Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:
SunnyJester wrote:
Jita wrote:

Fully agree tbh. Most of that isn't too far away from development time either. Unlock beta 1 and get working on this please

I agree with all but #1.  All #1 does is encourage multi corp alliances like 133/77/PHM/CIR etc or creation of shell corporations.

yeah that was my thought to with shell corporations but tbh its not a bad idea having the mechanic anyway, some restriction is better than no restriction imo

True

PS.  TBH I am enjoying the lack of trolling and constructive feedback that this thread is providing by all sides, please continue working together so we can make this game move forward.  Bravo guys and gals.....

152

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

SunnyJester wrote:
Jita wrote:
SunnyJester wrote:

I agree with all but #1.  All #1 does is encourage multi corp alliances like 133/77/PHM/CIR etc or creation of shell corporations.

yeah that was my thought to with shell corporations but tbh its not a bad idea having the mechanic anyway, some restriction is better than no restriction imo

True

PS.  TBH I am enjoying the lack of trolling and constructive feedback that this thread is providing by all sides, please continue working together so we can make this game move forward.  Bravo guys and gals.....

We all want the same thing.  A better game, the status quo is not working; however, I believe station locks will only hinder new entities not provide emergent gameplay.

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Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
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Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:

So..  I just had this crazy thought since we are onto missions now, what happens when everything turns into roaming mobs and your trying to do a L5 combat and roaming mobs roll up on you?

You get effed up hard....it happened to me on alpha 2, farming static orange spawns and got add from the roaming ORANGE pack.......this is why you have to hugely increase beta drops as the risks are so huge out there, not even taking PvP into account.

154 (edited by SunnyJester 2015-07-21 22:22:29)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:
SunnyJester wrote:
Jita wrote:

yeah that was my thought to with shell corporations but tbh its not a bad idea having the mechanic anyway, some restriction is better than no restriction imo

True

PS.  TBH I am enjoying the lack of trolling and constructive feedback that this thread is providing by all sides, please continue working together so we can make this game move forward.  Bravo guys and gals.....

We all want the same thing.  A better game, the status quo is not working; however, I believe station locks will only hinder new entities not provide emergent gameplay.

Yeah station locks should be optional at 70% and higher with bonuses to those who choose to NOT lock their stations.  Also, if it is optional, make a 24 hour period that would be required to turn them on ( a lock down timer of sorts) so people have the ability to remove assets before being locked out.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Has Avatar ever explored raising station stabilities to like 500?  Increasing the rewards for SAP and station bonuses along the way?  100 is very easy to obtain imho, and gives something for a corp to achieve especially if they can only have 1 station per island.......

156

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

How much longer til this Open Station patch hits so i know when im going to take a break from this game?

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Dear Dev Zoom,

Please listen to Ville's idea and consider the potential that players can help out in designing new islands and assets, particularly given the fact that most vets around here used to terraform islands as part of their gameplay and they obviously liked it.

While I do not particularly believe that station unlocks would result in a mass exodus from Alpha to Beta Islands, I think it's a good idea to put in NPC stations just like beta 1 and see what happens. In such case I think 2 stations are ideal and I would go as far as say they should be reasonably close to each other so as to lessen the problems with station games.

I believe that as some people said, firstly it is a problem of population (which you just need to advertise etc) and secondly it is a problem of a small game world (spark teleports - few islands - small islands, easy to set scout eyes etc..) Please remember that Eve has hundreds of constellations and traveling the universe from one edge to the other takes hours. I remembering riding in darkfall and it took like 5 1/2 hours in real time to ride from one end to the other. A large game world would give opportunities for groups of players to find their own corner sort to speak. It also helps with regionalisation, be it resources, trade, market etc. As it stands now, I can be in Shinjalar or hershfield in a matter of 20 mins tops? 10 seconds with sparks.

My solution is perhaps a bit out of the box, as it would need to create smething like this:

http://i.imgur.com/rZSnAst.jpg

You will have a very large island like twice as large as gammas or perhaps larger.
Divided geographically into 3 main sections (where role wise the factions all wanted to set a foothold on the new territory)
You will have 6 NPC stations, and one very large in the center (like 3X the size of tellesis station)
While GAMMA islands are all about production, base building, Fortress fighting, nora farming, artifact hunting - this central DELTA island will be all about the Ultimate NPC hunting, so you will have:
- NPCS that drop tons of plasma,
- Small groups of T5 npcs like 2 or 3 max that a solo player can take them
- All npcs roaming so you are constantly on the move.
- Best mission rewards from npc stations.
- Same pvp ruleset like BETA
- Ability for people to put up few buildings like gamma like just small towers for example (open to discussion)
- Some terminals sprinkled all over the map so players can 'bank' their spoils while pveing but cannot dock inside for safety should pvp occur.

- Anton

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

the question, whats so hard on the map editor?

its a frigging greyscale hightmap with procedural textures. make a shader for the slope limits that works in z-Brush, mudbox and whatever other sculpting software!

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Annihilator wrote:

the question, whats so hard on the map editor?

its a frigging greyscale hightmap with procedural textures. make a shader for the slope limits that works in z-Brush, mudbox and whatever other sculpting software!

Well if someone wants to draw a map from scratch without seeing it in game while doing it, go ahead. 2048*2048 16 bits/channel grayscale image. Can be imported easily. The only problem might be with the scaling, because we're not using the entire 16bit spectrum for the islands, a full white pixel would be a really really really tall mountain.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

mostly to things are necessary -
a size reference for bots, and two shaders that work in the sculpting software for the terrain texture and the passable slope limits.

the other thing i never understood is - you are using 1 pixel = 1 tile (or to be more precise, every pixel represents a vertex of a ground tile. The engine lowers the terrain detail at distance (LoD) dynamically,
but you never implemented something to interpolate the ground mesh into a higher resolution (like sub-surface-division)

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
Whining - It's amazing how fast your trivial concerns will disappear

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Toninu wrote:

Dear Dev Zoom,

Please listen to Ville's idea and consider the potential that players can help out in designing new islands and assets, particularly given the fact that most vets around here used to terraform islands as part of their gameplay and they obviously liked it.

While I do not particularly believe that station unlocks would result in a mass exodus from Alpha to Beta Islands, I think it's a good idea to put in NPC stations just like beta 1 and see what happens. In such case I think 2 stations are ideal and I would go as far as say they should be reasonably close to each other so as to lessen the problems with station games.

I believe that as some people said, firstly it is a problem of population (which you just need to advertise etc) and secondly it is a problem of a small game world (spark teleports - few islands - small islands, easy to set scout eyes etc..) Please remember that Eve has hundreds of constellations and traveling the universe from one edge to the other takes hours. I remembering riding in darkfall and it took like 5 1/2 hours in real time to ride from one end to the other. A large game world would give opportunities for groups of players to find their own corner sort to speak. It also helps with regionalisation, be it resources, trade, market etc. As it stands now, I can be in Shinjalar or hershfield in a matter of 20 mins tops? 10 seconds with sparks.

My solution is perhaps a bit out of the box, as it would need to create smething like this:

http://i.imgur.com/rZSnAst.jpg

You will have a very large island like twice as large as gammas or perhaps larger.
Divided geographically into 3 main sections (where role wise the factions all wanted to set a foothold on the new territory)
You will have 6 NPC stations, and one very large in the center (like 3X the size of tellesis station)
While GAMMA islands are all about production, base building, Fortress fighting, nora farming, artifact hunting - this central DELTA island will be all about the Ultimate NPC hunting, so you will have:
- NPCS that drop tons of plasma,
- Small groups of T5 npcs like 2 or 3 max that a solo player can take them
- All npcs roaming so you are constantly on the move.
- Best mission rewards from npc stations.
- Same pvp ruleset like BETA
- Ability for people to put up few buildings like gamma like just small towers for example (open to discussion)
- Some terminals sprinkled all over the map so players can 'bank' their spoils while pveing but cannot dock inside for safety should pvp occur.

- Anton

You have some good ideas but this should be posted in a seperate topic.  This thread is all about changing the viability of Betas.

162 (edited by Smokeyii 2015-07-22 02:42:17)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:

Why does this thread sound like "We told you so if other PoE members show up to assist in having a good time and engage the community in content."?

Unlocking stations will do the following:

1.  Alliance held beta terminals.  No alliance will want a station they can have their players monitored 24/7.
2.  Decrease in industrial activity on the island.  Who's going to want to undock in something squishy knowing something can undock behind them.
3.  Increased griefing of players wanting to be able to use a beta island.
4.  Beta islands difficultly to hold will increase as, this is important ANY PLAYER will be able to dock and undock characters that can easily scan a sap AND can be used as an entrance onto an island.
5.  Decrease overall Pvp activities.  People will be able to gauge the amount of players they will be able to engage in the terminal.
6.  Makes it more difficult to secure minerals because tanks smaller haulers will have to be used.
7.  Increase rates for epriton, because more logistics to secure loot.
8.  Mission patch will allow for players the access to perform missions without owning a station.

So what emergent game play are we talking?  Offensive Pvp towards beta outpost owners?  That's the only way I see it helping.  Because people don't use betas to production or for anything other than sap farming and mining.  Why don't they use production?  No bonuses there and too easy to lose stability during off time. 

I've listed 8 items that I can see as problems already.  And removing sparks are going to help tremendously.  So can you explain exactly what emergent gameplay your talking about?


Seriously you typed a lot of words just to say "We're afraid of getting scouted."

I think you're been playing this game long enough to know what it was like before the new mechanic changes. We lived with all of that on Norhoop for a long time. None of the stations were locked and that was when the game was most populated. We moved out of norhoop not because of the station getting locked or whoever's name was on it then, but because you could sign up for an intrusion for 1m nic and then not show up, and that part of it sucked. You know how we dealt with eyes in a station? Whenever they undocked they died.

I can't say it would do much good, but I dont think it could do anything worse, there's like 10 people left playing this game. If the change was easy and it got 10 more dudes to play the game then I'm sure doubling the population would be a huge success.


*edit* didn't see this was 7 pages long and my give-a-shit just ran out of fuel.
**double edit** Whoever made that map with the teleports next to the station leading to the outbound is my hero. Implement that NAOW.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

This change (opening beta 1s), would be extremely easy and quick to implement.  So try it and see.  I think it would encourage pvp a little, and I'm all for that.

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

As I already told DEV Zoom, unlocking Beta 1's turns POE's home-island from Fortress Domhalarn into a freeported zone, and provides convenient untouchable staging grounds for anyone looking to launch assaults on our Gamma bases on Kraslovsk.

Furthermore, it forces POE to haul out our massive stockpiles out of Domhalarn, as we've been actively living there and doing industry on Beta there for a very long time, and we like our station income from our industry.

While POE is not the largest alliance in the game and is only comprised of 3 corporations, we still represent a large percentage of the actual active playerbase and as such it would be nice if DEV Zoom at least moved our assets and our Gamma island for us, since this change would effectively be taking away our home - something no entity or alliance in the history of this game ever accomplished.

165 (edited by Burial 2015-07-22 12:27:25)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

The most reasonable way to go with all of the Gamma islands would be to just swap them, unless they plan to drastically change the teleports between Betas/Gammas.

166

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Naismith wrote:

As I already told DEV Zoom, unlocking Beta 1's turns POE's home-island from Fortress Domhalarn into a freeported zone, and provides convenient untouchable staging grounds for anyone looking to launch assaults on our Gamma bases on Kraslovsk.

Furthermore, it forces POE to haul out our massive stockpiles out of Domhalarn, as we've been actively living there and doing industry on Beta there for a very long time, and we like our station income from our industry.

While POE is not the largest alliance in the game and is only comprised of 3 corporations, we still represent a large percentage of the actual active playerbase and as such it would be nice if DEV Zoom at least moved our assets and our Gamma island for us, since this change would effectively be taking away our home - something no entity or alliance in the history of this game ever accomplished.

Moving the assets from Dom to a different beta seems pretty reasonable. Moving the gamma is a little over the top.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that Joke will not be attacking CIR, CHAOS and NSE gamma bases (maybe some of the single terminals but not the big ones) if that helps.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

167

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Am still kind of curious why this is needed? 
And why the islands where active population is most effective ? 

If you open Beta1s that means EVERYONE is less than 4Km to our alliance gamma base.  I didn't even think about that you are literally breathing down the neck of gamma.

No way!  This is a terrible idea.  Your not promoting emergent game play you just want to hinder your enemies from using betas.

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Dev Zoom: I think its time to confess, Ville is my alt
Dev Zoom: Ville can be sometimes so sane it's scary.

168 (edited by Ville 2015-07-22 12:31:22)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:
Naismith wrote:

As I already told DEV Zoom, unlocking Beta 1's turns POE's home-island from Fortress Domhalarn into a freeported zone, and provides convenient untouchable staging grounds for anyone looking to launch assaults on our Gamma bases on Kraslovsk.

Furthermore, it forces POE to haul out our massive stockpiles out of Domhalarn, as we've been actively living there and doing industry on Beta there for a very long time, and we like our station income from our industry.

While POE is not the largest alliance in the game and is only comprised of 3 corporations, we still represent a large percentage of the actual active playerbase and as such it would be nice if DEV Zoom at least moved our assets and our Gamma island for us, since this change would effectively be taking away our home - something no entity or alliance in the history of this game ever accomplished.

Moving the assets from Dom to a different beta seems pretty reasonable. Moving the gamma is a little over the top.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that Joke will not be attacking CIR, CHAOS and NSE gamma bases (maybe some of the single terminals but not the big ones) if that helps.

Now your under my skin.

So two players:  Jita and Burial who don't live on beta, doesn't participate in gamma and performs no industry on beta all of a sudden get this glorious idea to shake up the status quo by ELIMINATING industry on beta??  And "moving all your assets seems pretty reasonable". seriously?  It's perfectly reasonable huh?  It's perfectly reasonable that two players can completely ruin the player experience of the 50+ dudes actively using beta.

I have a prediction:  if you unlock betas ALL THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN is veteran players will sit under stations with shield tanked tyrannos with detectors preventing players from logistically use the outpost while having logged off altos or masked units waiting nearby.

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Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

It would be more reasonable to turn Hersh, Tellesis and Shinjalar into Beta 1 islands with unlocked terminals.

170

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:
Naismith wrote:

As I already told DEV Zoom, unlocking Beta 1's turns POE's home-island from Fortress Domhalarn into a freeported zone, and provides convenient untouchable staging grounds for anyone looking to launch assaults on our Gamma bases on Kraslovsk.

Furthermore, it forces POE to haul out our massive stockpiles out of Domhalarn, as we've been actively living there and doing industry on Beta there for a very long time, and we like our station income from our industry.

While POE is not the largest alliance in the game and is only comprised of 3 corporations, we still represent a large percentage of the actual active playerbase and as such it would be nice if DEV Zoom at least moved our assets and our Gamma island for us, since this change would effectively be taking away our home - something no entity or alliance in the history of this game ever accomplished.

Moving the assets from Dom to a different beta seems pretty reasonable. Moving the gamma is a little over the top.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that Joke will not be attacking CIR, CHAOS and NSE gamma bases (maybe some of the single terminals but not the big ones) if that helps.

Now your under my skin.

So two players:  Jita and Burial who don't live on beta, doesn't participate in gamma and performs no industry on beta all of a sudden get this glorious idea to shake up the status quo by ELIMINATING industry on beta??  And "moving all your assets seems pretty reasonable". seriously?  It's perfectly reasonable huh?  It's perfectly reasonable that two players can completely ruin the player experience of the 50+ dudes actively using beta.

I have a prediction:  if you unlock betas ALL THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN is veteran players will sit under stations with shield tanked tyrannos with detectors preventing players from logistically use the outpost while having logged off altos or masked units waiting nearby.

Well its perfectly possible using current mechanics to be a pain on purpose to stop people enjoying Beta's that are open.

This is something that we talked about last night as it could be an issue. It would have been nice to have you there - i stayed up till midnight to try too - so we don't have to have these politically motivated person and not idea based back and forths but i guess work got in the way. We did try to get people from your 'side' to join with Obi, Race Drones and Sunny representing.

What we spoke about was that just because you can doesn't mean you should or will. Joke will not be using unkillable detector alts under stations because we think its a terrible mechanic that needs work. We however recognize that there's limited dev time and in order of importance we think you should go - having the space to play, having the incentive to play, managing the disincentives to play.

This change creates the space. The roundtable set out some discussions about what those incentives should be (and Zooms post about how some of it is already tabled is encouraging). Once those are either in place or on their way we did plan in a month or two to have a talk again about what the problems are and the best solution for them. Stuff like detector alts. People seeing who is in station. Possible kick from station mechanics. There is a lot that would help.

We've always been clear in saying this change on its own will NOT fix beta. Its a step in the right direction. We are going to put our money where our mouth is and live the idea we have been selling by moving out to a beta 1 station as a corp, giving up the alliance life, doing ALL of our industry there (and not relying on stocks) and even giving up heavy dropping in favor of lower level pvp that is more achievable for everyone. The rewards for doing that arn't amazing right now but if the devs have taken steps to fix things, how can we not take steps to help. We hope that other corps will embrace this too but that's their choice. This is a sandbox game and is as much about the choices people make as it is the mechanics.

One thing everyone who came from all sides agreed is that theres thirty *** people playing this game Ville. This whole back and forth and speaking as corps is absurd, we are all just people trying to play a game that want it to succeed. I'd burn everything i ever did in game for a chance of 150 people on beta again. Please try and drop the political posturing and lets work together to find common ground around the things that we CAN do in a short period of time to help, alongside ofc the devs own goals, in moving this game forward.

I would also like to invite everyone in advance for the next rountable we will be holding at the end of August. Perhaps someone from PHM or CIR could host this time?

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

I'd like to state that we won't make any changes in this particular matter until we don't have a relatively common understanding. Discussion is welcome and encouraged, and with the incoming changes and our new plans you'll probably have a lot more to talk about very soon.

172 (edited by Obi Wan Kenobi 2015-07-22 13:39:17)

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Its not political posturing Jita if some one puts forth a contrary point of view.

I said last night that im willing to bet in 6 months time were back here talking about station locking & why Beta1s need them again.

I've already book marked this post for that very reason. 
But that being said removing locking its self will do nothing for Beta. Beta needs more. but we talked about that.

"I / we told you so"

Give players the choose & added benefits & them them choose what they want to do.



But i am glad I suggested that little TS get together. On other subjects we had a good  flow of ideas & some consensus on a few issues / problems

True Pros make a Podcast to influence the Devs minds, 
The rest of you guys are Hacks tongue

PS. I got my Highways & stopped playing b4 they came in & have never used them! ...... Irony much ? tongue

173

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Doing something to help is better than doing nothing.

The definition of madness is repeating the same actions with the expectation of a different result.

Remember that.

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita wrote:
Ville wrote:
Jita wrote:

Moving the assets from Dom to a different beta seems pretty reasonable. Moving the gamma is a little over the top.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that Joke will not be attacking CIR, CHAOS and NSE gamma bases (maybe some of the single terminals but not the big ones) if that helps.

Now your under my skin.

So two players:  Jita and Burial who don't live on beta, doesn't participate in gamma and performs no industry on beta all of a sudden get this glorious idea to shake up the status quo by ELIMINATING industry on beta??  And "moving all your assets seems pretty reasonable". seriously?  It's perfectly reasonable huh?  It's perfectly reasonable that two players can completely ruin the player experience of the 50+ dudes actively using beta.

I have a prediction:  if you unlock betas ALL THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN is veteran players will sit under stations with shield tanked tyrannos with detectors preventing players from logistically use the outpost while having logged off altos or masked units waiting nearby.

Well its perfectly possible using current mechanics to be a pain on purpose to stop people enjoying Beta's that are open.

This is something that we talked about last night as it could be an issue. It would have been nice to have you there - i stayed up till midnight to try too - so we don't have to have these politically motivated person and not idea based back and forths but i guess work got in the way. We did try to get people from your 'side' to join with Obi, Race Drones and Sunny representing.

What we spoke about was that just because you can doesn't mean you should or will. Joke will not be using unkillable detector alts under stations because we think its a terrible mechanic that needs work. We however recognize that there's limited dev time and in order of importance we think you should go - having the space to play, having the incentive to play, managing the disincentives to play.

This change creates the space. The roundtable set out some discussions about what those incentives should be (and Zooms post about how some of it is already tabled is encouraging). Once those are either in place or on their way we did plan in a month or two to have a talk again about what the problems are and the best solution for them. Stuff like detector alts. People seeing who is in station. Possible kick from station mechanics. There is a lot that would help.

We've always been clear in saying this change on its own will NOT fix beta. Its a step in the right direction. We are going to put our money where our mouth is and live the idea we have been selling by moving out to a beta 1 station as a corp, giving up the alliance life, doing ALL of our industry there (and not relying on stocks) and even giving up heavy dropping in favor of lower level pvp that is more achievable for everyone. The rewards for doing that arn't amazing right now but if the devs have taken steps to fix things, how can we not take steps to help. We hope that other corps will embrace this too but that's their choice. This is a sandbox game and is as much about the choices people make as it is the mechanics.

One thing everyone who came from all sides agreed is that theres thirty *** people playing this game Ville. This whole back and forth and speaking as corps is absurd, we are all just people trying to play a game that want it to succeed. I'd burn everything i ever did in game for a chance of 150 people on beta again. Please try and drop the political posturing and lets work together to find common ground around the things that we CAN do in a short period of time to help, alongside ofc the devs own goals, in moving this game forward.

I would also like to invite everyone in advance for the next rountable we will be holding at the end of August. Perhaps someone from PHM or CIR could host this time?

Alright this might be inflammatory to asset holders but:
With respect to this, would it then make sense to do a 'beta-reset' of sorts?
Meaning, all assets are moved (by devs to make sure all player assets are moved out) out of all beta stations, and beta stations all drop ownership at the time of the 'beta-patch'.  This way, when some stations are 'unlockable' no one particular corp is getting screwed.
This initial phase allows everyone to re-enter beta on a semi-level playing field.  Obviously there is EP, and other accumulated personal assets that may or may not be used.  Leveling this would be full server wipe, and that is a non-starter for a lot of players.

If all Beta-owners agree, this can be a beta-reset to equalize issues during the transition to new ownership mechanics, or types.  It doesnt make sense that some owners would keep their stations, while other don't simply because they were unfortunate enough to pick the wrong island.


Also: invite Inda to the roundtable.  He is a relevant and non-political voice that has been advocating for the game as a whole for years right?

175

Re: A prediction (about outpost locking)

Jita or whom ever is for unlocking.

Can you describe the gains or benefits of unlocking these beta stations? I understand your saying this is step one but what do you foresee as the immediate gains or impact of this change.

Further more, where do you see this growing or being expanded on to support the above points.

I believe a true focus should be on picking apart the pit-falls of beta and other areas that don't support player growth properly. Once Identified a work around or fix can be designed and implemented.

I understand Joke may choose to not leverage cookie-cutter builds to shut players down but it inevitable that a player or group of players take a action that paints them as a target as every group has eventually done in the history of PO.

When the above happens these mechanics will be used against them and they will be victim to it.

My point is what is 'your' dev road map that starts with unlocking betas go to next and what are the steps to create a active and proper beta environment?

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