Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

slightly off topic but, Is the autopilot defaulting to HWYs where it can ?

No, it doesn't know about highways.

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

DEV Zoom wrote:
Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

slightly off topic but, Is the autopilot defaulting to HWYs where it can ?

No, it doesn't know about highways.

ok then im just getting really lucky then lol

True Pros make a Podcast to influence the Devs minds, 
The rest of you guys are Hacks tongue

PS. I got my Highways & stopped playing b4 they came in & have never used them! ...... Irony much ? tongue

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

They have slightly adjusted the highways to be on the fastest route plan.

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Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Yeah im really liking how Alpha 1 is setup  with tp & hwy's

True Pros make a Podcast to influence the Devs minds, 
The rest of you guys are Hacks tongue

PS. I got my Highways & stopped playing b4 they came in & have never used them! ...... Irony much ? tongue

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

All these changes you guys are talking about keep increasing the risk of using BEta and thus will lower the usage.  Please start talking about how we can increase the REWARD of being on BETA.....we need to make it more worthwhile being out there.

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

SunnyJester wrote:

All these changes you guys are talking about keep increasing the risk of using BEta and thus will lower the usage.  Please start talking about how we can increase the REWARD of being on BETA.....we need to make it more worthwhile being out there.

+9000+

Energy to Earth!

18.01.2014. [12:57:58] <BeastmodeGuNs> after that i remembered all those warning about 1v1 you lol, and i found out why xD

32 (edited by Obi Wan Kenobi 2015-07-24 14:17:22)

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Been having a think about Beta transport networks.

here some thought ive been having.
What follows is assuming the current base speed of mechs in game is going to stay for good.

Telleports:

  • Pro - Provide a good way to traverse large distances in a  very short time.  making it easier to live on the

  • Island & move around it

  • Con - the beinift of moving large distances very fast can also be used by your enemy

  • Con - limited access. Tp can only be used at 2 points.

HWYs

  • Con - Takes longer to traverse larger distances making it slower to move around your home island

  • Pro - enemies cant jump from 1 side of the island to another on a HWY.

  • Pro - HWYs can be used at any point along their path. (unlike TPs)

  • pro & Con - HWYs be have more tactical options for attackers & defenders.

Now lets make some reasonable assumption on some numbers to get an approx base line (bare with me)
Have a look at travel time across an island. Lets assume at worst to walk between 15km - 20km
(no TP or HWYS)
Hauler 90km ish? 10mins - 13.3mins
Mech 120km/h? 7.5mins - 10mins walking time
Ewar 160km 5.5mins - 7.5mins

Now why I ask you to consider the above is, How quickly do you want to enable people to traverse an island?
Tps could cut those travel time in half or more depending on on location on island.
HWYs give a boost in speed but dont enable that travel over a large area.
On A PVP island you dont want as some one earlier said to enable easy fast access to every part of the island.

In light of that heres maybe a radical idea... Have no internal Telleports on Beta islands. But use HWYs to facilitate limited movement boost around an island.

If thats a little to steep tho why not limited to 2 connected TPs say spanning from 1 end of the island to the other, leaving the middle untouched by a TP network?

Just a thought smile

True Pros make a Podcast to influence the Devs minds, 
The rest of you guys are Hacks tongue

PS. I got my Highways & stopped playing b4 they came in & have never used them! ...... Irony much ? tongue

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

In light of that heres maybe a radical idea... Have no internal Telleports on Beta islands. But use HWYs to facilitate limited movement boost around an island.

tbh I like that idea

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

DEV Zoom wrote:
Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

In light of that heres maybe a radical idea... Have no internal Telleports on Beta islands. But use HWYs to facilitate limited movement boost around an island.

tbh I like that idea

egh..  From a logistics standpoint I don't like that Idea. 

Why?  You know where people are going to be looking only on the highways for haulers/people.  Also the less places you have to interzone into is bad.  Because I can probe all the out gates.

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Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Industrials getting ganked argument is kind of moot in my opinion. They shouldn't be around much anyway without an escort, or at least acknowledge the risk of getting ganked if they choose to be. Gearing the game towards unescorted industrials not getting ganked in a PVP area is the wrong way to go.

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Burial wrote:

Industrials getting ganked argument is kind of moot in my opinion. They shouldn't be around much anyway without an escort, or at least acknowledge the risk of getting ganked if they choose to be. Gearing the game towards unescorted industrials not getting ganked in a PVP area is the wrong way to go.

I am not only pointing out industrials, I am just saying in the grand scheme of things your going to have 2~4 entrances to a terminal?  How hard would it be to setup in the middle put a masked scout on each of the highways and just login when you need them,  In a sense your creating a choke point.  I don't care but I do like not getting scouted 100% of the time when I roam Beta.

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37 (edited by DEV Zoom 2015-07-24 19:24:46)

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Burial wrote:

Industrials getting ganked argument is kind of moot in my opinion. They shouldn't be around much anyway without an escort, or at least acknowledge the risk of getting ganked if they choose to be. Gearing the game towards unescorted industrials not getting ganked in a PVP area is the wrong way to go.

Agreed.

edit: so don't use the highways if you want to ninja it solo.

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

industrialls going OFF an island will use a mobile teleport
industrials moving towards an outpost will use instant mission teleport that they have prepared
industrials moving from alpha to beta will be spoted by the alpha side gatescout anyway

industrials beeing unable to contribute to their own defense as beeing part of the "gank" issue wont be solved by any of the above suggestions

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Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Ville wrote:
DEV Zoom wrote:
Obi Wan Kenobi wrote:

In light of that heres maybe a radical idea... Have no internal Telleports on Beta islands. But use HWYs to facilitate limited movement boost around an island.

tbh I like that idea

egh..  From a logistics standpoint I don't like that Idea. 

Why?  You know where people are going to be looking only on the highways for haulers/people.  Also the less places you have to interzone into is bad.  Because I can probe all the out gates.

First off Interzones.

You can still leave 1 or 2 unconnected TPs around an island like we currently have. Call them broken telleports or w/e lol

Second.
Logistics isn't actually made harder.  It all depends on the HWY layout but travel times could actually be about the same in alot of situations. 

Third.
Some areas yes will be harder to get to & some outposts will be more isolated. But on a PVP island I don't see that as always being a disadvantage. Particularly if you want to mission grind, artifact, mine.




Ville wrote:
Burial wrote:

Industrials getting ganked argument is kind of moot in my opinion. They shouldn't be around much anyway without an escort, or at least acknowledge the risk of getting ganked if they choose to be. Gearing the game towards unescorted industrials not getting ganked in a PVP area is the wrong way to go.

I am not only pointing out industrials, I am just saying in the grand scheme of things your going to have 2~4 entrances to a terminal?  How hard would it be to setup in the middle put a masked scout on each of the highways and just login when you need them,  In a sense your creating a choke point.  I don't care but I do like not getting scouted 100% of the time when I roam Beta.

You can do the exact same thing with TPs, in fact its even easier with those as you can only access them at fixed points.

Yes you can put a detector at the start of HWYs. but the funny thing with HWYs is they have distance. 1 or 2 detectors will not cover the length of a HWY.

And HWYs can be accessed at any point

On top of that detectors have the risk of being found & killed & since they are not on a TP well they cant just do TP games to get away.

And Last HWYs can benefit industrial / PVE operations. by providing some convenience to moving around an island. Given how ore spawns move around an idland, missions locations change, and static NPCs we be removed,
Fixed TP become a little less useful as they have a higher chance of leading to no where. 
HWY provides better access to dynamic content.

But HWY placement is super important. you want enough of them to be useful to those who live on the island But not to many Kms of HWYs that enemy have easy access to your whole island.

True Pros make a Podcast to influence the Devs minds, 
The rest of you guys are Hacks tongue

PS. I got my Highways & stopped playing b4 they came in & have never used them! ...... Irony much ? tongue

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

I'm a bit late with this due to all the crap happenning, but let's get back to talking about beta.

Here is what I had in mind:
http://content.perpetuum-online.com/ima … etwork.png

It's dirty photoshop for now, but if you like it I can employ similar stuff on the other islands regarding connectivity, teleport distance from outposts, highway amount, and so on.

41 (edited by Naismith 2015-08-19 17:33:28)

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

It looks good, personally I'd make a larger distance between Alpha TP's and Beta 2/Gamma TP's simply to avoid too much undemobbable island-hopping from Alpha safety, but overall it looks good and I like what you're doing with internal teleports there.

What do you think about cutting Beta 2 connection with Alpha 2?

EDIT:

Abbuthilia is a little bit too close to an Alpha teleport for comfort, I personally wouldn't live in an outpost that close to a non-PVP zone where randoms can practically camp my outpost from Alpha. It would be very hard for a corporation to live there.

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Naismith wrote:

What do you think about cutting Beta 2 connection with Alpha 2?

With this layout it could be considered as it wouldn't increase walking times to Beta2 too much. In that case we could split the Alpha2-Beta1 1to3 teleports into a 1to2 and a 1to1. However that would reduce entry points on Beta2s which doesn't help camping.


Btw feel free to get out the crayons and draw your suggestions on it.

43 (edited by Annihilator 2015-08-19 18:22:33)

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

that internal connection seems to be redundant.

if you put up a highway there: http://imgur.com/xp8T5kE

(i wished i had sketchbook design at home to draw finer lines than zoom big_smile)

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Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

It's not redundant because highways still take much more time to create than teleport lines smile

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

why is that?

would the gamma highways system take to much server power?
because not using it lowers your possibilities for dynamic world missions (repair beta/alpha highway nodes) or even for player to slow hostiles down by neuting the higways, or giving outpost owners the option to buy "shut down highway in the outpost related sector for XY tokens"

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Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Personally, I like Anni's idea more.

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47 (edited by Annihilator 2015-08-19 19:29:35)

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Ville wrote:

Personally, I like Anni's idea more.

which one - the pictured highway connection, or the post afterwards?

edit:
additionally to my idea of using the gamma highway system on alpha and beta: you have to place the decorational buildings either way.

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Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

I meant creation time, not server resources. You know like terraforming, placing all the buildings, creating collision, drawing the highways, and so on. So in this sense it was a time efficiency vs gains decision.

edit: Ok, you mean using gamma highways on alpha/beta. That's an entirely new can of worms...

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

just that we understand each others: you are placing indestructible highway nodes to draw the highways, and LATER you expand on THAT with more features.

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50 (edited by Ville 2015-08-19 21:47:16)

Re: Teleportgrid / Highways

Before we go any further.  Please do something right,  "BALANCE" the distances between EACH outpost and each jump.

I know it's extra work for you Zoom, and I am sorry but don't screw this part up.

Look at the distances in this Screenshot

http://i.imgur.com/fTWd2fD.png

Now which outpost is going to be not used.

1.  Your alpha connection to Beta outposts need to be the Same distance.  Use an arbitrary number and use it for ALL the islands.  Say from alpha to beta outpost that distance is 3500 M.  Then we take and all alpha incoming teleports should be exactly 3500 M away from their counter parts.  So on Beta 1s you will have 4 alpha connections (AND FOR THE LOVE OF GOD USE DIFFERENT TELEPORTERS.) and Beta 2s will have 3 connections(once you add the npc main terminals)

2.  Gamma connections should be the same distance away from alpha teleports as the outposts(make things fair).

3.  You need to have  beta to beta jumps on the opposite sides of the islands.  1 of each.  (Anti Blob mechanic)  And their repective counter parts on Beta 2 islands, so there is 5 ~ 6 entrances into beta.  This will allow more entry points, reduced probe functions and add for a more fluid design. 

3.  There needs to be a highway that connects all the terminals together.  I'm not a fan of internal teleports. 

I'm sorry Zoom I know its much more work, but honestly if it's all balanced the "same" you could actually achieve your goal of seeing multiple factions on one island.

Edit:  Curves do not look pretty on the radar, if you have the option to make something straight do it.  It's cleaner and crisper.  Because I am going to be the one staring at these islands for hours on end.  And stuff like the connection from the beta terminal to nauwy to the outbound TP drive me crazy.  Aesthetics.

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