Topic: Seriously Ore Abuse

Unlimited hdt and Titan orders need to go.  Players are placing afk scarabs and sequers over night on the fields and selling to a bottomless order!  The market needs inflation and deflation and these orders are keeping it up!  I kept 8 scarabs on a field overnight and cashed out 30 million nic this morning!  I did the same thing at work!  This is wrecking the economy!

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2 (edited by Stranger Danger 2014-06-28 05:27:24)

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Whats wrecking the economy is a lack of pvp.  Bots are not getting lost on a large scale every day.

Those buy orders shouldn't even be a factor, but they are, because no one needs ore...people just sit and look at their bots and complain about others all day.

Personally. I want ore to go back to static fields like it use to be, that would make mining everything on beta/gamma ideal.

You cant fix a broken economy when its based on the need for bot loss...if no one wants to play in the sandbox.

But yeah, get rid of those NPC buy orders for liquids asap ...  All that NIC flooding the game will cause inflation.  NIC should only be transferred between parties for ore, not created out of thin air for ore.

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

There is no economy. When was the last time CIR or PHM bought a Robot?

It's all done in corp and it isn't even a bad thing. It's just a different way of doing things.

Very few players can AFK field 8 Scarab and if that only got you 30 mill? It isn't a problem.

4 (edited by Syndic 2014-06-28 08:35:04)

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

CIR's market team has ~50B worth of orders on the market at any given time.

We haven't played the game seriously in 2 years. There's simply no player-demand for bots & mods, as always.

We create the demand for resources. That is shrinking in volume as more people stop playing.

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5 (edited by Skydell 2014-06-28 09:39:47)

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Syndic wrote:

CIR's market team has ~50B worth of orders on the market at any given time.

We haven't played the game seriously in 2 years. There's simply no player-demand for bots & mods, as always.

We create the demand for resources. That is shrinking in volume as more people stop playing.


The scenario describe reflects a new Industrial player in an Argano to me. Two poorly bonused Miners on an unlimited cargo is Noob in an argano, mining in to a can and 16 hrs, AFK or ATK with 8 accounts at 30 mill is 240K Nic/hr. If he cashed in twice? Thats half a mill an hr? They can't nerf that, it's already a joke.

Make a brand new character on a brand new account, simulate newb status and forecast how long it will take you to put 50 billion in a corp wallet. No Gamma exploits, no triangle stockpiles. Current mechanics, current potential. It's a pipe dream. It's great you guys have 50 billion on market but you have seen me working the game. I trade for Epr. I have 50 million Nic.

I keep looking for the light at the end of the tunnel. I see the potential in this game. I also see the amount of time you need to devote to it to become established. "Take longer to do really mundane garbage" like mine HDT and Titan isn't going to encourage, it's going to discourage.

- Added note: I'm not a fool. You guys are discouraged after 2 years and it comes down to, you don't have an equal, you don't have competition in a game that really doesn't offer much else. I don't see that changing any time soon. Even if a thousand new people show up tomorrow, they will need a minimum of 6 months before they are anything but short term entertainment for you guys and I don't know what Devs can do about that without flipping the entire game concept on its ear.

6 (edited by Syndic 2014-06-28 09:51:35)

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

What I was pointing out was that we produce drastically faster then we can sell, therefore there is no incentive for us to buy anything other then resources.

Example;
Fact - We have a single producer dedicated to pure waspish mk2 production - We pump out 10 fully fitted wasp mk2's per day, every day like clockwork.
Argument - Why would we buy wasp mk2's?

More on-topic, if Ville can leave 8 scarab mk2's mining while hes working/sleeping, I can leave 10. Another dude can leave 3. Another 4. Another 2. Another X, Y, Z.

Everything in this game scales with accounts that can be applied to something.

If its not a problem for the Devs - thats fine, our scarabs will mine for us while we work and sleep.

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Syndic wrote:

What I was pointing out was that we produce drastically faster then we can sell, therefore there is no incentive for us to buy anything other then resources.

Example;
Fact - We have a single producer dedicated to pure waspish mk2 production - We pump out 10 fully fitted wasp mk2's per day, every day like clockwork.
Argument - Why would we buy wasp mk2's?

More on-topic, if Ville can leave 8 scarab mk2's mining while hes working/sleeping, I can leave 10. Another dude can leave 3. Another 4. Another 2. Another X, Y, Z.

Everything in this game scales with accounts that can be applied to something.

If its not a problem for the Devs - thats fine, our scarabs will mine for us while we work and sleep.


New people can't do what you are talking about. I think you are forgetting the two years it took you to build Scarab fleets. The two years of unfettered, no loss Industrial to get enough Proto's and CTs to pound out 10 Waspish MK2 a day.

I've been playing this game every day for the past 3 months. I spend 90% of it Artifacting and I have 14 Light Cortex, 10 Assault, I haven't seen a Mech Cortex in over a month and in all the time I have played Perp I have found ONE Heavy Cortex so I call bluff on the 10 MK2  a day. Even if by some miracle you have stockpiled that many Cortex, again, keep in mind everyone else doesn't have unrestricted access to Beta and they never will have by the sounds of things.

So, are you looking to balance or cement your postition as top dog in Perp because it seems the only ones with the assets capable of pounding out this kind of production is the dedicated, two year veteran player base.

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Assaults didn't fit into our doctrines 2-3 years ago, Kains and Artemis' did.

We fought wars for our unfettered Beta access. Nobody handed it to us on a plate, we've been at war with some alliance or other since 18th of February 2011 up to the day a whole lot of corps signed a nice little petition ticket.

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

I've solo mined 1.2 billion HDT this week.  That's 250 million nic completely afk.  It's hardcore broken.

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Ville wrote:

I've solo mined 1.2 billion HDT this week.  That's 250 million nic completely afk.  It's hardcore broken.

Make the beta terminals infinite buy orders 15$ higher then you could cash in even more

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Only in player-controlled bases though, the NPC buy orders in the Beta-1 NPC terminals should be on-par with Alpha-2 islands.

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Yes because that would encourage new people to try to risk something because the people who can get to controlled beta outposts risk less and the people who don't control them have more risk involved to get to an NPC terminal.

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

the only serious issue i see is the lack of red alpha roams... alpha observers RIP

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Annihilator wrote:

the only serious issue i see is the lack of red alpha roams... alpha observers RIP

Another game breaking problem created by 77 and CIR abuse of existing mechanics

Proverbs 23:20-21 warns us, “Do not join those who drink too much wine or gorge themselves on meat, for drunkards and gluttons become poor, and drowsiness clothes them in rags."

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Jita wrote:
Annihilator wrote:

the only serious issue i see is the lack of red alpha roams... alpha observers RIP

Another game breaking problem created by 77 and CIR abuse of existing mechanics

Most fun in game EVER!

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Jita wrote:
Annihilator wrote:

the only serious issue i see is the lack of red alpha roams... alpha observers RIP

Another game breaking problem created by 77 and CIR abuse of existing mechanics

So you want people to have risk from red mobs....but when the red mobs killed them the devs took that mechanic away. I don't follow.

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Syndic wrote:

Assaults didn't fit into our doctrines 2-3 years ago, Kains and Artemis' did.

We fought wars for our unfettered Beta access. Nobody handed it to us on a plate, we've been at war with some alliance or other since 18th of February 2011 up to the day a whole lot of corps signed a nice little petition ticket.

This has nothing to do with what I just said.

- Even if you have 40,000 Billion HDT, Titan and every mined resource in the game, you don't AFK Cortex stocks and you don't AFK Kernal stocks, you don't AFK Fragment stocks, you don't AFK MK2 CT's, you don't AFK Nora, Prismo, Triandlus. And you don't nerf stuff just for exploiters, you nerf it for EVERYBODY. So the new person with the poorly fit Argano making 240K Nic an hr, ATK in game? He needs nerfed too? Because you will nerf him in design.

And no, you did NOT fight never ending wars to have unfettered Access to Beta. You had Gamma, by your own admission, it was a cake walk. You have more Gamma than you had players, you had more Beta than you had players. How many threads have you guys opened crying the bloo-bloo about how there is no PvP? How you tool all the Outposts with no resistance, How can you have so many great wars and not have had PvP?

You talk out of both sides of your mouth. You don't even see the contradictions in everything you say. I've already pointed out, I can see the boredom that drives these complaints but the problem is, you don't see your own flawed thinking.

The only things that are being AFK mined in the billions are Epri, Liquizit and HDT.
Mechanics won't allow you to leave a bot AFK for 8 hrs to mine anyting else. It's all limited by the amount on a tile.

If you guys insist on mining out pool spawns and cashing them in to seeds, the rest of us don't care. We understand the industry well enough to know that even if we do this, even if we are sitting on 80 billion Nic, we can't do anything with it.

10 MK2 Waspish a day you say.
I looked, there is ONE on the market. ONE IN ALL the game. If you guys have that much production capacity, why aren't you selling them at cost? What's worse case sceanario? Someone actually buys them and loses them in a fight with you?

tl:dr you are heckling Devs and I don't know your motives. I can only assume its boredome.

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

You don't understand economic warfare.

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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

its not our fault we dont die


its jitas fault



Skydell wrote:

There is no economy. When was the last time CIR or PHM bought a Robot?

It's all done in corp and it isn't even a bad thing. It's just a different way of doing things.

Very few players can AFK field 8 Scarab and if that only got you 30 mill? It isn't a problem.

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Let me correct you:

"created by the developers game mechanics"


When there are 10,000 people playing at Steam release, everyone and their mom is going to try to find some loophole to kill people on Alpha

You are welcome.


Jita wrote:
Annihilator wrote:

the only serious issue i see is the lack of red alpha roams... alpha observers RIP

Another game breaking problem created by 77 and CIR abuse of existing mechanics

DEV Zoom - "If you mean the NPC aggro, that's been like that for months already."

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

I can only say that you don't even have the facts to operate with your claims.

First of all, there are multiple ways to obtain cortexes, and artifacting is probably the worst of them.

Second, we fought against corporation who fielded UNLIMITED (duped) robots with maximum tiered equipment (t4) while the rest of the server didn't even have the technology, nevermind production, high enough to have those modules. Kernel grind was tens of times worse than now, and even after farming NPCs on beta for 5-6 hours a day for 5 months we had only about 60-70% of tech-tree unlocked.

Third, afterwards we fought against server-wide coalitions who were ready to petition devs on any small issue when they lost a fight. This all happened way before gamma was introduced into the game. Mining beta was a lot more unsafe, alpha mining wasn't endless cash-in, it was nothing like you would compare to the current situation.

Now, if you look at the current situation and compare it, even alpha corporations have a lot more space than before to be competitive enough, however when the problem lies within the leadership of those corporations, there's nothing much we can do roll There are reasons for those complaints such as making beta more attractive for people to actually have a more solid reason to fight for it, but many alpha-scrublings are also pulling the blanket on their side.

I believe pvp could be very exciting and the game has what it takes. But this is game is ruined and we all know  by who, it´s by corps like CiR, -77- and PHM. - by Fu ManChu

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

red npcs have been removed from alpha more then a year ago, because someone said, noobs die to those npcs and ragequit over that.

over time, the same guys who said that, now complain that alpha is afk mining heaven, and some even wonder why there is no real economy, when PVE is supposed to be loss-free, and PvP can only be done when you are able to produce everything on your own (oh, evil corp internal buy orders!), because the alpha market won't supply your demands nor does pvp pay out the currency for that.

oh, almost forgot,
a few veteran player need to be able to supply the alpha market with cheap robots and T4 equip, on all 6 islands with lots of buy/sell orders and spark teleporting to be able to manage all those markets without lots of travel inbetween except for resupplying the terminals with the goods.

all in the name of the new player experience and the future of the game!

*Disclaimer: This post can contain strong sarcasm or cynical remarks. keep that in mind!
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Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Ville wrote:

You don't understand economic warfare.

I understand it better than you think and if there is an economic war to be had in Perp is doesn't revolve around HDT and Titan Ore.

24 (edited by Skydell 2014-06-28 22:20:27)

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Weedy wrote:

I can only say that you don't even have the facts to operate with your claims.

First of all, there are multiple ways to obtain cortexes, and artifacting is probably the worst of them.

Second, we fought against corporation who fielded UNLIMITED (duped) robots with maximum tiered equipment (t4) while the rest of the server didn't even have the technology, nevermind production, high enough to have those modules. Kernel grind was tens of times worse than now, and even after farming NPCs on beta for 5-6 hours a day for 5 months we had only about 60-70% of tech-tree unlocked.

Third, afterwards we fought against server-wide coalitions who were ready to petition devs on any small issue when they lost a fight. This all happened way before gamma was introduced into the game. Mining beta was a lot more unsafe, alpha mining wasn't endless cash-in, it was nothing like you would compare to the current situation.

Now, if you look at the current situation and compare it, even alpha corporations have a lot more space than before to be competitive enough, however when the problem lies within the leadership of those corporations, there's nothing much we can do roll There are reasons for those complaints such as making beta more attractive for people to actually have a more solid reason to fight for it, but many alpha-scrublings are also pulling the blanket on their side.

Here we go with the gerneric, EVE come back "you are doing it wrong" slappy happy claims of failed leadership and other gray area claims of blame.

I see why Zoom keeps deleting these.

Weedy wrote:

I can only say that you don't even have the facts to operate with your claims.

First of all, there are multiple ways to obtain cortexes, and artifacting is probably the worst of them.

Intersting, In game description:



The strange and rare CPU cortexes are used to upgrade data processing. By building them into your robot as a component, you can upgrade its parameters, creating their advanced, Mk2 versions. The exact build-up and working mechanism is still vague, the only way to obtain them is by searching for artifacts.

Cortexes are irrefutable evidences that Nia was once inhabited by a civilization, much more advanced than the three robotic factions that we already know.

Re: Seriously Ore Abuse

Skydell wrote:
Ville wrote:

You don't understand economic warfare.

I understand it better than you think and if there is an economic war to be had in Perp is doesn't revolve around HDT and Titan Ore.

If my spare computer can generate 100 million Nic in a 24 hour cycle.  There's nothing with me completely doing it afk?  I can do more once fast extract gets L10 and mining skills on the alts are at 10.

The infinite orders are too high.  You can literally generate these values in 100% safety.

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