Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Line wrote:

Yes yes let's ruin betas!

Just think about it:
At this point, as a beta owner, you can control up to 3 stations and about 1km radius around your bot, nothing more. Probes are mostly "oh look there WAS an enemy". Gatecamping is either "meh boring" or "jump bak to alpha they are too much" SAPs are in general "i'll hit it at day you hit it at night and pray the gods of random help one of us".

Now imagine outposts ain't lockable anymore. It's more than easy to get a hour or two when your enemy isn't online and then bring 100500 bots in his beta station and then just enjoy holding them inside or popping one by one on undock. PvP will turn into endless camping. Beta mining will turn into ninja mining. Do you really need that?

Instead of, it's much better to just add more betas (to give newbies a place to settle in), remove probes at all but instead make all the teleports on beta work like a probes, or even just show some kind of "Ville jumped through Hilmanoc 1 to Heydelhorn 2 at 18:46" message with log and stuff.

I was referring to the idea about adding more gamma's. I myself am still undecided about changing beta's but I like to think I am open minded enough to at least give things a try. Considering that this is probably the best time to try different things due to the small population. If they don't work out they can always be rolled back yes?

I'd also like to think that most of the existing population would be open minded enough to try different things. I understand there are always people who are resistant to change, that's just human nature, but surely we can try different things even if they are initially on new islands ?

377

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:
Line wrote:

Yes yes let's ruin betas!

Just think about it:
At this point, as a beta owner, you can control up to 3 stations and about 1km radius around your bot, nothing more. Probes are mostly "oh look there WAS an enemy". Gatecamping is either "meh boring" or "jump bak to alpha they are too much" SAPs are in general "i'll hit it at day you hit it at night and pray the gods of random help one of us".

Now imagine outposts ain't lockable anymore. It's more than easy to get a hour or two when your enemy isn't online and then bring 100500 bots in his beta station and then just enjoy holding them inside or popping one by one on undock. PvP will turn into endless camping. Beta mining will turn into ninja mining. Do you really need that?

Instead of, it's much better to just add more betas (to give newbies a place to settle in), remove probes at all but instead make all the teleports on beta work like a probes, or even just show some kind of "Ville jumped through Hilmanoc 1 to Heydelhorn 2 at 18:46" message with log and stuff.

He don't see that Line.  He doesn't get that it'll turn into a station camping spree JUST LIKE IT WAS WHEN LOCKED STATIONS GOT ADDED.

If someone has the power to camp you in they have the power to lock you out. How is dealing with campers worse than not bieng able to access your stuff or do any industry?

Of course people will create ambushes - people can do that without station access on teleports, with login traps, using masked lights to watch. The negatives exist they are just outweighed by the positives.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Blocker wrote:

I was referring to the idea about adding more gamma's.

+1

I had a blast arty scanning on gamma 1.0 before all the gates were opened up. Game could use some more room.

379

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:
Line wrote:

Yes yes let's ruin betas!

Just think about it:
At this point, as a beta owner, you can control up to 3 stations and about 1km radius around your bot, nothing more. Probes are mostly "oh look there WAS an enemy". Gatecamping is either "meh boring" or "jump bak to alpha they are too much" SAPs are in general "i'll hit it at day you hit it at night and pray the gods of random help one of us".

Now imagine outposts ain't lockable anymore. It's more than easy to get a hour or two when your enemy isn't online and then bring 100500 bots in his beta station and then just enjoy holding them inside or popping one by one on undock. PvP will turn into endless camping. Beta mining will turn into ninja mining. Do you really need that?

Instead of, it's much better to just add more betas (to give newbies a place to settle in), remove probes at all but instead make all the teleports on beta work like a probes, or even just show some kind of "Ville jumped through Hilmanoc 1 to Heydelhorn 2 at 18:46" message with log and stuff.

He don't see that Line.  He doesn't get that it'll turn into a station camping spree JUST LIKE IT WAS WHEN LOCKED STATIONS GOT ADDED.

If someone has the power to camp you in they have the power to lock you out. How is dealing with campers worse than not bieng able to access your stuff or do any industry?

Of course people will create ambushes - people can do that without station access on teleports, with login traps, using masked lights to watch. The negatives exist they are just outweighed by the positives.

1 person in a rep fit Mesmer mk2.  Under your station.

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Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
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Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

why more gammas?
we still have 3 mostly unused Gamma islands.

even if someone would want to use them, he had to face attacking someones ghost gamma terminal every three days up to 27 days, most likely at times he usually sleeps or works.

it takes ~30 minutes to block a 6km diameter area of a gamma island for almost a month. Miss one attack phase an it starts all over.

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

381

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

I have a pet Ethos reactor I'm keeping.

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382 (edited by Blocker 2016-02-18 00:59:51)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Annihilator wrote:

why more gammas?
we still have 3 mostly unused Gamma islands.

even if someone would want to use them, he had to face attacking someones ghost gamma terminal every three days up to 27 days, most likely at times he usually sleeps or works.

it takes ~30 minutes to block a 6km diameter area of a gamma island for almost a month. Miss one attack phase an it starts all over.

Ok so maybe "gamma" is not the correct term for them, seeing as there would be no terraforming or base building on them. I guess they would be more like beta 2's but with the same value artefacts/mobs/dynamic events etc.. Would that make the idea more acceptable ?

PS: ohh and no highways

383

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:

He don't see that Line.  He doesn't get that it'll turn into a station camping spree JUST LIKE IT WAS WHEN LOCKED STATIONS GOT ADDED.

If someone has the power to camp you in they have the power to lock you out. How is dealing with campers worse than not bieng able to access your stuff or do any industry?

Of course people will create ambushes - people can do that without station access on teleports, with login traps, using masked lights to watch. The negatives exist they are just outweighed by the positives.

1 person in a rep fit Mesmer mk2.  Under your station.

If you think you can camp in even a small corp like ours with a single mesmer mk2 then please by all means try. For every ganker there is a way to gank. With PvP flags and no sparks it is not as easy as you seem to think - again I invite you to try.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Blocker wrote:

Ok so maybe "gamma" is not the correct term for them, seeing as there would be no terraforming or base building on them. I guess they would be more like beta 2's but with the same value artefacts/mobs/dynamic events etc.. Would that make the idea more acceptable ?

PS: ohh and no highways

Theta Islands

385

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:

If someone has the power to camp you in they have the power to lock you out. How is dealing with campers worse than not bieng able to access your stuff or do any industry?

Of course people will create ambushes - people can do that without station access on teleports, with login traps, using masked lights to watch. The negatives exist they are just outweighed by the positives.

1 person in a rep fit Mesmer mk2.  Under your station.

If you think you can camp in even a small corp like ours with a single mesmer mk2 then please by all means try. For every ganker there is a way to gank. With PvP flags and no sparks it is not as easy as you seem to think - again I invite you to try.

It still stops industry from happening as you get instant scouting access.  You can watch Indys undock.  Can move people around to snag stuff.  It's not about killing people under the station it's about shutting down the economy of an island.

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386

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:

1 person in a rep fit Mesmer mk2.  Under your station.

If you think you can camp in even a small corp like ours with a single mesmer mk2 then please by all means try. For every ganker there is a way to gank. With PvP flags and no sparks it is not as easy as you seem to think - again I invite you to try.

It still stops industry from happening as you get instant scouting access.  You can watch Indys undock.  Can move people around to snag stuff.  It's not about killing people under the station it's about shutting down the economy of an island.

Again conparedd with the ability to be locked out of the station its a small price to pay. No amount of scouting is worse than the possibly of getting locked out because yourbot aligned with whoever happens to be on top this week.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

387

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Well, I dont think so that is needed. I think this current situation is fine.

After spark change.

Energy to Earth!

18.01.2014. [12:57:58] <BeastmodeGuNs> after that i remembered all those warning about 1v1 you lol, and i found out why xD

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Instead of taking station locks out of the game completely, why dont we just raise the level the station needs to be at before it can be locked. Raise it to 80. Also make 1 sap go live on each island at the same time. This way it makes it even harder for one entity to control every multiple stations on multiple betas but still allows those that actually want to live in a station or on one beta to be able to still enjoy the benefits of lock out mechanisms.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Aye Pod wrote:

Instead of taking station locks out of the game completely, why dont we just raise the level the station needs to be at before it can be locked. Raise it to 80. Also make 1 sap go live on each island at the same time. This way it makes it even harder for one entity to control every multiple stations on multiple betas but still allows those that actually want to live in a station or on one beta to be able to still enjoy the benefits of lock out mechanisms.

+1

RIP PERPETUUM

390 (edited by Jita 2016-02-18 18:08:36)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Aye Pod wrote:

Instead of taking station locks out of the game completely, why dont we just raise the level the station needs to be at before it can be locked. Raise it to 80. Also make 1 sap go live on each island at the same time. This way it makes it even harder for one entity to control every multiple stations on multiple betas but still allows those that actually want to live in a station or on one beta to be able to still enjoy the benefits of lock out mechanisms.

That actually makes some sense.

+1

Perhaps leave it as it is on Beta 2’s but change on Beta 1’s?

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

391

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Aye Pod wrote:

Instead of taking station locks out of the game completely, why dont we just raise the level the station needs to be at before it can be locked. Raise it to 80. Also make 1 sap go live on each island at the same time. This way it makes it even harder for one entity to control every multiple stations on multiple betas but still allows those that actually want to live in a station or on one beta to be able to still enjoy the benefits of lock out mechanisms.

+1

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Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

дебилы бля -1

393

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

-1

With current mechanics it's already easy enough to open up the outpost. No need to easy atackers life even more.

Have a productive day, runner!
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Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

2 Aye Pod, Celebro, Jita, Ville

So you allow making single specimen sap when your enemy cant response for this aggression and getting access to base? Take your hands out of this. Stop try invert game mechanics in way that you wish see in in current situation. From all years of pp i am tide from that.

-1

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Again whining of our opponents? Again, they want to simplify your life? Over the 4 years that I play, they are constantly changing the rules of the game under him... Fie!

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

ShowBlink wrote:

дебилы бля -1

(с) Mr. Lavrov. lol

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Quelaag wrote:

2 Aye Pod, Celebro, Jita, Ville

So you allow making single specimen sap when your enemy cant response for this aggression and getting access to base? Take your hands out of this. Stop try invert game mechanics in way that you wish see in in current situation. From all years of pp i am tide from that.

-1

This isnt political nor reflective of the current state of the game. If you dont want one entity to control everything again this is a logical first step.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

2 Aye Pod

Where i say that this is political? I dont. Ill repeat my question. So you wish allow making single specimen sap when your enemy cant response for this aggression and getting access to base?

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Quelaag wrote:

2 Aye Pod

Where i say that this is political? I dont. Ill repeat my question. So you wish allow making single specimen sap when your enemy cant response for this aggression and getting access to base?


Even if the enemy does 1 specimen sap while you are sleeping. Any one sap done again by you will lock the station.
Did you like it when PoE controlled all the betas? Would you support no station locking at all?

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Aye Pod wrote:
Quelaag wrote:

2 Aye Pod

Where i say that this is political? I dont. Ill repeat my question. So you wish allow making single specimen sap when your enemy cant response for this aggression and getting access to base?


Even if the enemy does 1 specimen sap while you are sleeping. Any one sap done again by you will lock the station.
Did you like it when PoE controlled all the betas? Would you support no station locking at all?

Now you start speech about politics? Funny. I am not understand what you wish? Making attack side more powerful than defence? You start think about that when "PoE start controlled all the betas"?

Whats will be if attacker will making single sap and will get access into it. They will allow them place spies into terminal. Get defence forces numbers on next sap. Bring tanked close range fitted mechs and break enemy's current meta. From all of that i see that you wish not to fight. Your looking easy kills for your self.