Topic: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

From what i can understand the developers are able to auto generate islands, then can spend somewhat minimal time placing a few outposts.

So why not just add 6-9 more beta islands, place them outside the current beta islands.  This will expand the game world, make being everywhere and seeing everything difficult, allow room for other people to grow ect.

Then spend time making gamma better than what is on the test server.  Everything im told about whats on the test server, and the general opinion from those who have and do break game mechanics, is that gamma on the test server is going to be worse than what it replaced.

So why not make use of your ability to quickly create islands and make beta (hell why not alpha 3 as well?) expansions?

Id rather see gamma done right than to rush it out because the game needs more room. You can always remove some betas at a later date with minimal impact.

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Convert Novaya Trava/Rhaoshan/Davis Barrier into Beta-3 islands that can't be reached by interzone from Alpha (and space the islands a bit further so you can't interzone from Alpha to their Beta-2 entrance teleport).

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

You are beginning to see the light.

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

+1 or even use Gremrods idea of pre terraformed spots for bases.

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

+1!

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

+1

You could just have NPC terminals that allow their holding corp to do terraforming within the same limits as placing walls. Make it so TF is only allowed to be done at 90 and if the terminal reaches the contested level then all TF is reset.

Gives beta terminals a reason to be held and defended.

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

+1

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

I know we harp that we want more content, but in reality we want functioning content that's not going to get wiped in 2 years.  I would prefer that you took your time(ish) polished a system that you think will work optimally.  Even if numbers are fading some, you can always do that fancy update information thingy on Steam so peeps will stream back in when stuffs up and during the meantime the tried and true will continue clipping along.  Like we did when there was 50 people playing.

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9 (edited by Rage Blackout 2014-06-20 18:33:27)

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

like +

make it so you have place the outpost

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

And at zero the outpost flags and the enemys can kill it or take it over for themselves

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Burial wrote:

You are beginning to see the light.

...or accepting the darkness

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.

13 (edited by Rage Rex 2014-06-21 04:38:36)

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

DEV Zoom wrote:

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.

I sincerely appreciate the transparent response to the work involved in creating what seems a SINGLE new Beta island. That kind of information goes miles and miles to discussion ideas on the forums. Clearly my hope (fantasy) for 99 islands is years away under current production capacity.

I just wish you would now at least give us more info on what is happening with Gamma, as it's very clear from this single golden nugget of info that Beta Utopia is far from the light.

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Rage Rex wrote:
DEV Zoom wrote:

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.

I sincerely appreciate the transparent response to the work involved in creating what seems a SINGLE new Beta island. That kind of information goes miles and miles to discussion ideas on the forums. Clearly my hope (fantasy) for 99 islands is years away under current production capacity.

I just wish you would now at least give us more info on what is happening with Gamma, as it's very clear from this single golden nugget of info that Beta Utopia is far from the light.

+1

John 3:16 - Timothy 2:23

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

DEV Zoom wrote:

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.

Im guessing creating a Gamma island takes way less time?

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

DEV Zoom wrote:

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.




Why does all betas need stations and outposts? cant we have some islands that have no stations/outpost wuld create morre space btw conqurable islands tongue

i never relly noticed much of decoration other than teleport and some random structures that have no use to players o0

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Estamel Tharch0n wrote:

Why does all betas need stations and outposts? cant we have some islands that have no stations/outpost wuld create morre space btw conqurable islands tongue

i never relly noticed much of decoration other than teleport and some random structures that have no use to players o0

Its a design decision by the DEVs to not do stuff like "copy&paste island, give it another name" like some have suggested to create beta versions of Alpha islands.
Its their definition of what a "Beta Island" has to have.

to go with this design defintions,
Beta 1 islands are those with a Terminal and 3 outposts and missions.
Beta 2 islands are those with only two Outposts and no missions
Beta 3 Islands could be those with minimalistic Niani infrastructure

The Automatic map generator only generates the land profile based on some noise shaders. everything else is done by the DEVs in manual labour with almost the same tools player had for beacon terraforming.
The decorational building placement probably is manual placement and rotation, and eventually automatic "blocked terrain" painting with manual tweaking.
Though, the terrain of tellesis was obviously partially painted in photoshop for the hexagon shapes.

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

When the 24 gamma islands were introduced, it was at a time, when there were too few player to populate even 33% of these islands reasonable. The only good point on having that much island that ever corp could select an island by several criterias.
At the moment I don't think we have enough population to use all 6 beta islands on a reasonable base. The only benefit on adding more islands would be that it is easier for some to hide.
But in fact I think that has more cosmetical effect on getting help fighting symptoms instead of help fighting the source of why it is needed to have enough islands to provide places to hide.

19 (edited by Kaldenines 2014-06-21 11:29:28)

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

DEV Zoom wrote:

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.

A whole new, fully decorated, beta island being added to the game every month.  That would actually be awesome.  Six months of that would surely be more new content than we have had in the last year.

EDIT: oh and you can keep the NPCs to a minimum, nobody likes them anyway smile

+1
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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Kaldenines wrote:

...
EDIT: oh and you can keep the NPCs to a minimum, nobody likes them anyway smile

yep, indeed - thats what i heard too. And thats why its suddenly such a big deal when they do not drop loot. fuuu

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Tbh I think adding three beta III islands a month or two would be freakin sweet. As a new bro I really like the challenge beta presents and the potential benifits. The sap mechanics are decent and the ability to use squad based PvP and roams is getting objectives is great. Either spark Tele needs a small tweak to stop people from covering all three corners of the betas (no this doesnt stop multiple accounts but that is fine, mechanics shouldn't be worked around the basis of needing multiple accounts) so easily or there needs to be enough space so a single character can't cover it all. I also like gremrods post about a beta iii with specific areas for mpcs. Awesome content here that could be implimented even if most of your engine makes everything hardcoded in and inflexible.

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

DEV Zoom wrote:

Yes, we can create the TERRAIN quite efficiently. But that's like 5% of the content that makes up a playable island. It needs terminals and outposts, highways, NPC spawns laid out, artifact configurations, at least some minimal decoration, and so on. We're looking easily at 3-4 weeks for an island and then we're not doing anything else.


That's why you hire devs and artists to be a team specifically for these tasks. Don't do it all yourself because then it ends up being half assed without even meaning to be. This game might be your baby but if you don't hire and delegate this game will continue to struggle.

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Key question that the Devs should be asking themselves is why should players be risking assets necessary to stake claim to Beta/Gamma, instead of simply staying on Alpha.

As the current situation evidently shows, the vast majority doesn't consider Beta to be worth investing and risking assets necessary to take it. So whatever incentives might be there, evidently they're not enough and need to be increased or expanded.

Gamma will be in an even worse position since it will require significantly more investment asset-wise and bear more risk (destroyable terminals), but the incentives can be summed up as 10-15% better facilities and all 3 color plasma NPC buy orders. The solution obviously cannot be moving epriton back to Gamma, that would be just childish.

The only thing more islands will do is provide space for people to hide/ninja-mine, it won't solve the root of the problem - the potential gains are not worth the actual effort required.

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Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

Syndic wrote:

Key question that the Devs should be asking themselves is why should players be risking assets necessary to stake claim to Beta/Gamma, instead of simply staying on Alpha.

As the current situation evidently shows, the vast majority doesn't consider Beta to be worth investing and risking assets necessary to take it. So whatever incentives might be there, evidently they're not enough and need to be increased or expanded.

Gamma will be in an even worse position since it will require significantly more investment asset-wise and bear more risk (destroyable terminals), but the incentives can be summed up as 10-15% better facilities and all 3 color plasma NPC buy orders. The solution obviously cannot be moving epriton back to Gamma, that would be just childish.

The only thing more islands will do is provide space for people to hide/ninja-mine, it won't solve the root of the problem - the potential gains are not worth the actual effort required.


The reason betas aren't being contested  because there isn't anyone to contest them, not lack of incentive. This is my opinion of course. I am part of the next biggest group that could contest the current beta owners but aside from us I don't know of any group who could/would contest them.

Re: Add more beta islands, wait on gamma

There's plenty of people and groups to contest Beta islands.

The problem is noone sees any tangible incentive to go through the effort of taking a Beta, and risk losing some assets over it.

Epriton is the only reason to go there, and you don't need a station for that.

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