b) People who mine for NIC (new miners do this yes) will see lower prices with mining speed increased therefore to get the same amount of value out of it they would need to mine for the same time. Once we reach an extraction speed, it then becomes  'hauling online' where new players with Sequers might have issues ie tedious hauling. Not saying it can't be done, it's just that some aspects might be overlooked.

a) I don' mind that as long as it is pvp area only, then again it should really be like 10 times slower than normal mining if not the profession will be destroyed.

Ludlow, have you tried mining titan recently?

Fannyhilator, have you tried mining titan with 2+ accounts in T4 Riveler Mk2's recently?

We're talking about hours and hours of mining here, hotswapping targets very frequently. Note that we're doing it in more or less maxxed pilots, in Riveler Mk2s.

Here's my conundrum - How long does it take to mine a quantity of Titan (a common, basic ore) that is "relevant" for the purposes of producing something?

Meaning, how long does it take for a newbie that just got started to mine a quantity of Titan that would get him anywhere? NIC-wise, a newbie would be better off doing missions?

What if a new corp forms in the game, how long do they have to mine in un-maxxed termises and rivelers to get enough Titan to produce something for their corp? And thats if theyre completely communist pooling everything?

I don't see how newbies can exist in the game without either:
- Depending on Veterans selling stuff on the market (for jew prices usually)
- Trying to mine it themselves (in arganos, termises, and generally low EP accounts)

Either way any newbie corp that comes into the game has NO CHANCE whatsoever of accumulating enough resources to get anywhere before investing at least 3 months (!) just into mining enough ore to start producing something at horrible refine yields.

Thats why I proposed the following:

a) Deployable mining towers that need to be fueled/emptied by player, can be plundered or destroyed by other players

Why?

- Because then players could spam some mining towers up instead of having to buy 6 accounts and dedicate them to mining then go insane with the amount of tile-swapping per second.
- Because players could use mining towers to supplement their active mining.
- Because other players could stumble upon mining towers and loot them.
- Because looting them would flag you for PVP, creating light-PVP content on Alpha.
- Because it would create a demand for mining towers and fuel that other players could produce and put up on the market.
- Because players who don't enjoy mining could mine and have fun at the same time.

b) Be much faster - instead of taking 4-5 hours to drain a field, it should take ~30 minutes tops to clear a field.

Why?

- Amount of ore per tile is too low and needs to be significantly bumped up to speed up the process.
- Denser fields would speed up the process even more.
- It's imperative to consider how fast an average NEWBIE mines when considering mineral balance, rather then balancing everything on Riveler Mk2's.

mining for what?
producing for what?

after 4 years i'm still using the same t4 fit riveler mk2, symbiont mk2 and on my combat acc the same seth mk2 with almost unchanged equipment.
I don't even have enough industrial tunings to fit both industrial gather bots at the same time.

as for alpha dweller, there is nothing to produce, since anything below T4 is meaningless and costs even me more to build then to just buy the T4 module from the market.

there is nothing ingame that removed minerals as fast as you gather them. with a few bits of titan ore you can build lots of stuff... just not max tier, since its exponentially more expensive.

If it's about newbies, I don't see how mining towers that you need to defend help them. Aside from destroying a whole profession. Take it the way you want, 24/7 extraction with complete automation for miner's competing resources, players who enjoy mining will get the short end of the stick.

For those who don't like mining titan; although a PITA, there is market buy orders, if the price is right people will sell.

Mining towers would need to be fueled, defended and there would be risk of the ore getting stolen. 24/7 extraction would not work.

24/7 extraction of liquizit and HDT however, with Scarab Mk2's is ongoing for 6+ months now. Did it destroy the whole mining profession?

My experience says this bug is fixed, but my experience is only valid for a few 10s mining hours the last 4 weeks, so your experience might differ.

Haven't seen this bug since they patched it.

Anni I know what you mean, but the only reason why the Titan seems to be less worth, is because under some circumstances you can earn far more. And the problem with your example is that a miner will never pay more for his mining charges, than he receive for selling titan.

At a price of 0.5NIC/Titan a newbie in Riv with T4 equip but no EP spend in mining beside the minimum to equip bot earns 3-4 MNIC/h. That number is easy extended towards 5MNIC/h with only few days EP spend on the mining extensions.
I consider this not dumping, but back to your example, if every farmer would earn 5$/liter milk but still10 times the amount for selling cakes instead of selling milk, yes the amount of farmers selling milk would drop and they would complain, that they earn not enough for their milk. In that case it is fault of the farmer expecting to earn that much.

And that a experienced miner earns 8-10MNIC/h does by no means, that newbies cannot have a decent living with mining.

I just want to throw this out there.  I've been using 4 scarabs mining liquizit for the past three weeks non stop bouncing from spot to spot.  With that many scarabs I've managed to mine close to 200 million pieces of liquizit.  This does not include PLs.  I've actually had more fun not playing the game in the past 3 weeks while raking in one mineral I don't have billions of stock in.  Now to the point,  the reason there is this talk about about making it faster for a newbie to extract ore is to lessen the gap between say new Corp A and CIR by catching them up in the tangible aspect of infinite supplys.  Your never going back to out build someone who had access and took advantage of beacons 1.0.  Take STC for example and the extreme amounts of stuff they generated if only it wasn't locked on Tux account hiding somewhere.  You could fuel a war non stop for months.  That's what new players are facing and since we aren't wiping the server it's only logical if you want to bridge the gap you increase the yield of all players.  To lessen the impact of the "infinite" machine?  Make sense?  The only counter is that the infinite machine can mine more.  Well yeah but it already an infinite machine... See my point?

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