cry about missions

the assingment pay level is calibrated by demand so there isn't really any level they could be "non-pathetic". What I have found more interesting on where are the walls between rewards. Having 1 level higher plus automatic PvP x2 gives you a non-pathetic option.

Re: I keep cry about missions

Annihilator wrote:
Ensireka wrote:

...

Ever played Tabula Rasa?  The npc's would take over the bases ... it was an ingenious idea.  Loved it!  Maybe we need npc's to hit saps and such ...

-Ensi

As former TR and also Firefall player,
you know, i have requested that for so long now... its what you call sandbox AI and living world.
its just out of reach of the current DEV team (and since the request is up for 5 years or more now, i would say, it always has been)


I miss Tabula Rasa.  wink   

I figured if a player Corp wants to hold the station(s) they should be forced to fight the npc's for control too.  Talk about adding an interesting dynamic into securing Beta Outposts.  ha ha

-Ensi

Re: I keep cry about missions

Ensireka wrote:

I figured if a player Corp wants to hold the station(s) they should be forced to fight the npc's for control too.  Talk about adding an interesting dynamic into securing Beta Outposts.  ha ha
-Ensi

Couldn't agree more, we have been suggesting dynamic content and NPC involvement in all stations except the main alpha 1 stations for a long time. There is a whole potential environment of content there just waiting to be implemented. It could even tie in to the story line. I'm just not sure if the game engine could handle it tbh. If you look at other games out there poor perp is starting to look a bit "tired", not a criticism, just an observation.

Re: I keep cry about missions

the problem with npcs involved, is the vocal minority who cannot compete with something they cannot predict.

just look at the constant complaints about roaming npcs on gamma that attack lone afk agents wink

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Re: I keep cry about missions

make good mission for squad!!!
mission squad = beta live = pvp!

Just @ Game