Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Burial wrote:

I think the big issue is they do full deck balancing changes and then throw it aside for years to come. They need to either balance by small tweaks only, or be prepared to do small tweaks along the way since it's impossible to get it right the first time.


So please remember this when you and any of the other forum babies start crying that the sky is falling when things arent going your way.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Syndic wrote:

Dev Alf can put these ideas in the game tomorrow, 3 months down the line he will have to come up with similar ideas about Ictus mk2. 3 months down the line, similar ideas about remote-repair. 3 months down the line, similar ideas about Heavy mk2. Then 3 months down the line, nobody will be using mk2 anymore.

And then after all the complexity and multi-layered countering systems are stripped down to bare-bones, we'll be down to who can get the most accounts actively targetting and shooting while mining at the same time on another screen.

And then it becomes a war of attrition ala WW1.

Bottom line is the game balance is a very complex system of what counters what and how. You can't go in with a sledgehammer, smash a few EWar changes around, and not expect every other factor previously held in check to suddenly become overpowered.

And at the end of the day 2>1, always.

The only ones getting shafted here are the newbies who will be useless for 6 months instead of 1-2. Vets have enough accounts, assets and EP to swap things around.

"Told you so"

303

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Again a post from an ewar thread made by the devs that wasn't even implemented. Nothing to do with balance.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

From that forum campaign conducted by 2-3 people, the Devs got the idea for changes that murdered EWar and EnWar, which brought us this current balance.

And then like I said then, instead of 5-10 Vagabond mk2's, 5-10 Zenith mk2's, 5-8 Ictus mk2's and 5-6 Mesmer mk2's we put 20 Seth Mk2's with 10 RR Riveler Mk2's on the field.

"And at the end of the day 2>1, always."

"Told you so"

305

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

People don't do forum campaigns ***, they speak passionayly about stuff they believe in.

Ewar is still overpowered. When any bot in the game can permajam an unhardened heavy with three modules *** is broken.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

306

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:

People don't do forum campaigns ***, they speak passionayly about stuff they believe in.

Ewar is still overpowered. When any bot in the game can permajam an unhardened heavy with three modules *** is broken.

Wrong again.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Let's stop derailing the thread any further and get back to Open Station initiative. Here's what Zoom offered:

Jita wrote:

DEV Zoom edit:

So this topic has become more than what it started as.

To recap, the current options for what we can do are (in order of preference as it seems to me):

  • Add 1 or possibly 2 new public main terminals to beta2 islands.

  • Open up beta2 outposts, leave beta1s as they are.

  • Both of the above.

  • Open up beta1 outposts.

  • Do nothing.

308 (edited by Martin Luther King 2015-10-04 09:09:17)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Burial wrote:

Let's stop derailing the thread any further and get back to Open Station initiative. Here's what Zoom offered:

Jita wrote:

DEV Zoom edit:

So this topic has become more than what it started as.

To recap, the current options for what we can do are (in order of preference as it seems to me):

  • Add 1 or possibly 2 new public main terminals to beta2 islands.

  • Open up beta2 outposts, leave beta1s as they are.

  • Both of the above.

  • Open up beta1 outposts.

  • Do nothing.

It's dumb ideas like this, that hold back humanity.

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair, I say to you today, my friends.
I have a dream that one day every valley shall be exalted, and every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight; "and the glory of the Nians shall be revealed and all flesh shall see it together."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

now, you have to resort to alts for your arguments?

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:

DEV Zoom edit:

So this topic has become more than what it started as.

To recap, the current options for what JOKE can do are (in order of preference as it seems to me):

  • Add 1 or possibly 2 new posts in every forum thread so people will think the community thinks opening stations will do anything more then allow joke to play station games.

  • Open up 2 threads pretending joke really plays this game and will come make the game great if they get their way.

  • Both of the above.

  • Open up a debate that has only options joke likes and pretend all other voices are wrong.

  • Do nothing.

Fixed it for you big_smile

311 (edited by Naismith 2015-10-04 19:15:16)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Altera is my new hero.

Close this thread TBH.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Annihilator wrote:

now, you have to resort to alts for your arguments?

The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy.

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair, I say to you today, my friends.
I have a dream that one day every valley shall be exalted, and every hill and mountain shall be made low, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight; "and the glory of the Nians shall be revealed and all flesh shall see it together."

313

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

So five months in and the game is still dead.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:

So five months in and the game is still dead.

This game started back in 2010 with unlocked outposts, never heard or read anywhere whining about that. Oh, and player base was increasing not falling.

RIP PERPETUUM

315

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Celebro wrote:
Jita wrote:

So five months in and the game is still dead.

This game started back in 2010 with unlocked outposts, never heard or read anywhere whining about that. Oh, and player base was increasing not falling.

You must be *** then. People from multiple corps were BEGGING for gaining more control over the outposts, like docking rights feature, because the griefing and free scouting with unlockable outposts were already too much at that point.

You are arguing in favor of one of the most ridiculous things ever. On the other hand, you are clearly desperate for a feature like this to be able to grief and scout for free from inside and under the outposts, so I see where politically you are coming from.

It's good that it will never be implemented.

I believe pvp could be very exciting and the game has what it takes. But this is game is ruined and we all know  by who, it´s by corps like CiR, -77- and PHM. - by Fu ManChu

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Naismith wrote:

Bumping this post to create the illusion that ANYONE besides Jita, Burial and their corp wants even more unlocked stations besides 3 NPC terminals, is pathetic and transparent.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Weedy wrote:
Celebro wrote:
Jita wrote:

So five months in and the game is still dead.

This game started back in 2010 with unlocked outposts, never heard or read anywhere whining about that. Oh, and player base was increasing not falling.


Griefing and free scouting with unlockable outposts were already too much at that point.

This is where we differ greatly what you call griefing, I call content that is missing. Anyhow it can be avoided if players stopped hugging outposts and had a well defended island. You seem to want to live of the safety in beta of locked content that can help the game grow and promoting more small scale pvp.

The status quo favors the entities with the larger player base at any given point in time as described from this blog extract pre-Intrustion 2.0 by Zoom; (explaining how intrusion 2.0 will fix the issue, but really has only improved it a little.)

The intrusion system is in no way a reflection of who actually controls a location. It is instead a reflection of who can bring the most power to bear at a random time. This is problematic because a) it discourages exploration and utilization of betas in general, b) it does not reflect the “truth” of who is in a particular area, and c) by encouraging superalliances, we’re essentially excluding small parties from taking and using remote locations successfully - cutting off part of the playerbase

RIP PERPETUUM

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Naismith wrote:

Bumping this post to create the illusion that ANYONE besides Jita, Burial and their corp wants even more unlocked stations besides 3 NPC terminals, is pathetic and transparent.

319

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:

So five months in and the game is still dead.

Its not. You should come and check it LOL.

Energy to Earth!

18.01.2014. [12:57:58] <BeastmodeGuNs> after that i remembered all those warning about 1v1 you lol, and i found out why xD

320

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

What happened to these well thought out ideas? Half through the thread it seemed Dev Zoom would be leaning towards a change. Yet nothing happened at all.
The opening of either beta I or II outposts would add diversity to a now uniform beta mechanic. People enjoying their kool kids klub outposts locked for everyone not being part of the kool kids klub could do so in the future while the rest might have fun at opened outposts.
To soften the shock for current owners, the bonus to performances for high stability outposts could be increased or every non outpost owner using the outpost could receive a temporary malus/debuff for his robot when undocking. Like decreased sensor strength or increased locking time to give the owner an edge in conflicts happening around the outpost.
Perpetuum's land mass is alreay too small - we should use the existing areas as best as possible. Beta II fails horrible at that. The amount of fights and kills happening on beta I compared to beta II speaks volumes about activity on beta II. I'm sure this can be extrapolated to most other activities as well (with the exception of undisturbed mining maybe).

321

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

No.  Just look what happened yesterday.  There's a mining op happening beside TMB.  I dropped out of station with 100% protection and you guys stopped the mining op over a sequer..  Same thing will happen everywhere.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

322

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:

No.  Just look what happened yesterday.  There's a mining op happening beside TMB.  I dropped out of station with 100% protection and you guys stopped the mining op over a sequer..  Same thing will happen everywhere.

Exactly why. More versions of TMB are needed, the larger the number of locations, the harder it is to effectively camp.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

323

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

if it happens at one terminal it'll happen at the other three.  At this point I have enough alts to be in ALL the stations in game plus gamma.

Steam achievement Unlocked:  Being a Badass
http://www.perp-kill.net/kill/239407
Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Tldr - dev focus on beta and changing business model has been great, keep it up.

Honestly gamma needs a decent population to be effective. That's why the devs removed it in the first place. Gamma was introduced when devs thought they were balanced for a low population.

Majority of population thinks gamma is underpowered and only use it for fights/content. Production is definitely at an advantage but from what I Remer reading is that the difference between beta and gamma for a maxed out industrial was less than 10%.  I don't think 10% production alone is worth the investment in a gamma base even if it is 99% secure from siege.

If gamma isn't going to have the population or balance to be effective content then I would like to see devs put more time into developing betas, ie missions Tele rework field terms etc. Those have definitely had direct and positive impact on content and activity. The new ep packages are perfect to attract new and old player to enjoy said content.

Keep it up devs, all I ask is keep the focus you have had because it's paying off based on everyone telling me how they bought new accounts and ep packages for all their current accounts lol

325

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:

if it happens at one terminal it'll happen at the other three.  At this point I have enough alts to be in ALL the stations in game plus gamma.

It's a small population problem. No entity in game has the ability to have a five person fleet in six locations while maintaining a gamma base.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."